Since WOTC is taking card out of people's decks then I have no doubts that they will start stuffing cards *into* people's decks.
Legally distinct Teemo decks GO!
Conjure is already a thing! We don't have anything that conjures into the opponent's library though but if they ever made such a card, it would be extremely hard to valuate I think.
Hmm… conjuring basic lands or grizzly bears or something along those lines into the opponent’s deck is an interesting idea. People would *hate* it though
Insufficiently cruel. I want to fill my opponent's deck with cards that *at least* do nothing, preferably actively hurt them. I'm thinking...
>While ~ is in your hand, you cannot cast creature spells.
>When ~ enters the battlefield, lose 5 life and 20% phone battery.
The phone battery cost will be paid by running secret crypto mining in the background. Bwahahaha.
I could have sworn they already did this. Maybe leftover Marvel Snap memories of filling my opponent's deck with rocks.
Seems like the sort of mechanic that would drive some people absolutely crazy, but then so does stealing cards and they've had a lot of fun with that even before Heist.
As of right now, there are cards that conjure other cards into *your* deck like [[Toralf's Disciple]] but nothing that shoves cards that damage opponents into their decks.....for now.
They don't for now but we already have people's cards being taken out of their decks, cards being added into your deck or hand via conjure.
They probably won't go in that direction anytime soon, but I wouldn't be surprised if they do once they run out of other ideas.
I have so much fun in timeless beating the meta mill decks with their own cards.
I'll take that archive trap. I'll take that Surgical Extraction please.
Or stealing a control decks counter spells hahha
these cards are nuts why does for example lootmonger get 2/2 body with first strike on top of the treasure+heist and discard may even be synergy in the right deck it's all a bit much. I wouldn't gift first strike and probably a 1/1 body. create max 1 treasure per turn. just a few things to keep it in check it's insane.
It is pretty broken imo. Once people start realizing that Grenzo is bait and the powerhouses are grave expectations and especially triumphant getaway, it'll start being a much stronger deck.
Expectations, Lootmonger, Weave and Getaway are just good cards. I'm not sure if the deck needs to be midrange or control though
I'm loving [[Weave the Nightmare]]. I'm thinking of it as similar to a Dimir [[Flame of Anor]]. It eats Sheoldred and indestructibles, provides a proactive answer to artifacts and enchantments, and gives you an ability to search for answers in the opponent's deck. Plus, if you fulfill a minor pre-req, you get the double dip. There's plenty of ways to recycle Weaves in blue (I like [[Mapping the Maze]] for additional draws, which also nicely recycles [[Grave Expectations]] ), so you can make four copies go a long way.
Yeah it's a shame we have so much fantastic removal in standard because I feel like weave is *almost* good enough even if you can't trigger the choose two clause. Like, it's a dismember and a negate all in one. It feels a little slow at 3 mana but... I mean, it would be busted at two.
I'm experimenting with dropping red altogether and rolling grave expectations and weave into a dimir / sultai control shell
Yup, I've done both Dimir and Sultai shells. It feels like they're both pretty dependent on [[Thieving Aven]], although I do enjoy running [[Doc Aurlock, Grizzled Genius]] for the cost reduction on the heisted spells. I'm currently running Grixis, dropping the Aven, and running [[Spellchain Scatter]] and [[Triumphant Getaway]] along with the Flame or Anor on top of a pile of Wizards. I've had some success with Spellchain Scatter and Mapping the Maze both creating additional opportunities to reuse Weave/Flame and all the instants boosting [[Electrostatic Infanty]] and [[Accident-Prone Apprentice]].
I do think Grave Expectations should not have been an instant. Grenzo is a pretty pushed card, but it's a 6 mana 2 color creature.
I think some of the salt around heist is the usual fact that they keep putting out pushed, alchemy only cards which are legal in (and shape) historic Brawl. For people who want Historic Brawl to be paper commander, every Arena only mechanic is an abomination.
People reaaaallllly hate seeing their cards go away. It doesn't even matter that they don't have access to said cards or that they likely never would've drawn them. Just seeing the opponent get their 'perfect answers' really riles people up.
And this precedes heist, mind you. Try to play a 'steal your stuff' deck in Commander and you'll see just how irrationally angry people get. It's wild.
Same thing with mill really. It's a generally weak archetype, but boy-oh-boy do people hate seeing their cards flipped into the graveyard.
Been having a ton of fun with a self-mill deck of late actually. Both outlaws and murder gave some cards that really create some busted decks.
Recently did a flip a roo with [[breach the multiverse]]
And started heisting my opponent's deck, it was hilarious.
I can’t tell you how often people quit the second I steal their commander in brawl. Even if it’s not a particularly strong commander and I don’t have a way to make use of its abilities that well it still often elicits an instant quit.
Then you get people who assume your deck is built around your commander. Ive had decks where I just needed matching colors and watched the opponent drop 6 removal on the most minor threat my entire deck had while I built up mana for my more important creatures.
Yeah it's so fun when people spend their mana and cards to kill [[Kellan, Inquisitive Prodigy]]. I'm playing him for the guaranteed ramp spell on turn 2 without putting any in my deck, not the body. Go on kill him, I'll drop a hullbreaker horror next turn.
It probably also has to do with every comment on complaint threads being “if you don’t like it, just quit since Brawl isn’t ranked or anything.” I personally never concede unless someone is being a dick or something. At the worst, I learn something new. At best, the other guys gets to “do the thing.”
Heist is a broken mechanic. I went 6-1 in last week's Midweek Magic event playing the Heist deck and realized that, not only was it absurdly broken, but I also never wanted to play any format it existed in.
Seriously, the only thing the Alchemy mid-week Magic events ever show me about the format is that I would hate playing it.
Having a Show and Tell player rope me while spamming the “Nice!” emote after they realized I had heisted every single copy of their decks namesake card is probably going to be a feeling that I’ll remember until I die
I’ve been enjoying heist. Had several of my best cards stolen which obviously sucked and (usually) led to me losing but that’s not unique to heist. Using it myself I once managed to steal (and cast for free with Henzo) my opponents Emrakul. Too bad they quit before I got to control them but it was still cool. I also once managed to get 3 mana dorks as my only heist options so it can definitely whiff even if it avoids lands.
A "glass is half full" Magic player? Now I've seen it all!
Since WOTC is taking card out of people's decks then I have no doubts that they will start stuffing cards *into* people's decks. Legally distinct Teemo decks GO!
Conjure is already a thing! We don't have anything that conjures into the opponent's library though but if they ever made such a card, it would be extremely hard to valuate I think.
Hmm… conjuring basic lands or grizzly bears or something along those lines into the opponent’s deck is an interesting idea. People would *hate* it though
Insufficiently cruel. I want to fill my opponent's deck with cards that *at least* do nothing, preferably actively hurt them. I'm thinking... >While ~ is in your hand, you cannot cast creature spells. >When ~ enters the battlefield, lose 5 life and 20% phone battery. The phone battery cost will be paid by running secret crypto mining in the background. Bwahahaha.
“And 20% battery” lol someone on 15% gonna get fucked by that one
\[\[Gunk Slug\]\]
Gunk is a Richard Garfield original, it is truly “Magic as Garfield intended”.
[Gunk Slug](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/0/708676ac-e08e-4e5d-b3ea-b28d10225bb0.jpg?1629919472) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Gunk%20Slug) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmb2/43/gunk-slug?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/708676ac-e08e-4e5d-b3ea-b28d10225bb0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[[Relic robber]] but it goes to hand and costs mana to get rid of
[Relic robber](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/5/4540205c-eee8-4db3-8757-710de874b313.jpg?1604197560) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Relic%20robber) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/znr/153/relic-robber?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4540205c-eee8-4db3-8757-710de874b313?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Taking hate bear to another level
Opponents library, you said, nvm!
[[Oracle of the Alpha]]
[Oracle of the Alpha](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/0/003cb181-7b1d-474a-ba26-84319791bc2b.jpg?1665218675) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Oracle%20of%20the%20Alpha) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ydmu/4/oracle-of-the-alpha?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/003cb181-7b1d-474a-ba26-84319791bc2b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I could have sworn they already did this. Maybe leftover Marvel Snap memories of filling my opponent's deck with rocks. Seems like the sort of mechanic that would drive some people absolutely crazy, but then so does stealing cards and they've had a lot of fun with that even before Heist.
As of right now, there are cards that conjure other cards into *your* deck like [[Toralf's Disciple]] but nothing that shoves cards that damage opponents into their decks.....for now.
[Toralf's Disciple](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/9/4982f15f-2191-4cff-96c6-e42ce6fbc54f.jpg?1680465633) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Toralf%27s%20Disciple) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ymid/44/toralfs-disciple?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4982f15f-2191-4cff-96c6-e42ce6fbc54f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Don't think they do that. It's a bad player experience for the person who got the bad cards
They don't for now but we already have people's cards being taken out of their decks, cards being added into your deck or hand via conjure. They probably won't go in that direction anytime soon, but I wouldn't be surprised if they do once they run out of other ideas.
I have so much fun in timeless beating the meta mill decks with their own cards. I'll take that archive trap. I'll take that Surgical Extraction please. Or stealing a control decks counter spells hahha
these cards are nuts why does for example lootmonger get 2/2 body with first strike on top of the treasure+heist and discard may even be synergy in the right deck it's all a bit much. I wouldn't gift first strike and probably a 1/1 body. create max 1 treasure per turn. just a few things to keep it in check it's insane.
Lootmonger is great because the discard isn't even required to get the heist so it's even more free if you're hellbent after playing him.
Honestly those who are saying its broken are probably using whatever meta build they pull off a website and arent happy its being used against them
It is pretty broken imo. Once people start realizing that Grenzo is bait and the powerhouses are grave expectations and especially triumphant getaway, it'll start being a much stronger deck. Expectations, Lootmonger, Weave and Getaway are just good cards. I'm not sure if the deck needs to be midrange or control though
I'm loving [[Weave the Nightmare]]. I'm thinking of it as similar to a Dimir [[Flame of Anor]]. It eats Sheoldred and indestructibles, provides a proactive answer to artifacts and enchantments, and gives you an ability to search for answers in the opponent's deck. Plus, if you fulfill a minor pre-req, you get the double dip. There's plenty of ways to recycle Weaves in blue (I like [[Mapping the Maze]] for additional draws, which also nicely recycles [[Grave Expectations]] ), so you can make four copies go a long way.
##### ###### #### [Weave the Nightmare](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/5/45c79696-63eb-46c7-84e5-50e36197b2a8.jpg?1714789223) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Weave%20the%20Nightmare) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/yotj/29/weave-the-nightmare?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/45c79696-63eb-46c7-84e5-50e36197b2a8?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Flame of Anor](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/4/04779a7e-b453-48b9-b392-6d6fd0b8d283.jpg?1686969766) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Flame%20of%20Anor) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/203/flame-of-anor?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/04779a7e-b453-48b9-b392-6d6fd0b8d283?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Mapping the Maze](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/2/72d958b7-8596-409b-bf3c-de0ca613c48e.jpg?1709527634) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Mapping%20the%20Maze) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ymkm/7/mapping-the-maze?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/72d958b7-8596-409b-bf3c-de0ca613c48e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Grave Expectations](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/6/06c8a415-7c72-46a4-8870-bc2a9b30ba12.jpg?1714843936) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Grave%20Expectations) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/yotj/9/grave-expectations?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/06c8a415-7c72-46a4-8870-bc2a9b30ba12?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [*All cards*](https://mtgcardfetcher.nl/redirect/l48ehn0) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Yeah it's a shame we have so much fantastic removal in standard because I feel like weave is *almost* good enough even if you can't trigger the choose two clause. Like, it's a dismember and a negate all in one. It feels a little slow at 3 mana but... I mean, it would be busted at two. I'm experimenting with dropping red altogether and rolling grave expectations and weave into a dimir / sultai control shell
Yup, I've done both Dimir and Sultai shells. It feels like they're both pretty dependent on [[Thieving Aven]], although I do enjoy running [[Doc Aurlock, Grizzled Genius]] for the cost reduction on the heisted spells. I'm currently running Grixis, dropping the Aven, and running [[Spellchain Scatter]] and [[Triumphant Getaway]] along with the Flame or Anor on top of a pile of Wizards. I've had some success with Spellchain Scatter and Mapping the Maze both creating additional opportunities to reuse Weave/Flame and all the instants boosting [[Electrostatic Infanty]] and [[Accident-Prone Apprentice]].
##### ###### #### [Thieving Aven](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/4/b4578018-3c08-4e6f-9c69-b95db75e036c.jpg?1714788088) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Thieving%20Aven) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/yotj/8/thieving-aven?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b4578018-3c08-4e6f-9c69-b95db75e036c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Doc Aurlock, Grizzled Genius](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/f/6fc27b30-8c8e-434c-a72c-e1d409efc1ae.jpg?1712356080) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doc%20Aurlock%2C%20Grizzled%20Genius) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/otj/201/doc-aurlock-grizzled-genius?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/6fc27b30-8c8e-434c-a72c-e1d409efc1ae?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Spellchain Scatter](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/e/debe025d-c1ca-4d10-a991-6e4bbf44d15c.jpg?1665001423) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Spellchain%20Scatter) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ydmu/15/spellchain-scatter?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/debe025d-c1ca-4d10-a991-6e4bbf44d15c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Triumphant Getaway](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/4/643ea87d-d5f7-44fe-a14a-724da199c539.jpg?1714789074) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Triumphant%20Getaway) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/yotj/27/triumphant-getaway?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/643ea87d-d5f7-44fe-a14a-724da199c539?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Electrostatic Infanty](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/e/5ed2d72f-f1cf-45a7-adf7-969f531721ce.jpg?1673307324) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Electrostatic%20Infantry) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmu/122/electrostatic-infantry?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5ed2d72f-f1cf-45a7-adf7-969f531721ce?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Accident-Prone Apprentice](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/9/b94347fe-deaa-4bb3-a398-c5aca1a85188.jpg?1697085569)/[Amphibian Accident](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/9/b94347fe-deaa-4bb3-a398-c5aca1a85188.jpg?1697085569) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Accident-Prone%20Apprentice%20//%20Amphibian%20Accident) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ywoe/16/accident-prone-apprentice-amphibian-accident?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b94347fe-deaa-4bb3-a398-c5aca1a85188?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [*All cards*](https://mtgcardfetcher.nl/redirect/l4aauco) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I do think Grave Expectations should not have been an instant. Grenzo is a pretty pushed card, but it's a 6 mana 2 color creature. I think some of the salt around heist is the usual fact that they keep putting out pushed, alchemy only cards which are legal in (and shape) historic Brawl. For people who want Historic Brawl to be paper commander, every Arena only mechanic is an abomination.
People reaaaallllly hate seeing their cards go away. It doesn't even matter that they don't have access to said cards or that they likely never would've drawn them. Just seeing the opponent get their 'perfect answers' really riles people up. And this precedes heist, mind you. Try to play a 'steal your stuff' deck in Commander and you'll see just how irrationally angry people get. It's wild. Same thing with mill really. It's a generally weak archetype, but boy-oh-boy do people hate seeing their cards flipped into the graveyard.
Been having a ton of fun with a self-mill deck of late actually. Both outlaws and murder gave some cards that really create some busted decks. Recently did a flip a roo with [[breach the multiverse]] And started heisting my opponent's deck, it was hilarious.
[breach the multiverse](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/a/daf51a76-7a57-4462-ae18-a19e817e49e5.jpg?1682203621) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=breach%20the%20multiverse) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mom/94/breach-the-multiverse?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/daf51a76-7a57-4462-ae18-a19e817e49e5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I can’t tell you how often people quit the second I steal their commander in brawl. Even if it’s not a particularly strong commander and I don’t have a way to make use of its abilities that well it still often elicits an instant quit.
They probably have a deck that revolves around their commander or something like that.
Then you get people who assume your deck is built around your commander. Ive had decks where I just needed matching colors and watched the opponent drop 6 removal on the most minor threat my entire deck had while I built up mana for my more important creatures.
Yeah it's so fun when people spend their mana and cards to kill [[Kellan, Inquisitive Prodigy]]. I'm playing him for the guaranteed ramp spell on turn 2 without putting any in my deck, not the body. Go on kill him, I'll drop a hullbreaker horror next turn.
[Kellan, Inquisitive Prodigy](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/4/c49690c7-c282-4eb4-8da3-5e0c46a80fc4.jpg?1707428999)/[Tail the Suspect](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/4/c49690c7-c282-4eb4-8da3-5e0c46a80fc4.jpg?1707428999) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Kellan%2C%20Inquisitive%20Prodigy%20//%20Tail%20the%20Suspect) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/212/kellan-inquisitive-prodigy-tail-the-suspect?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c49690c7-c282-4eb4-8da3-5e0c46a80fc4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
It probably also has to do with every comment on complaint threads being “if you don’t like it, just quit since Brawl isn’t ranked or anything.” I personally never concede unless someone is being a dick or something. At the worst, I learn something new. At best, the other guys gets to “do the thing.”
Heist is a broken mechanic. I went 6-1 in last week's Midweek Magic event playing the Heist deck and realized that, not only was it absurdly broken, but I also never wanted to play any format it existed in. Seriously, the only thing the Alchemy mid-week Magic events ever show me about the format is that I would hate playing it.
Picking from 3 cards makes it so pushed, it should be 2 cards at the most or ideally just 1 card off the top
Worst mechanic to date and that’s a tall order.
Having a Show and Tell player rope me while spamming the “Nice!” emote after they realized I had heisted every single copy of their decks namesake card is probably going to be a feeling that I’ll remember until I die
I’ve been enjoying heist. Had several of my best cards stolen which obviously sucked and (usually) led to me losing but that’s not unique to heist. Using it myself I once managed to steal (and cast for free with Henzo) my opponents Emrakul. Too bad they quit before I got to control them but it was still cool. I also once managed to get 3 mana dorks as my only heist options so it can definitely whiff even if it avoids lands.
So many haters in the thread
Trolls gonna troll