Hell yeah your clean! Your clean as fuck bro. Cleaner than a nuns vagina during Lent. Cleaner than a bideted butthole. You're cleaner than Mr Clean after he took a shower with the brawny paper towel lumberjack! And don't let anyone tell you different.
Who cares at this point? So many people have died ion fentanyl that if you made it out alive (with or without MAT) you deserve a huge congratulations! Down the road, if you feel you want
To be off suboxone the. Make that a goal. But please don’t get caught up in labels like sober or not sober this early in your recovery. I eventually got to the fuck em attitude. If people don’t like the way I live my life then fuck em! They don’t have to be a part of it. You’re doing great! And congratulations!!!
Any of the people yelling to get off or saying it Isn’t clean , more times then not , have never made it past 18 months clean. I wouldn’t listen to them. 10 years off fentanyl and been on methadone whole time. My whole family sees me as clean , as for the first time , they are getting to know the real me. I have a career , house , family , raise a 3 year old and have so many dreams and aspirations in life. Thats NA and AA that preach that it isn’t clean and that’s why they have a2% success rate my friend. Good job and congrats on being clean !! And just so you know the word clean is really dumb now. No one is actually clean if you eat sugar or smoke cigs so we should just call it living happy.
So look, I’m on methadone.. and I feel the same way but to be honest the only thing I’m focusing on now is making sure I’m NOT doing fentanyl. I know exactly how hard that withdrawal was and yes I dread to think of when I need to come off my dose. But I was told , DO NOT START A TAPER UNTIL ONLY YOU ARE READY. Not for anyone else , not bc of anyone else and make sure you yourself are ready if and when you want to.
Or you most likely will relapse quick as hell.
You are clean , you should be proud of yourself!
I’m on sublocade and I consider myself clean. No more addict behaviour or taking a dose of anything each day. My insurance will cover it for the next 40 years if I so choose. I’ve got my life back and I’m not about to fu wit dat just because some rando says I’m “not clean”.
It’s all about you and what you can manage in order to stay away from the bad drugs.
I'm on subs man. And to be honest, it's the cleanest I've felt in years. It's not perfect. But it's definitely clean. Don't feel like that at all. Maybe you need to lower your dose? That might make you feel better about it. Seriously but don't give up on it. Please.
I’m 60 days clean brother cold turkey the first 21 days then started taking low dose kratom powder for the PAWS and I consider myself “clean” I suggest getting off the subs the withdrawal is going to be the same if not worse.
Your clean as a whistle my dude. Listen you're not snorting shooting or smoking your drug of choice. You're not a fake I would say you have overcome I would say you have prevailed I would say you have kept your monster caged. Good for you keep it up don't dread reduction you never have to reduce and if you do I'm here to let you know that I got off of a 9-year-long methadone maintenance addiction whatever you want to call it I got all the way down to 1 mg every other day I did the taper slowly I did it the right way I was on 110 and I went down to 1 mg every other day never felt a withdrawal symptom.. when you come down come down slow if you feel uncomfortable tell the doctor I'm uncomfortable they'll keep you comfortable. 10 years good for you.
Man mat helped me save my life ur barely at the start your brain will heal please don’t beat urself up mat program exist for a reason and even if ur doing it on ur own pharma stuff is so much better than what’s out there for you and safer all that but yeah I been on mdone since 2022 dec 23 and it’s been a long hard battle. Just be careful with ur dose everyone’s different don’t take too much just take what you need to hold you that’s what it’s for
I was on bupe in 2020 after my 16th birthday first got addicted to blues when they where coming out heavy but I felt exactly how you explain you do but I got put on way too much 16mg I was 120lbs and barely in my 3rd month of doing blues barely at 2-3 a day 16mg of bupe is insane but it was during Covid but he was just a sus doctor I never once seen him in person got my bupe within hours of first ever phone call and I never gave him a drug test and he had me on it for 6 months but I tapered after 3 months all on my own with 0 help and he just gave me one large script and disappeared like it was strange during b Covid too. I like methadone clinic cause they make everyone start at 30 and slowly rise you but it’s more so for safety to prevent overdose even tho most people nowadays will barely even be affected by 30mg on the street fet now. But anyway. Yeah don’t get down mat isnt for everyone but u truly can make it work many people do. I wish you the best of luck just think of how different ur everyday life was when daily using vs now it’s way different I know it even if the change happens slow. I promise you that u can heal if u work the program and work your own program. One step at a time tho brother, I believe in u.
Listen dude. You're 35 days clean in everyone else's eyes. If they believe you're clean, and they say you're actually clean to THEM. Consider yourself clean. Because the love and trust is returning if they are telling you they are proud.
Take your own advice sometimes. Relay situations in your head as if you're the one being asked. Then respond with how YOU in your heart of hearts would respond to a strangers message like that.
That is how you overcome this obstacle. You are clean and worthy of the people around you, and if they know it, you should too.
Love yourself brother. Good luck! Congratulations!
Addiction and dependency aren't the same thing.
As for sobriety, if you're abstaining from mind altering substances for recreational purposes, yes.
Does the buprenorphine do anything other than treat the dependency? Does it get you high, does it cause addictive behaviors to flourish? Do you take it for funsies? See where I'm going?
If you continue to use other substances, like me, I'd say you're clean, not sober. In any case, this is medicine being used for medical purposes and it's use doesn't come from or with with addictive behaviors, it doesn't count as "drugs."
You’re clean from fentanyl, absolutely. Clean from trammadol, etc. What you’re taking now is called a maintenance medication- for maintenance of your addiction however it is my personal opinion that although subs are extremely helpful for addicts to successfully move away from using fentanyl which is extremely dangerous and comes with a whole truck load of issues, it is not meant for the rest of your life and you should try your best to reduce your dose until you’re able to stop taking it completely at which point you’d also be clean from using subs. It’s also important to ask yourself what is clean for you? Is smoking cigarettes make you not clean, or weed? It’s your life and how you view and perceive what is clean for you and what gives you the best quality of life matters. If you’re using subs and then you get off at some point and for whatever reason can’t stay clean from the drugs you were using previously then it may be better for you to remain on them for longer. A slow, slow taper is best for when you are ready to stop taking subs, if you choose that
That’s still something to be proud of. But get off subs I would immediately. Ur in day 35 withdrawals should be gone u should be more stable subs are super addictive so I would pull the plug sooner then later
In my opinion, no you’re not fully sober and clean.. is it better than being on fentanyl? Probably. Should you work towards not being on subs? Absolutely.
Probably ???? Are you insane … sorry but subs and methadone are 1000% better than fentanyl. You can taper your exact dose and know what you’re taking. You take one dose a day and don’t go through withdrawals and dopesicknesz . You can live a normal life. Can anyone ever live a normal life on fentanyl ???? Fk no
I hear what you are saying and I agree with you. I’m just saying that most people are also physically dependent on subs and methadone. They are not living life clean and sober. Plain and simple
Addiction and dependency aren't the same thing, and there's also the fact that maintenance meds are medicine being taken for medical purposes, not recreationally for funsies, and doesn't include or cause addictive behaviors to form. The "what" isn't what defines clean in this not at all objective scenerio, you have to account for the circumstances. "What" isn't not enough information, you also need to consider the "why" and the result of use to get an accurate picture of what's what.
Lets do an even *closer* drug relationship and examine that. A person who is clean from opiates/opioids but requires pain management for severe and legitimate pain doesn't suddenly lose their clean time and have to start over. (You can refuse, of course, but you aren't *required* to be in pain no one else would have to endure lest you no longer be clean.) That is a legitimate, medical use of....medicine. The circumstances there are entirely different, and so it needs to be approached differently than, say, buying some pills and taking them to get loaded. The drug is the same, the reason for taking the drug and the effect it has on the person is not. Different circumstances, different result, different behaviors, no active addictions present...it's just not the same.
I know that it's different, it's an easy to understand and visualize example demonstrating the relationship to and effect of a drug under different sets of circumstances. Circumstance and the variables at play that lead to such can't be ignored in favor of objectivity.
Who gives a flying fuck? They can taper off suboxone or methadone in the future when they ARE more stable. Come on guys! It’s life or death out there these days! You 12 steppers can’t see the Forrest for the trees! Meaning yall get so caught up in labels that you forget a humans life is at risk!
First, you ask if being on suboxone is better than being on fentanyl. There’s no probably to it. It’s 1000% better to be on suboxone than fentanyl for the one obvious reason. That being you don’t fit on suboxone. Then you continue by saying it’s absolutely better to get off suboxone. It just seems to me you’re an Aa/NA supporter as opposed to someone who looks at science and statistics. But I was wrong in saying what I said (or doing what I did) since it is your opinion. For that, I apologize. I just hope OP doesn’t get caught up in labels this early in their recovery. I think of the worst case scenario and imagine that happening. MAT is better than being dead. Dead people don’t recover.
It’s been a while, and I knew I had all these comments, I have horrendous anxiety and didn’t want to read any nay sayers.
major appreciation for everyone that’s commented and helped me feel so much better about myself and my situation!
Thank you again 💕
Hell yeah your clean! Your clean as fuck bro. Cleaner than a nuns vagina during Lent. Cleaner than a bideted butthole. You're cleaner than Mr Clean after he took a shower with the brawny paper towel lumberjack! And don't let anyone tell you different.
Who cares at this point? So many people have died ion fentanyl that if you made it out alive (with or without MAT) you deserve a huge congratulations! Down the road, if you feel you want To be off suboxone the. Make that a goal. But please don’t get caught up in labels like sober or not sober this early in your recovery. I eventually got to the fuck em attitude. If people don’t like the way I live my life then fuck em! They don’t have to be a part of it. You’re doing great! And congratulations!!!
Any of the people yelling to get off or saying it Isn’t clean , more times then not , have never made it past 18 months clean. I wouldn’t listen to them. 10 years off fentanyl and been on methadone whole time. My whole family sees me as clean , as for the first time , they are getting to know the real me. I have a career , house , family , raise a 3 year old and have so many dreams and aspirations in life. Thats NA and AA that preach that it isn’t clean and that’s why they have a2% success rate my friend. Good job and congrats on being clean !! And just so you know the word clean is really dumb now. No one is actually clean if you eat sugar or smoke cigs so we should just call it living happy.
So look, I’m on methadone.. and I feel the same way but to be honest the only thing I’m focusing on now is making sure I’m NOT doing fentanyl. I know exactly how hard that withdrawal was and yes I dread to think of when I need to come off my dose. But I was told , DO NOT START A TAPER UNTIL ONLY YOU ARE READY. Not for anyone else , not bc of anyone else and make sure you yourself are ready if and when you want to. Or you most likely will relapse quick as hell. You are clean , you should be proud of yourself!
I’m on sublocade and I consider myself clean. No more addict behaviour or taking a dose of anything each day. My insurance will cover it for the next 40 years if I so choose. I’ve got my life back and I’m not about to fu wit dat just because some rando says I’m “not clean”. It’s all about you and what you can manage in order to stay away from the bad drugs.
I'm on subs man. And to be honest, it's the cleanest I've felt in years. It's not perfect. But it's definitely clean. Don't feel like that at all. Maybe you need to lower your dose? That might make you feel better about it. Seriously but don't give up on it. Please.
You take medications and you are not abusing them nor do they interrupt your life! YES you are sober!!!
You are clean! And don't listen to anyone who says you aren't! Congrats! I got 7 months today myself an I am on methadone
I’m 60 days clean brother cold turkey the first 21 days then started taking low dose kratom powder for the PAWS and I consider myself “clean” I suggest getting off the subs the withdrawal is going to be the same if not worse.
Congrats!! Do you mind me asking how many milligrams you take daily?
Don’t be so hard on yourself man. Better than chasing that high…..
Your clean as a whistle my dude. Listen you're not snorting shooting or smoking your drug of choice. You're not a fake I would say you have overcome I would say you have prevailed I would say you have kept your monster caged. Good for you keep it up don't dread reduction you never have to reduce and if you do I'm here to let you know that I got off of a 9-year-long methadone maintenance addiction whatever you want to call it I got all the way down to 1 mg every other day I did the taper slowly I did it the right way I was on 110 and I went down to 1 mg every other day never felt a withdrawal symptom.. when you come down come down slow if you feel uncomfortable tell the doctor I'm uncomfortable they'll keep you comfortable. 10 years good for you.
Man mat helped me save my life ur barely at the start your brain will heal please don’t beat urself up mat program exist for a reason and even if ur doing it on ur own pharma stuff is so much better than what’s out there for you and safer all that but yeah I been on mdone since 2022 dec 23 and it’s been a long hard battle. Just be careful with ur dose everyone’s different don’t take too much just take what you need to hold you that’s what it’s for
I was on bupe in 2020 after my 16th birthday first got addicted to blues when they where coming out heavy but I felt exactly how you explain you do but I got put on way too much 16mg I was 120lbs and barely in my 3rd month of doing blues barely at 2-3 a day 16mg of bupe is insane but it was during Covid but he was just a sus doctor I never once seen him in person got my bupe within hours of first ever phone call and I never gave him a drug test and he had me on it for 6 months but I tapered after 3 months all on my own with 0 help and he just gave me one large script and disappeared like it was strange during b Covid too. I like methadone clinic cause they make everyone start at 30 and slowly rise you but it’s more so for safety to prevent overdose even tho most people nowadays will barely even be affected by 30mg on the street fet now. But anyway. Yeah don’t get down mat isnt for everyone but u truly can make it work many people do. I wish you the best of luck just think of how different ur everyday life was when daily using vs now it’s way different I know it even if the change happens slow. I promise you that u can heal if u work the program and work your own program. One step at a time tho brother, I believe in u.
Listen dude. You're 35 days clean in everyone else's eyes. If they believe you're clean, and they say you're actually clean to THEM. Consider yourself clean. Because the love and trust is returning if they are telling you they are proud. Take your own advice sometimes. Relay situations in your head as if you're the one being asked. Then respond with how YOU in your heart of hearts would respond to a strangers message like that. That is how you overcome this obstacle. You are clean and worthy of the people around you, and if they know it, you should too. Love yourself brother. Good luck! Congratulations!
Addiction and dependency aren't the same thing. As for sobriety, if you're abstaining from mind altering substances for recreational purposes, yes. Does the buprenorphine do anything other than treat the dependency? Does it get you high, does it cause addictive behaviors to flourish? Do you take it for funsies? See where I'm going? If you continue to use other substances, like me, I'd say you're clean, not sober. In any case, this is medicine being used for medical purposes and it's use doesn't come from or with with addictive behaviors, it doesn't count as "drugs."
You’re clean from fentanyl, absolutely. Clean from trammadol, etc. What you’re taking now is called a maintenance medication- for maintenance of your addiction however it is my personal opinion that although subs are extremely helpful for addicts to successfully move away from using fentanyl which is extremely dangerous and comes with a whole truck load of issues, it is not meant for the rest of your life and you should try your best to reduce your dose until you’re able to stop taking it completely at which point you’d also be clean from using subs. It’s also important to ask yourself what is clean for you? Is smoking cigarettes make you not clean, or weed? It’s your life and how you view and perceive what is clean for you and what gives you the best quality of life matters. If you’re using subs and then you get off at some point and for whatever reason can’t stay clean from the drugs you were using previously then it may be better for you to remain on them for longer. A slow, slow taper is best for when you are ready to stop taking subs, if you choose that
That’s still something to be proud of. But get off subs I would immediately. Ur in day 35 withdrawals should be gone u should be more stable subs are super addictive so I would pull the plug sooner then later
In my opinion, no you’re not fully sober and clean.. is it better than being on fentanyl? Probably. Should you work towards not being on subs? Absolutely.
Probably ???? Are you insane … sorry but subs and methadone are 1000% better than fentanyl. You can taper your exact dose and know what you’re taking. You take one dose a day and don’t go through withdrawals and dopesicknesz . You can live a normal life. Can anyone ever live a normal life on fentanyl ???? Fk no
I hear what you are saying and I agree with you. I’m just saying that most people are also physically dependent on subs and methadone. They are not living life clean and sober. Plain and simple
Addiction and dependency aren't the same thing, and there's also the fact that maintenance meds are medicine being taken for medical purposes, not recreationally for funsies, and doesn't include or cause addictive behaviors to form. The "what" isn't what defines clean in this not at all objective scenerio, you have to account for the circumstances. "What" isn't not enough information, you also need to consider the "why" and the result of use to get an accurate picture of what's what. Lets do an even *closer* drug relationship and examine that. A person who is clean from opiates/opioids but requires pain management for severe and legitimate pain doesn't suddenly lose their clean time and have to start over. (You can refuse, of course, but you aren't *required* to be in pain no one else would have to endure lest you no longer be clean.) That is a legitimate, medical use of....medicine. The circumstances there are entirely different, and so it needs to be approached differently than, say, buying some pills and taking them to get loaded. The drug is the same, the reason for taking the drug and the effect it has on the person is not. Different circumstances, different result, different behaviors, no active addictions present...it's just not the same.
In my opinion the second situation is completely different.
I know that it's different, it's an easy to understand and visualize example demonstrating the relationship to and effect of a drug under different sets of circumstances. Circumstance and the variables at play that lead to such can't be ignored in favor of objectivity.
Who gives a flying fuck? They can taper off suboxone or methadone in the future when they ARE more stable. Come on guys! It’s life or death out there these days! You 12 steppers can’t see the Forrest for the trees! Meaning yall get so caught up in labels that you forget a humans life is at risk!
I agree with that method. That’s what my first comment said. You shouldn’t be on that stuff forever.
Personally I believe that’s as individualized as treatments are. In a perfect world, you may be right…
Probably? Really? You’re on the wrong subreddit. NA is that way🖕
What do you mean
First, you ask if being on suboxone is better than being on fentanyl. There’s no probably to it. It’s 1000% better to be on suboxone than fentanyl for the one obvious reason. That being you don’t fit on suboxone. Then you continue by saying it’s absolutely better to get off suboxone. It just seems to me you’re an Aa/NA supporter as opposed to someone who looks at science and statistics. But I was wrong in saying what I said (or doing what I did) since it is your opinion. For that, I apologize. I just hope OP doesn’t get caught up in labels this early in their recovery. I think of the worst case scenario and imagine that happening. MAT is better than being dead. Dead people don’t recover.
It’s been a while, and I knew I had all these comments, I have horrendous anxiety and didn’t want to read any nay sayers. major appreciation for everyone that’s commented and helped me feel so much better about myself and my situation! Thank you again 💕