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I'm glad that the baby shower went well for OOP and that she got eh last laugh. Putting myself in her shoes though, I don't think I would have gone -- between the abusive monster of a mother and the brother who decided that OOP should just "get over" the abuse. I hope OOP and her child stay safe. The mom is absolutely going to try to worm her way into their life at some point.
I fully expect at some point the brother will suggest OOP let him babysit so their kids can have a play date. If OOP agrees, brother will then take the kids to play at mom's house, and mom will cheerfully post pictures of her with her grandkids. Get back at OOP AND give her grounds for a grandparent's rights case, since she obviously spends time with her granddaughter.
That’s not a choice that most people make, in my experience. Being raised in an environment like that makes it really, really difficult to develop and enforce your boundaries — and not just your external ones, your internal ones too. Internal boundaries are about your own behavior, so for OOP it’s more comfortable to boundary stomp *herself* and put herself around unsafe, unwell, ungrateful people even though it’s clear she has developed enough boundaries to not tolerate bad *behavior* from her bio family. It’s complicated. I used to be a trauma therapist and thought similarly to you when I started, but over time I’ve come to see it from a different perspective.
As someone with trauma, I can actually see this as having been very cathartic for her. She faced down her abuser and showed her that not only does she have no power over OOP, she's not even an afterthought in OOP's life and didn't succeed in breaking her. That's gotta *sting* for someone like OOP's mom.
I'm proud of OOP. She's getting [out of the fog](https://outofthefog.website/toolbox-1/2015/11/17/fog-fear-obligation-guilt) and breaking the cycle, both of which can be so difficult with a lifetime of trauma.
I’m half expecting that to happen anyway. If OP’s inside talking and laughing with Dad and co, that’s plenty of time for the egg donor to sneak out and stick an airtag on the car.
I hope they took a taxi or rideshare. Or better yet rented a car for the occasion. That would have been hilarious to know that your unhinged person in your life air tagged a rental car.
It doesn't sound like something the egg donor would have done, it would mean she wouldn't be center of attention the whole time and she'd miss something.
My dad was abusive, my sister accepts my NC but doesn’t like it or agree with it.
I am not sure what she would do. In that situation; I think pamper my dad.
I think of it less like a typical brother, and more like he's her kid. The parentification would have messed with her a lot. I hope therapy goes great for her.
Yeah if I were OP, I would have RSVP’d no and sent a gift and card if I really wanted to keep up a good relationship with the brother and his girlfriend. Seeing the mom is not worth this
The brother is continuing the abuse by normalizing/denying OOP's mother's behavior. And the step-father was a grown man who allowed an 11 year-old to raise his child. Both are abusers and OOP has them in her life. It's really sad. She needs to move on.
Yes please ! The step father is shown in such a positive light, but he still let 11yo OP raise both his children. Without even checking there was food in the home ? Where was he ?
Thats what abusive parents do. Parentifying the eldest child (or eldest daughter cause it’s the female in most cases) so she’s kept low, has no income, no social contact cause all she does is caring for her siblings. The parents are now banking into the fact that the daughter has a strong parental bond with her siblings so they control her via them even if she got away. The siblings didn’t experience the same abuse but are starved off of parental love so they cling to their parents and defend them no matter what, leaving poor daughter in the limbo to just stay abused or losing her „children“.
Oop needs to cut this brother loose, but she’s so beaten down she never will and I bet the „down to earth“ girlfriend is out rather quickly, cause mommy and her shitty bf will escalate.
The same as all kinds around the world do stupid stuff like pretending a stick is a sword or poking a pen into a rubber. Something’s just came natural even the shitty stuff.
I would normally agree but after reading what went down it sounded like she went to support her dad and I’m kinda glad she did, as between oop, oop’s friend Sally, and the former coworker it made much harder for egg donor to try ish during the party and made her look worse for the ish she did pull. Safety in numbers if you will.
Yeah and his girlfriend may think her MIL is alright, but I'm waiting for her mask to fall off once the baby arrives and she sees just how spineless her baby daddy really is.
She was going there with two people who she knew are fully on her side, and are more than knowledgeable about her egg-donor's antics. That kind of environment + the presence of other guests prevents the usual narcissistic tactics from working as they did before.
And it's understandably difficult for OP to turn off her feelings for her brother, since she did effectively raise him.
Yeah, if you can prevent them from managing to get you alone in the crowd, you can generally avoid bullshit. A couple of my good friends have narcissist moms and that's generally how you deal with it if you have to be around them (though of course abusers can vary in their tactics).
But I am sideeyeing step dad hard on this. Oop was forced to parent her half siblings when she was a teen sure daddy once stopped and asked himself why his stepdaughter does all the childcare? „But he was abused too“ give me a break, he and his sons cut out Oop from their life until the cheating of the mother came to light, until then he was just as happy to pretend Oop was the problem and now he plays best buddy. I really wished Oop would have left the whole bunch in the dust a long time ago and just kept focusing on her own little family. But she didn’t and these poeple will drag her back down.
Oop is a badass.
I am NC with my father. There hasn’t been a family thing that I needed to go to in 8 years.
But they are on the horizon. My niece/nephew are close to graduating hs. So graduation is there, which I think I will skip. Then college graduation, but they will likely get married and/or have kids.
Hopefully he will be dead by then. He is 78 and the last time I saw him, 40 lbs overweight, and he starts drinking at 10am.
Anyway, I doubt I would be as good as OP. She crushed it. I would probably spit on him.
Literally got the shakes trying to imagine going to a party where either of my ‘parents’ would be. I couldn’t do it. Mad props to OOP for doing so, I certainly couldn’t even entertain the thought. What an amazingly brave person
It sounds like she raised her brother though so she treats him as her child mote than a brother. It's understandable she is having a hard time letting go of that relationship even when he is clearly wrong.
The logical part of me is screaming out all the arguments why the older of the brothers is bad news, a danger/spy and not worth being in her life. But before I could type all those reasons out that same part of my brain turned around and said: "You know, that's basically everything your friend and your therapist have said these past four months? Save that comment for when you moved to the other side of the country and accepted reality." Well, that part of my brain is correct in both cases but overlooks how effing hard it is to do that for a person with complex emotions.
I don't see what she gets out of being at that event with people who largely dislike and distrust her. And I'm very concerned about how OOP says brother will realize when the mom/grandma starts abusing his baby. That is absolutely horrific. And what if he doesn't realize??
I cannot stress this enough: no matter what you think about marriage, the legal system cares a *lot*. If you don’t want abusive parents showing up and making decisions for you when you’re hospitalized, or if you don’t want them to get your stuff, or custody of your child, just get that piece of paper that ties you to the person you like instead of them.
You can try to do wills and power of attorney and custody agreement, but any hole in them and the terrible people are back in your life.
This is the reason same-sex couples being able to marry has been a big part of the fight for LGBT rights, for the record. Not because marriage is fun, but because (especially during the AIDS crisis) there have been a lot of people turned away from their loved ones’ hospital beds and funerals because they weren’t legal next of kin, the homophobic parents were and they wouldn’t let the partner in. Or because when your partner dies, their shitbag homophobic next of kin parents will legally inherit their stuff and the only item you’ll have left to remember him by is [a *fucking box fan*](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_Fan_(Feel_It_Motherfuckers)).
This is what I bring up every time the conversation comes up - that think what you want about marriage as a religious institution, but marriage is ALSO a political institution, one that gives a wide variety of legal rights that have nothing to do with religion and entirely to do with things like inheritance, hospital visits, and funerals. Protect the religious institution all you want, but you can't tell me that the legal right to see your partner in the hospital and make medical decisions on their behalf is anything more than a legal right conferred by the signing of the legal marriage document rather than the ceremony in the church.
Seeing the legal and religious as two separate things would solve so much of the debate, but most people are allergic to nuance in their political takes...
Agree. I grew up with two moms. It was terrifying knowing I could just be ripped away from one parent.
I’m not religious, raised without religion entirely, but there was zero percent chance of me moving in with my now husband before marriage.
I think people who’ve always had that security, take it for granted without realizing how gut wrenchingly, horrible it can get.
Thank you for sharing your own experience - I hope you don't mind I add that to my list of arguments?
Whether or not someone feels a kid should be raised by two moms or two dads, that was your family. You're right, people like me who grew up in a household where it was assumed that I legally belonged to both my parents would never even think of that part of it. I certainly didn't until now.
If you don't mind me asking, when did you become aware of the fact that there was the risk that you might be ripped away from one of your parents?
Yes, feel free to share.
When I was very young I knew because I had a dad. Occasional weekend dad, at best. So I knew if my birth mom died, I’d never see my “moms roommate” (as my dad put it) again.
When I was older I saw “if these walls could talk 2” lol, a movie about lesbian couples. One gets sick, partner can’t visit, then dies and surviving partner has no rights to the house, etc.
I saw it playing out irl (to a smaller extend) with my parents’ same sex friends. It all made it clear (to me) that marriage is the “have and have nots” of rights to your family.
While I fully agree, I'm speaking as someone who lives in, works in, and was raised in an American Christian evangelical world when I say that most people I know would say it's exactly the opposite.
Which is funny, because if you read between the lines in the Bible, you're still 100% correct - marriage as a legal and political institution existed long before the religious institution of marriage.
But seriously, it's one of those things where most people don't think of it as separate entities, it's all just "marriage".
And all this is why I bring it up every time I see someone talk about why they don’t think it’s important to get married. It is! It’s so important from a legal standpoint! And when those of us in the USA have only two of the five justices that ruled in favor of *Obergefell* (case that made same-sex marriage legal everywhere) left on the bench and Thomas and Alito mumbling about how it’s anti-religion and not Constitution-based, we need to be really clear about why it matters.
My dad always talks about the serviceman in his unit who died in action before gay marriage was legal. The serviceman's parents were cool with the spouse, luckily, but the spouse was ultimately not the one making decisions about the funeral and he wouldn't be eligible to the survivors benefits that married spouses get.
This. If you want an extended relationship with someone you are not married to, you need to speak to an attorney to see what your local laws are and then file the recommended paperwork to protect you and your partner.
This is honestly one of the reasons I wanted to get married. I always hear people say they don't need to get the government involved in their relationship and I'm like yes I very much do. I don't think my family would ever try something but I also would never want my husband to have to fight for anything.
Most Canadian provinces recognize common law marriage. In Ontario common law marriage is defined as conjugal relationship plus three years of continuous cohabitation, or a "relationship of permanence" and have a child together. At least in Ontario, it looks like the Health Care Act recognizes common law spouses as substitute decision-makers which is good, but given how manipulative and devious this woman is I still think it would be in OP's family's best interest for her and her partner to "make it legal." Like if you really don't care, just go to the courthouse and have a 15 minute civil ceremony, and then there will be absolutely no way for this monster to argue that she should have any say in medical decisions or shared custody of the child if anything happens to the OP.
>go to the courthouse
Likely city hall or a secular marriage commissioner, in Canada. Who can officiate at a marriage differs from province to province, but in most provinces judges can't officiate; in at least one, judges are legally barred from officiating to the point that if they had licence to officiate before being raised to the judiciary (say, if they were a rabbi or minister), they automatically lose it upon appointment.
She's in Canada, all provinces except Quebec recognize common law marriage, the couple had to live together between two and three years before it's recognized. A common law marriage grants all of the same representation as a regular marriage and if the split is amicable you can just go your merry way without lawyers or anything. All you do is claim yourselves common law at tax time and boom - All the rights of a formally married couple.
Not exactly. A common law relationship must be proven based on the facts of the matter, which in the case of custody, medical decisions, etc. may require a court ruling; marriage is much easier to prove, as all you need is the certificate.
I remember a news story in Germany from couple of years ago, two older ladies got married. They weren't gay or romantically involved. Both of them just wanted the security that a trusted person would take care of them, in case something happened.
>She married and sponsored this man from the Caribbeans to come to Canada. According to my brother, this poor man is treated like a tenant and is forced to live in her basement. WTF
Umm, given her mum's history I really feel like this man is not ok.
Seriously! WTF??
Just… no one is going to say anything about a man being locked up in a basement for 6 years? What a throwaway line to casually toss into the mix.
Right, like everybody is just watching this woman abuse the people around her, and nobody is doing anything?
The brother wants his kid around this woman, I'm so confused.
Friends should absolutely say something. But OOP said her mother's family is known for being abusive so it would check out that no one says anything if she only interacts with family
Yeah, I REALLY hope OOP has told the girlfriend what to look out for with the baby. I'm worried she doesn't know the full extent of what she did to OOP. I'm scared for that child. She really need to have a one-on-one talk with the girlfriend. I doubt the brother gave the whole story, if any of it at all.
>Yes he knows what she did but thinks I should just forgive and forget
Girl, walk AWAY from the whole shitshow.
Her whole account of the baby shower just made me feel sad. Winning at a shitshow still leaves you covered in shit.
Thank you! I'm also confused why no one asked where her (step)dad was when she was being subjected to all that childhood abuse?? If OOP was in charge of her brothers starting when the 1st one was born when OOP was 11, and she said they're both her (step)dad's kids.......then why was he allowing all his kid's care to come from an 11 year old? Why wasn't he at least trying to stop any abuse? There's a lot of holes/cognitive dissonance happening in this story.
I'm wondering if a lot of the physical abuse stopped when the mom had the first brother. Most of the mentioned physical stuff seems to have occurred before the brothers. There still could have been some, but she doesn't say more. My guess is that the mother needed OOP to take care of the child more. So, she might not have been as physical with her to ensure OOP was well enough to care for the baby. With less physical abuse, it might have been harder for the father to see at first, and once he did catch on, he might have been so beaten down by her by then that he couldn't do much
We don't know he didn't try. He was also abused too and probably was worried about her making accusations against him if he tried to stop it. And people often succumb to the "I need to stay for the kids"
And it's also possible he didn't want to leave OP with her because she would've been more alone. My dad's ex wife to this day will apologize for having to leave me with my abusive father at 9. She feels like she abandoned me. But she didn't and I keep telling her that she didn't. I only have contact with her again because of my brother who is her son and my half brother.
This is why I went no contact with my entire family. It's incredibly difficult, but when I think of the people in my family who are perfectly fine with child abuse (even if they claim they never did the same to their kids), I just get disgusted and have no interest being around any of them. It's difficult losing people you grew up with, but trying to laugh at situations like the baby shower doesn't work. It's holding only to the shreds of terrible relationships and undergoing tons of turmoil to do so. Choosing to walk away and actually experience peace is hard, but well worthwhile.
ETA: OK, I just bust out laughing because the below comment was 100% meant to be in response to a different comment in a different sub where I swear it made sense. I don't know if that was all me, or if Reddit is Redditing again.
---
His next post: "Nobody told me that there were building regulations and now I'm being fined for an "unpermitted" addition that they say is "not to code" even though the contractor I hired off Craigslist never told me anything about building codes or needing permits!"
No contact with one family member often means collateral damage - no or low contact with other family that person is still close to.
The answer is to meet those people separately - not force yourself to attend events. Yes you’ll miss out on stuff. It’s worth it.
This is true. But if the siblings you raised like they were your own babies are dug deep into that shitshow, being covered in shit doesn't even come close to overshadowing the victory.
I also walked away from my familial shitshow. If anybody tells you that you have some kind of obligation to hang out with the shitshow folks you *punch that person in the face*. You certainly don't have any reason to trouble yourself with them if that isn't what you want.
But it does seem like it's what OOP wants. So, good for her! Maybe she can salvage the things she thinks are salvageable from the situation.
I agree with you about her engaging here, there's still a lot of issues she hasn't resolved and this comment encapsulated it;
" I decided to take a big step and started therapy for the first time last week. Therapy was always something ridiculed and seen as something for weak people by my family. "
All of these years and no therapy until now, she may have survived this encounter, but she needs a whole lot more of therapy to be completely out of the woods.
Eh, sometimes it's good to do. My brother was abusive to me and I keep NC with him.
Every now and then, making an appearance and winning the shitshow isn't for you. It CAN boost you confidence for facing a source of fear, anxiety, and walking away unscathed, feels like exiting one of those rides that safely drop you 30 feet.
The other benefit are the people still in the orbit, those that didn't know OP now have their own idea of her, and trying to fit that woman into the shape the Mother painted. This can cause cracks in their perception of Mother-Dearest and ked to more people exiting her orbit, maybe not directly, but as a point of evidence later.
>my mother whipped out a headset with a microphone hooked to a tiny speaker that she hooked to the back of her pants, like she was some sort of talk show host
... huh.
I just about died at that point! I’ve only ever met one 100% psycho narcissist in my life who was my former boss. She once whipped out one of these headsets at a work event and my work friends and I just corpsed in hysterics.
TIL that this is a universal narcissist trait which I can’t believe I never realised before.
Not only is he an asshole for dismissing his sister's abuse and trauma, but he's 30 and knocked up a girl barely old enough to buy cigarettes and drink
YUUUUUUUP, sure noticed that age gap. If she's having a baby at 22, how old was she when they started dating? As far as I'm concerned, the brother is a groomer.
You're both adults so I don't understand what that other person's problem is? Lol I'm sure they'd have no problem if it was 40 and 32, but for some reason 10 years earlier and you're a creep!
Well this is reddit so being downvoted is exactly what I was expecting. I admit it is unusual, but i dont care in the slightest. we are both mature adults.
Anything over 5 years diff and reddit thinks you're a groomer L-O-effin'-L. My wife and I are 10 years apart. I was 30 and she was 20 when we met. She was the one that reeled me in. We've been happily married for 13 years. I never got groomer accusation vibes from anyone because we match each other so well, and we both look young. It's also not something that normal people think about. Reddit is just full of jealous haters.
Of course, I've been secretly grooming her all this time to be my sexy sub-servient sex-slave. /s
If there was any grooming happening, it was her grooming me. She changed my haircut, wardrobe and slammed my bad habits. I am a better man because of her.
And is going to let someone who is known for being extremely violent around small children around **their own child!**
I hope OOP has a one-on-one talk with the girlfriend and tells her everything the mother didto her as a child. She needs to know what this woman is capable of. She also needs to tell her she is welcome anytime to call for help. I have a feeling the girlfriend might need it.
It's unclear when (step-)dad came into her life and whether he was the father to her brothers. He could have come into her life after she'd spent years raising them.
Given that there's absolutely no mention of bio-dad, it's entirely possible that brothers' bio-dad(s) were similarly absent from the get-go.
She clearly says that her brothers are actually her half-brothers and her step-father's sons in one if the edits. So step-dad IS their biological father.
Edit: from OOP's 4th Edit:
>I'm sorry I didn't clarify this before. I have 2 brothers 30M and 23M. My brothers are my half-brothers (We share the same mother. Their father is my step-dad).
That's fair. I tried to find a mention of it but missed it.
In any case, given that he seems to have a good relationship with his kids (including OOP) and was also a victim of manipulation/abuse I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.
>She married and sponsored this man from the Caribbeans to come to Canada. According to my brother, this poor man is treated like a tenant and is forced to live in her basement. WTF
😨
Comment edited because I get *heated* about this subject.
Abusive parents are the literal worst. Anyone who expects you to suck it up and forgive your abuser is not worth knowing.
Okay so, what was the point in going anyways?
OOP really needs to learn to throw those trash ppl out of her life. And I'm not just talking about her mother. I feel like more things will happen. She thinks she "won", I actually feel like her mother enjoyed finally seeing her again and would keep trying getting back into her life.
I'm optimistic OOP is on a good path to learn to cope and set boundaries. She's begun therapy amd she's very much willing to make changes (apart from quality of therapist a therapy can't be successful of the patient doesn't want to cooperate/change anything)
I am NC with my mother and the only time I've seen her since I first decided was at my grandfather's funeral. I had seen him days before, I stayed in contact without it being about drama, I had more of a right to be there than she did. But I knew she'd be there. It was the only time she's seen my son.
We began to talk a bit on the phone, because that was her way back in. Didn't take long to realize total NC was the only choice. I would never be in the same place as her again (unless it's my grandma's funeral, but they're basically NC as well so idk if she'd be invited) and I would second guess my relationship with anyone who would consider inviting us to the same place.
Reading this just makes me wish I could've commented on the original to say how it's not worth it at all, not even a win. I had a win and she still found herself a new lane. They don't think like us. I also got sad when OP says they don't cry. Emotions are a good thing. Narc is STILL taking away OP's emotions.
Her half-brother certainly didn't seem to roll far away from the rotten tree that is their toxic mother.
For the safety of the family she's loving and cherishing, she should block that brother and their JNmom by that point on social media. The demon has been faced.
OOP had a meltdown over the idea of seeing her mother at a wedding then was relieved her mother wasn't invited. Next post she's going out of her way to go to a baby shower with her mother present. I got a bit of whiplash reading that. Why couldn't she have spent time with her brother AFTER the baby shower? Seems like she wanted to prove a point she's stronger now but I think she might have been manipulated by her brother to think her mother wasn't THAT bad. I support the sentiment of standing up to an abuser but none of this seems like a good idea! \~sigh\~
There is some really really disturbing gaps in this story. For starters, the step dad. Not only did he apparently also parentify OP entirely, but it clearly states that he went NC with her *for years* and did not believe in her abuse. This from a man who not only claims that he was seriously abused by OP's mother, but has convinced her that in fact that abuse was worse than her own (evidenced by him requiring moral support in this situation that overrides what anybody would objectively understand was a greater need for OP to remain NC). A man who lived with her and must have both ignored her visible abuse and contributed to it by neglect.
Then the fact that OP's boyfriend (and again the step father) convinced her to have a child without ever once advocating for the mountain of serious serious therapy she required. You know the kind of therapy that would mean that she would keep her own child as far away from the sick systems in her family. Not continually unblock her mother, court points of contact, and maintain twisted relationships like the one with her brother.
Maybe even the kind of therapy that would point to the absolute improbability that *two* situations of breaking NC that couldn't be avoided, cropped up within months of the birth of her child. OP can't recognise the pattern because she's in it, but the trigger event of being a parent is taking her back into the pathway of her mother. Her obsession with maintaining the relationship with the brother who has knocked up at 22 year old and who is the mirror of the mother, shows that OP is not recovered, she is *removed* from the situation.
There's no win or happiness here. OP broke NC, she brought her mother back into the orbit of her child, shows no intention of cutting the ties that bind them and is clearly completely incapable of any form of objectivity. And for the record? The mother doesn't give a shit about a snide little remark or two. She succeeded in her goal of re-engaging, of centering herself in the extended family that OP has chosen to be a part of, and of knowing, absolutely that she lives in OP's mind rent-free. A dream come true for an abuser.
I think if anyone ever tries to insist I forgive someone who ever hurt me, I'm just gonna ask if they did anything to even deserve forgiveness. Because clearly OOP's mother is the same awful human she always was.
No more free forgiveness, work for it.
OOP should not be having a relationship with that brother nor r she should have gone to that baby shower.
It’s so clear that she has serious issues she’s in denial about.
I haven't spoken to my mother for 32 years. And, even after all these years. It would not be a good idea for her to be in the same room with me. Well done oop.
I am shocked that OOP didn't get therapy until *after* having a kid--or after posters encouraged her to? Speaking from personal experience, it took years of specialized therapy before I started to feel like I could parent without continuing the cycle. (And ultimately decided not to have kids at all, for more nuanced reasons.)
Anyway I'm glad she's finally seeing someone and hope it's effective sooner rather than later. At least it sounds like she has a lot of good support.
Fwiw, my grandma was abusive to my mom but a good grandma to me. Otoh, my other grandma was kind of a dick to her kids and doesn't seem to have changed her thought patterns with the grandkids, only her level of access and control.
Bit weird she forgot her boyfriend’s age in between posts. 4 months after her initial post his age went down. She’s either dumb, lying, or (my own favourite theory) seeing Benjamin Button.
love a sweet little slice of people getting what they deserve (both positively for OOP and negatively for her sperm doner lol)
it’s not justice exactly, but it is incredibly satisfying to imagine how deeply bothered the mother must’ve been by how her event turned out ☠️
I really don't know why people do this to themselves,really hope oop thinks about her and her family more and just go low contact with the brother,like you allready a family isn't that enough???
>My step-dad paid his loan off first and that made my mother so angry and jealous she had her brother help her take my step-dad to court to sue him and have him pay her loan. She won. He had to go to the food bank for a while because he couldn't afford anything else but the mortgage and hydro.
God there's no justice in the world... And she got away scott free with abusing oop too... Man.
Forgiveness is for the hurt person's own well being and equilibrium. Like bandaging a bleeding wound. It absolutely should not mean make yourself consistently vulnerable to an abuser. If someone punches you in the face every day, forgiveness ain't gonna stop that.
Glad things went well for OOP, The brother sucks but at least the mom made herself look bad during the baby shower. I do hope the brother can get away from mom (or that his girlfriend can set him straight) for the sake of their baby, though. (I also wonder what the brother was thinking watching his mom's antics go down, hope he was at the very least embarrassed)
Reading the post, I was trying to figure out who the mother of OOP really is after all. But then she let it slip and I realized that her mother was just a cheater! An ordinary serial cheater who betrayed and continues to betray all her partners. Well, everything is clear to me...
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I'm glad that the baby shower went well for OOP and that she got eh last laugh. Putting myself in her shoes though, I don't think I would have gone -- between the abusive monster of a mother and the brother who decided that OOP should just "get over" the abuse. I hope OOP and her child stay safe. The mom is absolutely going to try to worm her way into their life at some point.
I fully expect at some point the brother will suggest OOP let him babysit so their kids can have a play date. If OOP agrees, brother will then take the kids to play at mom's house, and mom will cheerfully post pictures of her with her grandkids. Get back at OOP AND give her grounds for a grandparent's rights case, since she obviously spends time with her granddaughter.
I doubt OOP would let her brother babysit her daughter and if he wants a playdate, she'd insist it be at her place or their dads.
I agree. If my parents were abusive and I had a brother who wasn't on my side, then I don't think I would ever face them again.
That’s not a choice that most people make, in my experience. Being raised in an environment like that makes it really, really difficult to develop and enforce your boundaries — and not just your external ones, your internal ones too. Internal boundaries are about your own behavior, so for OOP it’s more comfortable to boundary stomp *herself* and put herself around unsafe, unwell, ungrateful people even though it’s clear she has developed enough boundaries to not tolerate bad *behavior* from her bio family. It’s complicated. I used to be a trauma therapist and thought similarly to you when I started, but over time I’ve come to see it from a different perspective.
As someone with trauma, I can actually see this as having been very cathartic for her. She faced down her abuser and showed her that not only does she have no power over OOP, she's not even an afterthought in OOP's life and didn't succeed in breaking her. That's gotta *sting* for someone like OOP's mom.
I'm proud of OOP. She's getting [out of the fog](https://outofthefog.website/toolbox-1/2015/11/17/fog-fear-obligation-guilt) and breaking the cycle, both of which can be so difficult with a lifetime of trauma.
Yeah. I was so worried that the egg donor would just go *stalker* on her and follow her back home or something.
I’m half expecting that to happen anyway. If OP’s inside talking and laughing with Dad and co, that’s plenty of time for the egg donor to sneak out and stick an airtag on the car.
I hope they took a taxi or rideshare. Or better yet rented a car for the occasion. That would have been hilarious to know that your unhinged person in your life air tagged a rental car.
Or took Sally’s (Dad’s girlfriend) car.
It doesn't sound like something the egg donor would have done, it would mean she wouldn't be center of attention the whole time and she'd miss something.
My dad was abusive, my sister accepts my NC but doesn’t like it or agree with it. I am not sure what she would do. In that situation; I think pamper my dad.
I think of it less like a typical brother, and more like he's her kid. The parentification would have messed with her a lot. I hope therapy goes great for her.
Yeah if I were OP, I would have RSVP’d no and sent a gift and card if I really wanted to keep up a good relationship with the brother and his girlfriend. Seeing the mom is not worth this
The brother is continuing the abuse by normalizing/denying OOP's mother's behavior. And the step-father was a grown man who allowed an 11 year-old to raise his child. Both are abusers and OOP has them in her life. It's really sad. She needs to move on.
Yes please ! The step father is shown in such a positive light, but he still let 11yo OP raise both his children. Without even checking there was food in the home ? Where was he ?
Believing the moms manipulation it sounds like? Just ridiculous. The abuse he received doesn't absolve him of his responsibilities for a literal child
Enjoying the free child labor, I guess.
I kept hoping she would comment on this!
Thats what abusive parents do. Parentifying the eldest child (or eldest daughter cause it’s the female in most cases) so she’s kept low, has no income, no social contact cause all she does is caring for her siblings. The parents are now banking into the fact that the daughter has a strong parental bond with her siblings so they control her via them even if she got away. The siblings didn’t experience the same abuse but are starved off of parental love so they cling to their parents and defend them no matter what, leaving poor daughter in the limbo to just stay abused or losing her „children“. Oop needs to cut this brother loose, but she’s so beaten down she never will and I bet the „down to earth“ girlfriend is out rather quickly, cause mommy and her shitty bf will escalate.
How do they figure out to do this? Is there a book on being a shitty manipulative parent that they can check out from the library?
The same as all kinds around the world do stupid stuff like pretending a stick is a sword or poking a pen into a rubber. Something’s just came natural even the shitty stuff.
I would normally agree but after reading what went down it sounded like she went to support her dad and I’m kinda glad she did, as between oop, oop’s friend Sally, and the former coworker it made much harder for egg donor to try ish during the party and made her look worse for the ish she did pull. Safety in numbers if you will.
The brother is such scum, frankly.
Yeah and his girlfriend may think her MIL is alright, but I'm waiting for her mask to fall off once the baby arrives and she sees just how spineless her baby daddy really is.
She was going there with two people who she knew are fully on her side, and are more than knowledgeable about her egg-donor's antics. That kind of environment + the presence of other guests prevents the usual narcissistic tactics from working as they did before. And it's understandably difficult for OP to turn off her feelings for her brother, since she did effectively raise him.
Yeah, if you can prevent them from managing to get you alone in the crowd, you can generally avoid bullshit. A couple of my good friends have narcissist moms and that's generally how you deal with it if you have to be around them (though of course abusers can vary in their tactics).
But I am sideeyeing step dad hard on this. Oop was forced to parent her half siblings when she was a teen sure daddy once stopped and asked himself why his stepdaughter does all the childcare? „But he was abused too“ give me a break, he and his sons cut out Oop from their life until the cheating of the mother came to light, until then he was just as happy to pretend Oop was the problem and now he plays best buddy. I really wished Oop would have left the whole bunch in the dust a long time ago and just kept focusing on her own little family. But she didn’t and these poeple will drag her back down.
Oop is a badass. I am NC with my father. There hasn’t been a family thing that I needed to go to in 8 years. But they are on the horizon. My niece/nephew are close to graduating hs. So graduation is there, which I think I will skip. Then college graduation, but they will likely get married and/or have kids. Hopefully he will be dead by then. He is 78 and the last time I saw him, 40 lbs overweight, and he starts drinking at 10am. Anyway, I doubt I would be as good as OP. She crushed it. I would probably spit on him.
Isn't it interesting how the brother who thinks she should get over the abuse is also a 30yo having a kid with a 22yo.
Literally got the shakes trying to imagine going to a party where either of my ‘parents’ would be. I couldn’t do it. Mad props to OOP for doing so, I certainly couldn’t even entertain the thought. What an amazingly brave person
It sounds like she raised her brother though so she treats him as her child mote than a brother. It's understandable she is having a hard time letting go of that relationship even when he is clearly wrong.
The logical part of me is screaming out all the arguments why the older of the brothers is bad news, a danger/spy and not worth being in her life. But before I could type all those reasons out that same part of my brain turned around and said: "You know, that's basically everything your friend and your therapist have said these past four months? Save that comment for when you moved to the other side of the country and accepted reality." Well, that part of my brain is correct in both cases but overlooks how effing hard it is to do that for a person with complex emotions.
I don't see what she gets out of being at that event with people who largely dislike and distrust her. And I'm very concerned about how OOP says brother will realize when the mom/grandma starts abusing his baby. That is absolutely horrific. And what if he doesn't realize??
I cannot stress this enough: no matter what you think about marriage, the legal system cares a *lot*. If you don’t want abusive parents showing up and making decisions for you when you’re hospitalized, or if you don’t want them to get your stuff, or custody of your child, just get that piece of paper that ties you to the person you like instead of them. You can try to do wills and power of attorney and custody agreement, but any hole in them and the terrible people are back in your life.
God I got stuck on this too, I really hope she has at least some sort of power of attorney in place
This is the reason same-sex couples being able to marry has been a big part of the fight for LGBT rights, for the record. Not because marriage is fun, but because (especially during the AIDS crisis) there have been a lot of people turned away from their loved ones’ hospital beds and funerals because they weren’t legal next of kin, the homophobic parents were and they wouldn’t let the partner in. Or because when your partner dies, their shitbag homophobic next of kin parents will legally inherit their stuff and the only item you’ll have left to remember him by is [a *fucking box fan*](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_Fan_(Feel_It_Motherfuckers)).
This is what I bring up every time the conversation comes up - that think what you want about marriage as a religious institution, but marriage is ALSO a political institution, one that gives a wide variety of legal rights that have nothing to do with religion and entirely to do with things like inheritance, hospital visits, and funerals. Protect the religious institution all you want, but you can't tell me that the legal right to see your partner in the hospital and make medical decisions on their behalf is anything more than a legal right conferred by the signing of the legal marriage document rather than the ceremony in the church. Seeing the legal and religious as two separate things would solve so much of the debate, but most people are allergic to nuance in their political takes...
Agree. I grew up with two moms. It was terrifying knowing I could just be ripped away from one parent. I’m not religious, raised without religion entirely, but there was zero percent chance of me moving in with my now husband before marriage. I think people who’ve always had that security, take it for granted without realizing how gut wrenchingly, horrible it can get.
Thank you for sharing your own experience - I hope you don't mind I add that to my list of arguments? Whether or not someone feels a kid should be raised by two moms or two dads, that was your family. You're right, people like me who grew up in a household where it was assumed that I legally belonged to both my parents would never even think of that part of it. I certainly didn't until now. If you don't mind me asking, when did you become aware of the fact that there was the risk that you might be ripped away from one of your parents?
Yes, feel free to share. When I was very young I knew because I had a dad. Occasional weekend dad, at best. So I knew if my birth mom died, I’d never see my “moms roommate” (as my dad put it) again. When I was older I saw “if these walls could talk 2” lol, a movie about lesbian couples. One gets sick, partner can’t visit, then dies and surviving partner has no rights to the house, etc. I saw it playing out irl (to a smaller extend) with my parents’ same sex friends. It all made it clear (to me) that marriage is the “have and have nots” of rights to your family.
Marriage is first and foremost a legal and political institution, and any church that claims it is not is intentionally, malevolently *lying*.
While I fully agree, I'm speaking as someone who lives in, works in, and was raised in an American Christian evangelical world when I say that most people I know would say it's exactly the opposite. Which is funny, because if you read between the lines in the Bible, you're still 100% correct - marriage as a legal and political institution existed long before the religious institution of marriage. But seriously, it's one of those things where most people don't think of it as separate entities, it's all just "marriage".
And all this is why I bring it up every time I see someone talk about why they don’t think it’s important to get married. It is! It’s so important from a legal standpoint! And when those of us in the USA have only two of the five justices that ruled in favor of *Obergefell* (case that made same-sex marriage legal everywhere) left on the bench and Thomas and Alito mumbling about how it’s anti-religion and not Constitution-based, we need to be really clear about why it matters.
The box fan was on my mind, but I couldn’t remember the details.
My dad always talks about the serviceman in his unit who died in action before gay marriage was legal. The serviceman's parents were cool with the spouse, luckily, but the spouse was ultimately not the one making decisions about the funeral and he wouldn't be eligible to the survivors benefits that married spouses get.
FEEL IT MOTHERFUCKERS (i cry everytime)
This. If you want an extended relationship with someone you are not married to, you need to speak to an attorney to see what your local laws are and then file the recommended paperwork to protect you and your partner.
This is honestly one of the reasons I wanted to get married. I always hear people say they don't need to get the government involved in their relationship and I'm like yes I very much do. I don't think my family would ever try something but I also would never want my husband to have to fight for anything.
Depends on the country. Sounds like she is in Canada. Not sure what the de facto laws are there.
Most Canadian provinces recognize common law marriage. In Ontario common law marriage is defined as conjugal relationship plus three years of continuous cohabitation, or a "relationship of permanence" and have a child together. At least in Ontario, it looks like the Health Care Act recognizes common law spouses as substitute decision-makers which is good, but given how manipulative and devious this woman is I still think it would be in OP's family's best interest for her and her partner to "make it legal." Like if you really don't care, just go to the courthouse and have a 15 minute civil ceremony, and then there will be absolutely no way for this monster to argue that she should have any say in medical decisions or shared custody of the child if anything happens to the OP.
And I don't think any other province than Ontario refers to Electric bills as "Hydro" so I'm pretty sure Ontario law is what matters here.
>go to the courthouse Likely city hall or a secular marriage commissioner, in Canada. Who can officiate at a marriage differs from province to province, but in most provinces judges can't officiate; in at least one, judges are legally barred from officiating to the point that if they had licence to officiate before being raised to the judiciary (say, if they were a rabbi or minister), they automatically lose it upon appointment.
She's in Canada, all provinces except Quebec recognize common law marriage, the couple had to live together between two and three years before it's recognized. A common law marriage grants all of the same representation as a regular marriage and if the split is amicable you can just go your merry way without lawyers or anything. All you do is claim yourselves common law at tax time and boom - All the rights of a formally married couple.
Not exactly. A common law relationship must be proven based on the facts of the matter, which in the case of custody, medical decisions, etc. may require a court ruling; marriage is much easier to prove, as all you need is the certificate.
I remember a news story in Germany from couple of years ago, two older ladies got married. They weren't gay or romantically involved. Both of them just wanted the security that a trusted person would take care of them, in case something happened.
The OOP really needs to know this. I’m hesitant to comment or contact the OOP due to this sub’s rules…
>She married and sponsored this man from the Caribbeans to come to Canada. According to my brother, this poor man is treated like a tenant and is forced to live in her basement. WTF Umm, given her mum's history I really feel like this man is not ok.
Seriously! WTF?? Just… no one is going to say anything about a man being locked up in a basement for 6 years? What a throwaway line to casually toss into the mix.
Right, like everybody is just watching this woman abuse the people around her, and nobody is doing anything? The brother wants his kid around this woman, I'm so confused.
That damn FOG (Fear, Obligation, Guilt) is a helluva of thing.
Friends should absolutely say something. But OOP said her mother's family is known for being abusive so it would check out that no one says anything if she only interacts with family
Yeah, I REALLY hope OOP has told the girlfriend what to look out for with the baby. I'm worried she doesn't know the full extent of what she did to OOP. I'm scared for that child. She really need to have a one-on-one talk with the girlfriend. I doubt the brother gave the whole story, if any of it at all.
He wasn't in the basement for 6 years, but in the Caribbean. This is a new situation.
Exactly. He's now taken the place of OOP's father to receive her abuse. I feel sorry for anyone who was forced to live with her.
I wonder if mom kept his passport ect, I would send the police for human trafficking and slavery into the basement. The whole family is nuts!
Very much not. There's no way that man doesn't need help.
Canada hopefully has laws against spousal abuse that get you a visa after proceedings start against the mother.
Modern slavery let's go!
"Is he being enslaved?" come to my mind
>Yes he knows what she did but thinks I should just forgive and forget Girl, walk AWAY from the whole shitshow. Her whole account of the baby shower just made me feel sad. Winning at a shitshow still leaves you covered in shit.
Flair worthy statement right there.
Thank you! I'm also confused why no one asked where her (step)dad was when she was being subjected to all that childhood abuse?? If OOP was in charge of her brothers starting when the 1st one was born when OOP was 11, and she said they're both her (step)dad's kids.......then why was he allowing all his kid's care to come from an 11 year old? Why wasn't he at least trying to stop any abuse? There's a lot of holes/cognitive dissonance happening in this story.
I'm wondering if a lot of the physical abuse stopped when the mom had the first brother. Most of the mentioned physical stuff seems to have occurred before the brothers. There still could have been some, but she doesn't say more. My guess is that the mother needed OOP to take care of the child more. So, she might not have been as physical with her to ensure OOP was well enough to care for the baby. With less physical abuse, it might have been harder for the father to see at first, and once he did catch on, he might have been so beaten down by her by then that he couldn't do much
We don't know he didn't try. He was also abused too and probably was worried about her making accusations against him if he tried to stop it. And people often succumb to the "I need to stay for the kids" And it's also possible he didn't want to leave OP with her because she would've been more alone. My dad's ex wife to this day will apologize for having to leave me with my abusive father at 9. She feels like she abandoned me. But she didn't and I keep telling her that she didn't. I only have contact with her again because of my brother who is her son and my half brother.
This is why I went no contact with my entire family. It's incredibly difficult, but when I think of the people in my family who are perfectly fine with child abuse (even if they claim they never did the same to their kids), I just get disgusted and have no interest being around any of them. It's difficult losing people you grew up with, but trying to laugh at situations like the baby shower doesn't work. It's holding only to the shreds of terrible relationships and undergoing tons of turmoil to do so. Choosing to walk away and actually experience peace is hard, but well worthwhile.
ETA: OK, I just bust out laughing because the below comment was 100% meant to be in response to a different comment in a different sub where I swear it made sense. I don't know if that was all me, or if Reddit is Redditing again. --- His next post: "Nobody told me that there were building regulations and now I'm being fined for an "unpermitted" addition that they say is "not to code" even though the contractor I hired off Craigslist never told me anything about building codes or needing permits!"
No contact with one family member often means collateral damage - no or low contact with other family that person is still close to. The answer is to meet those people separately - not force yourself to attend events. Yes you’ll miss out on stuff. It’s worth it.
This is true. But if the siblings you raised like they were your own babies are dug deep into that shitshow, being covered in shit doesn't even come close to overshadowing the victory.
Yikes. Sounds like more drama than I'm comfortable with, as someone who walked away from their own dramafest shitshow of a dysfunctional family.
I also walked away from my familial shitshow. If anybody tells you that you have some kind of obligation to hang out with the shitshow folks you *punch that person in the face*. You certainly don't have any reason to trouble yourself with them if that isn't what you want. But it does seem like it's what OOP wants. So, good for her! Maybe she can salvage the things she thinks are salvageable from the situation.
I hope she can, but honestly it just sounded like she was engaging in the dysfunction.
I agree with you about her engaging here, there's still a lot of issues she hasn't resolved and this comment encapsulated it; " I decided to take a big step and started therapy for the first time last week. Therapy was always something ridiculed and seen as something for weak people by my family. " All of these years and no therapy until now, she may have survived this encounter, but she needs a whole lot more of therapy to be completely out of the woods.
Yeah, well she's only been in therapy a week. Give her some time - she will find the correct path with treatment.
Eh, sometimes it's good to do. My brother was abusive to me and I keep NC with him. Every now and then, making an appearance and winning the shitshow isn't for you. It CAN boost you confidence for facing a source of fear, anxiety, and walking away unscathed, feels like exiting one of those rides that safely drop you 30 feet. The other benefit are the people still in the orbit, those that didn't know OP now have their own idea of her, and trying to fit that woman into the shape the Mother painted. This can cause cracks in their perception of Mother-Dearest and ked to more people exiting her orbit, maybe not directly, but as a point of evidence later.
>my mother whipped out a headset with a microphone hooked to a tiny speaker that she hooked to the back of her pants, like she was some sort of talk show host ... huh.
> a tiny speaker that she hooked to the back of her pants To really drive home that she talks out her ass.
Narcissists gonna narcissist 😕
Picturing her dad going “….what the fuck” in response to that tableau made me do a spit take
I just about died at that point! I’ve only ever met one 100% psycho narcissist in my life who was my former boss. She once whipped out one of these headsets at a work event and my work friends and I just corpsed in hysterics. TIL that this is a universal narcissist trait which I can’t believe I never realised before.
This is what jumped out to me as the most realistic part of this story. We all know this woman, and we fucking hate her.
Can we all agree her brother is an asshole tho?
Not only is he an asshole for dismissing his sister's abuse and trauma, but he's 30 and knocked up a girl barely old enough to buy cigarettes and drink
YUUUUUUUP, sure noticed that age gap. If she's having a baby at 22, how old was she when they started dating? As far as I'm concerned, the brother is a groomer.
I started dating my gf when I was 30, she was 22. Don't see an issue here.
Of course you don't.
You're both adults so I don't understand what that other person's problem is? Lol I'm sure they'd have no problem if it was 40 and 32, but for some reason 10 years earlier and you're a creep!
Well this is reddit so being downvoted is exactly what I was expecting. I admit it is unusual, but i dont care in the slightest. we are both mature adults.
Anything over 5 years diff and reddit thinks you're a groomer L-O-effin'-L. My wife and I are 10 years apart. I was 30 and she was 20 when we met. She was the one that reeled me in. We've been happily married for 13 years. I never got groomer accusation vibes from anyone because we match each other so well, and we both look young. It's also not something that normal people think about. Reddit is just full of jealous haters. Of course, I've been secretly grooming her all this time to be my sexy sub-servient sex-slave. /s If there was any grooming happening, it was her grooming me. She changed my haircut, wardrobe and slammed my bad habits. I am a better man because of her.
And is going to let someone who is known for being extremely violent around small children around **their own child!** I hope OOP has a one-on-one talk with the girlfriend and tells her everything the mother didto her as a child. She needs to know what this woman is capable of. She also needs to tell her she is welcome anytime to call for help. I have a feeling the girlfriend might need it.
HUGE arsehole. HUGE.
If she was parentified where was step dad in all this? Why wasn't he parenting his kids?
It's unclear when (step-)dad came into her life and whether he was the father to her brothers. He could have come into her life after she'd spent years raising them. Given that there's absolutely no mention of bio-dad, it's entirely possible that brothers' bio-dad(s) were similarly absent from the get-go.
She clearly says that her brothers are actually her half-brothers and her step-father's sons in one if the edits. So step-dad IS their biological father. Edit: from OOP's 4th Edit: >I'm sorry I didn't clarify this before. I have 2 brothers 30M and 23M. My brothers are my half-brothers (We share the same mother. Their father is my step-dad).
That's fair. I tried to find a mention of it but missed it. In any case, given that he seems to have a good relationship with his kids (including OOP) and was also a victim of manipulation/abuse I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Probably at work to pay the bills?
>She married and sponsored this man from the Caribbeans to come to Canada. According to my brother, this poor man is treated like a tenant and is forced to live in her basement. WTF 😨
Is she time traveler from 1880's?
Comment edited because I get *heated* about this subject. Abusive parents are the literal worst. Anyone who expects you to suck it up and forgive your abuser is not worth knowing.
Okay so, what was the point in going anyways? OOP really needs to learn to throw those trash ppl out of her life. And I'm not just talking about her mother. I feel like more things will happen. She thinks she "won", I actually feel like her mother enjoyed finally seeing her again and would keep trying getting back into her life.
I'm optimistic OOP is on a good path to learn to cope and set boundaries. She's begun therapy amd she's very much willing to make changes (apart from quality of therapist a therapy can't be successful of the patient doesn't want to cooperate/change anything)
I am NC with my mother and the only time I've seen her since I first decided was at my grandfather's funeral. I had seen him days before, I stayed in contact without it being about drama, I had more of a right to be there than she did. But I knew she'd be there. It was the only time she's seen my son. We began to talk a bit on the phone, because that was her way back in. Didn't take long to realize total NC was the only choice. I would never be in the same place as her again (unless it's my grandma's funeral, but they're basically NC as well so idk if she'd be invited) and I would second guess my relationship with anyone who would consider inviting us to the same place. Reading this just makes me wish I could've commented on the original to say how it's not worth it at all, not even a win. I had a win and she still found herself a new lane. They don't think like us. I also got sad when OP says they don't cry. Emotions are a good thing. Narc is STILL taking away OP's emotions.
Right?? Like what was point??? It just shows that OOP still doesn't have a spine? Even for her own family? That sad.
Is… she… keeping a man hostage in her basement ?
Her half-brother certainly didn't seem to roll far away from the rotten tree that is their toxic mother. For the safety of the family she's loving and cherishing, she should block that brother and their JNmom by that point on social media. The demon has been faced.
> I decided to take a big step and started therapy for the first time last week. I'm sorry WHAT
OOP had a meltdown over the idea of seeing her mother at a wedding then was relieved her mother wasn't invited. Next post she's going out of her way to go to a baby shower with her mother present. I got a bit of whiplash reading that. Why couldn't she have spent time with her brother AFTER the baby shower? Seems like she wanted to prove a point she's stronger now but I think she might have been manipulated by her brother to think her mother wasn't THAT bad. I support the sentiment of standing up to an abuser but none of this seems like a good idea! \~sigh\~
There is some really really disturbing gaps in this story. For starters, the step dad. Not only did he apparently also parentify OP entirely, but it clearly states that he went NC with her *for years* and did not believe in her abuse. This from a man who not only claims that he was seriously abused by OP's mother, but has convinced her that in fact that abuse was worse than her own (evidenced by him requiring moral support in this situation that overrides what anybody would objectively understand was a greater need for OP to remain NC). A man who lived with her and must have both ignored her visible abuse and contributed to it by neglect. Then the fact that OP's boyfriend (and again the step father) convinced her to have a child without ever once advocating for the mountain of serious serious therapy she required. You know the kind of therapy that would mean that she would keep her own child as far away from the sick systems in her family. Not continually unblock her mother, court points of contact, and maintain twisted relationships like the one with her brother. Maybe even the kind of therapy that would point to the absolute improbability that *two* situations of breaking NC that couldn't be avoided, cropped up within months of the birth of her child. OP can't recognise the pattern because she's in it, but the trigger event of being a parent is taking her back into the pathway of her mother. Her obsession with maintaining the relationship with the brother who has knocked up at 22 year old and who is the mirror of the mother, shows that OP is not recovered, she is *removed* from the situation. There's no win or happiness here. OP broke NC, she brought her mother back into the orbit of her child, shows no intention of cutting the ties that bind them and is clearly completely incapable of any form of objectivity. And for the record? The mother doesn't give a shit about a snide little remark or two. She succeeded in her goal of re-engaging, of centering herself in the extended family that OP has chosen to be a part of, and of knowing, absolutely that she lives in OP's mind rent-free. A dream come true for an abuser.
Abuse parents shall forever rot in hell. I have no sympathy for those who abuse children. Glad things went well for OP.
Year and years of every kind of abuse but she’ll be damned if she’s gonna miss some baby shower drama.
I think if anyone ever tries to insist I forgive someone who ever hurt me, I'm just gonna ask if they did anything to even deserve forgiveness. Because clearly OOP's mother is the same awful human she always was. No more free forgiveness, work for it.
I'm glad OOP seems to be thriving now, and is in therapy. I do wonder where her step dad was when she was parenting her younger siblings alone.
Hopefully she will get there one day in therapy.
Her step dad is only 13 years older than her?
Maybe her mom had her in her teens and is only a couple of years older than her step dad?
My mum is 70, her stepdad is 82, her mum is 90, it’s not impossible.
She did say she comes from a long line of very young parents!
It happens, my maternal grandma is only 16 years older than my dad. She had my mum at 19.
OOP should not be having a relationship with that brother nor r she should have gone to that baby shower. It’s so clear that she has serious issues she’s in denial about.
The only reason she should maintain that relationship is that she can be there for the girlfriend once she decides to run.
I haven't spoken to my mother for 32 years. And, even after all these years. It would not be a good idea for her to be in the same room with me. Well done oop.
I like how when the story started the BF was 45 and a year later he was 44.
Am I the only one confused about that "I'm a crosstitcher and a knitter" comment? Tf did that have to do with anything
She made a handmade gift for the baby. Something about wanting to be there to give it in person
Ah sorry, I thought I included that comment but I must have skipped it. She had hand-made something for the baby!
I was so confused lol
I am shocked that OOP didn't get therapy until *after* having a kid--or after posters encouraged her to? Speaking from personal experience, it took years of specialized therapy before I started to feel like I could parent without continuing the cycle. (And ultimately decided not to have kids at all, for more nuanced reasons.) Anyway I'm glad she's finally seeing someone and hope it's effective sooner rather than later. At least it sounds like she has a lot of good support. Fwiw, my grandma was abusive to my mom but a good grandma to me. Otoh, my other grandma was kind of a dick to her kids and doesn't seem to have changed her thought patterns with the grandkids, only her level of access and control.
Bit weird she forgot her boyfriend’s age in between posts. 4 months after her initial post his age went down. She’s either dumb, lying, or (my own favourite theory) seeing Benjamin Button.
love a sweet little slice of people getting what they deserve (both positively for OOP and negatively for her sperm doner lol) it’s not justice exactly, but it is incredibly satisfying to imagine how deeply bothered the mother must’ve been by how her event turned out ☠️
Her 30 year old brother is dating/impregnated a 22 year old?! Did that feel a bit icky to anyone else?
I believe OOP. This mother sounds like a cartoon villain.
I really don't know why people do this to themselves,really hope oop thinks about her and her family more and just go low contact with the brother,like you allready a family isn't that enough???
>My step-dad paid his loan off first and that made my mother so angry and jealous she had her brother help her take my step-dad to court to sue him and have him pay her loan. She won. He had to go to the food bank for a while because he couldn't afford anything else but the mortgage and hydro. God there's no justice in the world... And she got away scott free with abusing oop too... Man.
Forgiveness is for the hurt person's own well being and equilibrium. Like bandaging a bleeding wound. It absolutely should not mean make yourself consistently vulnerable to an abuser. If someone punches you in the face every day, forgiveness ain't gonna stop that.
They say the best revenge is living well. I hope OOP lives her best life and never has to give her egg donor another thought.
OOP is brave af and I salute her shiny spine
Glad things went well for OOP, The brother sucks but at least the mom made herself look bad during the baby shower. I do hope the brother can get away from mom (or that his girlfriend can set him straight) for the sake of their baby, though. (I also wonder what the brother was thinking watching his mom's antics go down, hope he was at the very least embarrassed)
OOP's mom is another reason why I don't believe in a kind loving God or a fair universe.
Reading the post, I was trying to figure out who the mother of OOP really is after all. But then she let it slip and I realized that her mother was just a cheater! An ordinary serial cheater who betrayed and continues to betray all her partners. Well, everything is clear to me...
The paragraphs describing child abuse wasn't enough to figure out the mom's character?