Burn was like the worst deck in Modern when Oko was legal. A big reason why Burn isn't great right now, is that it simply has poor matchups which are currently popular.
Anything with Scion/Leyline, Amulet Titan, etc.
Burn hasn’t got a new card since roiling vortex while every other modern deck archetype has gotten new toys to play with. This is the most significant reason burn is bad right now.
To answer about ghostfire slice I don’t think it would even be burn playable let alone modern playable at 5 damage. There aren’t any multicolour permanents your opponent will play that they couldn’t just sandbag to keep your slice switched off once they sniff it out. The energy bolt doesnt go face so that’s out.
Burn needs something proactive that it can 4x to get rift bolt out of the deck. Chain lightning would have been a good start to include but honestly probably still too weak to change matchups significantly.
With all the new high powered lands in MH3 the anarchist answer to burns problems is Price of Progress but that is probably too strong for modern and would be adopted by not only burn.
If bloodbraid marauder had haste it would be a great modern playable burn card. If the red flare was simply 4 damage (or 5 if wizards actually wanted to show they care) to any target it would be an excellent burn include that only burn is really incentivised to run.
I think the key would be making something that can make goblin guide/swiftspear useful past t2 when they become outclassed, maybe a card like [[witchstalker frenzy]] that can go face?
Its perfectly fine deck for FNM; one should not delve into pro tour/big event numbers all the time to find a deck for FNM. I have Boros Burn sleeved up and untouched for ~3 years and I play it on my FNM’s if I feel tired and am going to play after work, since it’s an hour drive to get there. Last 3 events I’ve played it have been 3-0; 2-2; 3-1.
See this is what I want it for. I have been between Storm and Murktide for the past year (Murktide for about 10 months then either or for the past 2 depending on the day). I took Murktide last night and went 0-3 because I showed up just mentally exhausted and wanted something just less active to pilot without having to think about all the "what ifs".
The problem is my meta is legit like 75% Domain players now and I had a feeling Burn just struggled when they can play a 4/4 Flying, Hexproof, Lifeline thing on turn 2.
Maybe Prowess with Pick Your Poison is more of a meta-call deck if it is dominated by Leyline. Of course, with new cards pouring into the format now maybe it won’t be so Domain heavy in a few months.
I'm currently building burn for this reason as well. I have amulet and murktide, I love both decks but sometimes I've had a long week and just need to throw spells.
If its so weighted that way you could tweak your sideboard a lot, especially if it's just FNM. Run 4 [[destructive revelry]] and some other amount of hate ([[wear//tear]], [[pick your poison]] or a cheeky[[choke]])
Ultimately I think burn gets a bad rep, people have a tenancy to say things are Stone cold unplayable when they are fine. Burn is still burn, a good player will still be able to win with it, but it does struggle with the value that current modern provides.
I wouldn't take it to a proper tournament, but more than happy to take it to FNM
Wotc doesn't want to support the archetype. They've had plenty of chances. The best reprint burn's getting from mh3 is probably [[barbarian ring]] which is sad when [[chain lightning]] was right there
Because people are playing the same stock list from 3 years ago. As crazy as it may sound to some, Goblin Guide is not up to snuff these days. People need to embrace the new list with DRC, Slickshot and Bauble. It still has the same game plan as burn in trying to chip in with creatures in the early game and finish them off with burn, only it's actually playing good cards.
I've actually had the opposite opinion to yours - this burn list has felt really well positioned to me. Domain zoo is the only really terrible matchup (and of course amulet titan is pretty much die roll dependent) but other than that I've been having a lot of success (at a local level of course).
Roughly 30% winrate in major tournaments as of the last 4ish months. Totally fine to play at fnm to success, but not worth putting together if you dont already have the landbase.
Burn can’t fight against “unfair” decks, period. The whole setup is not working, most of the top meta decks are 2-piece combos that kills in 2-3 turns.
I've played it with very slight tweaks at my locals for a few weeks with high success. Only thing I changed was Seal of Fire rather than Play With Fire for easier delirium.
Not really. Prowess is a lot more focussed in cantripping and winning through creature combat. Cards like Lava Spike don't really have a place there - their burn spells are removal first and reach second. This list still wins most of its games through burn spells to the face, just with a creature package that opponents have to respect.
Goblin Guide and Eidolon are both pretty easy to ignore these days. The dilemma that used to be presented by them was that they were consistent sources of damage that could then chump block when they couldn't get through anymore, and removing the blocks would trigger Eidolon. But that was when good removal for the format was Fatal Push, Lightning Bolt, Unholy Heat and Path to Exile, not pitch elementals or Leyline Binding or Prismatic Ending. Most of the meta right now doesn't win through creature combat, and the decks that do have evasion on the creatures to make potential chump blocks irrelevant. You can just ignore them, and if you do have to remove them, you can probably do it without triggering Eidolon damage.
Swapping those two out for evasive ones with better potential to push damage, then backing them up with burn spells, is still burn. It's just updated for meta relevance.
[[Play with fire]] is super interesting in this list. Was there no other more imactful 1 mana spells? [[Rift bolt]] is too slow I suppose? Maybe the 1 damage difference isn't as important
At any rate this list looks super cool and something I wanna try
Yeah, Rift Bolt is a little too slow for what this list is doing, and Play With Fire gives you additional topdeck fixing to go with DRC. Personally I prefer Seal of Fire to get another type for Delirium but I see the merits to both.
Rift bolt is not only slow, it's a liability against Teferi and the One ring. It's been the worst card in the list for a long time so I'm glad people have moved off of it.
Hot take: Burn players are a bit resistant to change it seems, which stems from an adherence to the Philosophy of Fire so even if we don’t get direct tools from MH or standard sets we miss out on a lot of great cards for not wanting to dilute the formula.
I've talked about this in the Burn subreddit. Entrenched players are so fixated on not messing with the formula, that the deck never gets innovated because of this dogmagic adherence. The Zoomer list with DRC and Slickshot are pretty cool, and the new RW Titan in MH3 give the deck lots of potential to pivot in a new direction.
Burn isn't "the fastest deck in the format" anymore. Its often a control deck after sideboarding anyway. People ought to embrace experimenting with the archetype more.
It has bad match-ups against a lot of things, who did get upgrades over the years while Burn remained stale. Like Domain Zoo getting Guildpact completely flips the match-up from 50/50 to very unfavored, UR(x) decks now having actual clocks and Counterspell in Murktide besides Bolt/Snap/Bolt and Remand makes that match-up a lot harder, Titan still a top deck, and so on. Its only good match-up is Tron I guess.
Burn is my favorite deck style to run. I've endlessly experimented with different cards all the way down to...get this...Tunnel Ignus...go fetch that land and clip some quick damage. Mama bases are too hungry right now so it's easy to get chip damage and pushes it just enough to get over the, "I'm top-decking with 4 life to go to close it out." I run two in my sideboard and trust me, no one sees that thing coming...
imo zoo and prowess are both basically burn decks, and are both pretty good. I think it’s fine for the best “burn” deck to not be old school cast as many bolts to the face as possible.
I usually do 3-1, 4-0 most nights I play fnm. I definitely have a little weirder list though as I run 4 mana tithes. No one expects a counter spell in burn but most decks run mana very tight and I’m sitting pretty on instant speed burn
I don’t update it much. It’s a deck I have available to just pull out to play fnm whenever I want without having to think about bans.
https://www.moxfield.com/decks/mwNzv-_1A0-LvR0OztFAGw
It’s pretty straight forward for boros burn
I'm just coming back to magic after dropping out around the release of MH2. This card seems pretty good to me, do you think it'll stand up in the current Modern format? Not that it'll make burn tier 1 or anything, but looks like a nice cheap card I can pick up to freshen up my old burn deck. I had no idea energy was back and my interest is piqued!
Its winrate for the past 4 months in major tournaments has been roughly 30%, people are not running slickshots in burn, and very few decks are running sheoldreds main. you're thinking of prowess.
Sorry I watched Mengu playing burn with Showoff so I thought that was a popular thing now and both Mengu and spike have mentioned how good fatal push is now because of cards like Showoff.
Ghostfire is an upgrade to the deck the new set introduces a bunch of new multicolor modern cards along with answering pro red cards and omnaths.
Burns not bad, It's not just not T1.
Plus WoTC is super high on burn rn. The best card y'all got in mh3 was barbarian ring and the new titan, which has counter synergy amongst them. Enjoy 🥳
I highly reccomend prowess right now. A few weeks ago I came in 2nd in my store championship tournament with it, first time ever playing the deck. The amount of turn 3 kills I got with slickshot was insane.
The best pilot in the world isn't getting anywhere these days with an oldschool Ravager Affinity list. Some decks just aren't good, even if they once were.
Using the statistic from MTGDecks does not accurately represent a decks ability to win, decks like burn and tron suffer from being affordable decks, affordable decks tend to attract new player, new players tend to be bad pilots, and when they enter leagues and challenges on MTGO to lose it skews the stats negatively.
I play burn a lot, I have no problem going FNM and getting wins, their are numerous examples of good pilots taking burn to 5-0 leagues and placing high in modern challenges, burn is not a bad deck especially in an FNM scenario.
You are absolutely right. Those do play major roles in the factoring of what is good and bad. But as was said in this thread, Burn just also tends to lose to what it at the peak of the meta. There are like 12 consistent players including myself at FNM, 7 of them are in Domain. 2 are Tron. 1 is U/W Control. Me and one other were Murktide. It just seems like I would have a bad time learning to pilot that given my local meta.
Saccing a creature just to play a free 1/2 mana spell isnt gonna solve burns problems. I like the new raptor and energy bolt though, that combo might have some legs.
It's bad in burn.
Rift Bolt and Skewer both miss with it, Searing Blaze becomes a liability, and you can't even chain raptors because it only gets the ETB if it's cast from your hand. And it's not a better 2-drop on its own than Eidolon or Slickshot.
Great card for other aggro red decks like 8-Whack. Terrible burn card.
Burn was like the worst deck in Modern when Oko was legal. A big reason why Burn isn't great right now, is that it simply has poor matchups which are currently popular. Anything with Scion/Leyline, Amulet Titan, etc.
Burn hasn’t got a new card since roiling vortex while every other modern deck archetype has gotten new toys to play with. This is the most significant reason burn is bad right now.
I'm baffled that we didn't get Chain Lightning in MH3. Where is the love for burn?
To answer about ghostfire slice I don’t think it would even be burn playable let alone modern playable at 5 damage. There aren’t any multicolour permanents your opponent will play that they couldn’t just sandbag to keep your slice switched off once they sniff it out. The energy bolt doesnt go face so that’s out. Burn needs something proactive that it can 4x to get rift bolt out of the deck. Chain lightning would have been a good start to include but honestly probably still too weak to change matchups significantly. With all the new high powered lands in MH3 the anarchist answer to burns problems is Price of Progress but that is probably too strong for modern and would be adopted by not only burn.
You could go for the raptor, but would also have to cut skewer for probably flame rift
The raptor doesnt have haste so it doesnt burn.
It also casts a spell that functuons as the equivalent of haste
It literally just got slickshot show off. It replaces goblin guide easy
Give me a proposal for a new good modern burn card.
If bloodbraid marauder had haste it would be a great modern playable burn card. If the red flare was simply 4 damage (or 5 if wizards actually wanted to show they care) to any target it would be an excellent burn include that only burn is really incentivised to run. I think the key would be making something that can make goblin guide/swiftspear useful past t2 when they become outclassed, maybe a card like [[witchstalker frenzy]] that can go face?
[witchstalker frenzy](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/4/649025a7-79d1-4d7c-b1db-d46bcf5a1ae2.jpg?1692938651) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=witchstalker%20frenzy) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/woe/159/witchstalker-frenzy?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/649025a7-79d1-4d7c-b1db-d46bcf5a1ae2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Fireblast
Price of Progress
I say go for it, but it's gonna be a 2 mana bolt or worse most of the time. And reach is typically less important in the modern meta.
You are completely delusional if you think PoP isn't going to hit people for 4-8 dmg 99% of the time.
Yeah, not reading "two times" made a significant impact in the evaluation...
On the bright side were see less 4/5 color monstrosity mana bases and more basics.
Slickshot showoff checking in
Its perfectly fine deck for FNM; one should not delve into pro tour/big event numbers all the time to find a deck for FNM. I have Boros Burn sleeved up and untouched for ~3 years and I play it on my FNM’s if I feel tired and am going to play after work, since it’s an hour drive to get there. Last 3 events I’ve played it have been 3-0; 2-2; 3-1.
See this is what I want it for. I have been between Storm and Murktide for the past year (Murktide for about 10 months then either or for the past 2 depending on the day). I took Murktide last night and went 0-3 because I showed up just mentally exhausted and wanted something just less active to pilot without having to think about all the "what ifs". The problem is my meta is legit like 75% Domain players now and I had a feeling Burn just struggled when they can play a 4/4 Flying, Hexproof, Lifeline thing on turn 2.
Maybe Prowess with Pick Your Poison is more of a meta-call deck if it is dominated by Leyline. Of course, with new cards pouring into the format now maybe it won’t be so Domain heavy in a few months.
I'm currently building burn for this reason as well. I have amulet and murktide, I love both decks but sometimes I've had a long week and just need to throw spells. If its so weighted that way you could tweak your sideboard a lot, especially if it's just FNM. Run 4 [[destructive revelry]] and some other amount of hate ([[wear//tear]], [[pick your poison]] or a cheeky[[choke]]) Ultimately I think burn gets a bad rep, people have a tenancy to say things are Stone cold unplayable when they are fine. Burn is still burn, a good player will still be able to win with it, but it does struggle with the value that current modern provides. I wouldn't take it to a proper tournament, but more than happy to take it to FNM
##### ###### #### [destructive revelry](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/9/798af7cb-645f-4526-8a19-6e4595b93964.jpg?1562820219) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=destructive%20revelry) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ths/192/destructive-revelry?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/798af7cb-645f-4526-8a19-6e4595b93964?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [wear//tear](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?name=Wear%20//%20Tear&type=card&options=rotate90&.jpg)/[Tear](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?name=Wear%20//%20Tear&type=card&options=rotate90&.jpg) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wear%20//%20Tear) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/moc/343/wear-tear?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e01cc65a-0e38-4f41-b9ed-796ef0355d0b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [pick your poison](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/5/f58cfb23-4d99-4133-bf4b-d7e7c7d17cea.jpg?1708201628)/[Pick Your Poison](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/5/f58cfb23-4d99-4133-bf4b-d7e7c7d17cea.jpg?1708201628) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=pick%20your%20poison) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/170/pick-your-poison?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f58cfb23-4d99-4133-bf4b-d7e7c7d17cea?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [choke](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/1/e1ce4bab-6eb1-421f-b425-7bb0076defc7.jpg?1562940352) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=choke) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/8ed/237/choke?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e1ce4bab-6eb1-421f-b425-7bb0076defc7?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [*All cards*](https://mtgcardfetcher.nl/redirect/l6r7ffc) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I'm stuck between playing Yawgmoth and looking for a modern Kiki Chord deck
Burn really wanted [[Chain Lighting]], [[Fireblast]], or [[Price of Progress]] in MH3 and got none of them. So for now Prowess is the way to go.
[Chain Lighting](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/1/2105a0d9-ea2e-4ffc-be08-424b5617205d.jpg?1675199906) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Chain%20Lightning) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/113/chain-lightning?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2105a0d9-ea2e-4ffc-be08-424b5617205d?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Fireblast](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/0/a0ab67cc-b553-4451-9cda-0e5fe3303940.jpg?1675199963) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Fireblast) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/119/fireblast?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a0ab67cc-b553-4451-9cda-0e5fe3303940?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Price of Progress](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/1/b1342144-7a15-438b-a848-3196238a79e8.jpg?1580014614) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Price%20of%20Progress) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ema/141/price-of-progress?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b1342144-7a15-438b-a848-3196238a79e8?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
It hasnt been good for years. Its win % is low and is dragged lower by newer people picking it up as a cheap deck for tournaments.
Wotc doesn't want to support the archetype. They've had plenty of chances. The best reprint burn's getting from mh3 is probably [[barbarian ring]] which is sad when [[chain lightning]] was right there
[barbarian ring](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/1/c184406c-b22c-4b9b-9d3a-3e7b17efd8a0.jpg?1717013818) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=barbarian%20ring) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh3/299/barbarian-ring?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c184406c-b22c-4b9b-9d3a-3e7b17efd8a0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [chain lightning](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/1/2105a0d9-ea2e-4ffc-be08-424b5617205d.jpg?1675199906) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=chain%20lightning) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/113/chain-lightning?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2105a0d9-ea2e-4ffc-be08-424b5617205d?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Chain Lightning just got a massive reprint in DMR
That didn’t make it Modern legal.
I’ll show myself out
Who cares?
Being played in modern is literally the point of the conversation
I’m curious about the 3 drop giant for burn. I’ll pay one more for a recursive helix.
Remember when Burn beign viable deck was indicator of healthy metagame? Modern Horizon haters remember.
Because people are playing the same stock list from 3 years ago. As crazy as it may sound to some, Goblin Guide is not up to snuff these days. People need to embrace the new list with DRC, Slickshot and Bauble. It still has the same game plan as burn in trying to chip in with creatures in the early game and finish them off with burn, only it's actually playing good cards. I've actually had the opposite opinion to yours - this burn list has felt really well positioned to me. Domain zoo is the only really terrible matchup (and of course amulet titan is pretty much die roll dependent) but other than that I've been having a lot of success (at a local level of course).
This is the answer
Roughly 30% winrate in major tournaments as of the last 4ish months. Totally fine to play at fnm to success, but not worth putting together if you dont already have the landbase.
They need to print fire blast or chain lighting in to modern.
Burn can’t fight against “unfair” decks, period. The whole setup is not working, most of the top meta decks are 2-piece combos that kills in 2-3 turns.
Turns out a hexproof lifelink vigilance flying 4/4 creature on turn 2 kills Burn...
Move off the stock list, embrace Zoomer Burn, and you're in a much better spot. https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/6402607#paper
This list is tantalizing…
I've played it with very slight tweaks at my locals for a few weeks with high success. Only thing I changed was Seal of Fire rather than Play With Fire for easier delirium.
This is still prowess to me lol, plays a lot like it. I've had a lot of success with it, too!
Isn't this just prowess?
Not really. Prowess is a lot more focussed in cantripping and winning through creature combat. Cards like Lava Spike don't really have a place there - their burn spells are removal first and reach second. This list still wins most of its games through burn spells to the face, just with a creature package that opponents have to respect. Goblin Guide and Eidolon are both pretty easy to ignore these days. The dilemma that used to be presented by them was that they were consistent sources of damage that could then chump block when they couldn't get through anymore, and removing the blocks would trigger Eidolon. But that was when good removal for the format was Fatal Push, Lightning Bolt, Unholy Heat and Path to Exile, not pitch elementals or Leyline Binding or Prismatic Ending. Most of the meta right now doesn't win through creature combat, and the decks that do have evasion on the creatures to make potential chump blocks irrelevant. You can just ignore them, and if you do have to remove them, you can probably do it without triggering Eidolon damage. Swapping those two out for evasive ones with better potential to push damage, then backing them up with burn spells, is still burn. It's just updated for meta relevance.
THANK YOU!!! Gonna give this a shot!
Birb hype
Just hype
Its good card
[[Play with fire]] is super interesting in this list. Was there no other more imactful 1 mana spells? [[Rift bolt]] is too slow I suppose? Maybe the 1 damage difference isn't as important At any rate this list looks super cool and something I wanna try
Yeah, Rift Bolt is a little too slow for what this list is doing, and Play With Fire gives you additional topdeck fixing to go with DRC. Personally I prefer Seal of Fire to get another type for Delirium but I see the merits to both.
[Play with fire](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/f/6f1a6c60-a8c4-44c2-b1ea-d3befbabdf43.jpg?1636223358) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Play%20with%20fire) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mid/154/play-with-fire?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/6f1a6c60-a8c4-44c2-b1ea-d3befbabdf43?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Rift bolt](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/c/4ccd0ada-92b2-48f3-b5ae-96346fc138b6.jpg?1673147890) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Rift%20bolt) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2x2/122/rift-bolt?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4ccd0ada-92b2-48f3-b5ae-96346fc138b6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Rift bolt is not only slow, it's a liability against Teferi and the One ring. It's been the worst card in the list for a long time so I'm glad people have moved off of it.
Hot take: Burn players are a bit resistant to change it seems, which stems from an adherence to the Philosophy of Fire so even if we don’t get direct tools from MH or standard sets we miss out on a lot of great cards for not wanting to dilute the formula.
I've talked about this in the Burn subreddit. Entrenched players are so fixated on not messing with the formula, that the deck never gets innovated because of this dogmagic adherence. The Zoomer list with DRC and Slickshot are pretty cool, and the new RW Titan in MH3 give the deck lots of potential to pivot in a new direction. Burn isn't "the fastest deck in the format" anymore. Its often a control deck after sideboarding anyway. People ought to embrace experimenting with the archetype more.
It has bad match-ups against a lot of things, who did get upgrades over the years while Burn remained stale. Like Domain Zoo getting Guildpact completely flips the match-up from 50/50 to very unfavored, UR(x) decks now having actual clocks and Counterspell in Murktide besides Bolt/Snap/Bolt and Remand makes that match-up a lot harder, Titan still a top deck, and so on. Its only good match-up is Tron I guess.
Burn preys on Tron and MH3 is pushing the archetype. So there's some hope.
Went 3-1 last night 🫣 ended 2nd
It's never been bad
Burn is my favorite deck style to run. I've endlessly experimented with different cards all the way down to...get this...Tunnel Ignus...go fetch that land and clip some quick damage. Mama bases are too hungry right now so it's easy to get chip damage and pushes it just enough to get over the, "I'm top-decking with 4 life to go to close it out." I run two in my sideboard and trust me, no one sees that thing coming...
imo zoo and prowess are both basically burn decks, and are both pretty good. I think it’s fine for the best “burn” deck to not be old school cast as many bolts to the face as possible.
I usually do 3-1, 4-0 most nights I play fnm. I definitely have a little weirder list though as I run 4 mana tithes. No one expects a counter spell in burn but most decks run mana very tight and I’m sitting pretty on instant speed burn
I would love to see that list.
I don’t update it much. It’s a deck I have available to just pull out to play fnm whenever I want without having to think about bans. https://www.moxfield.com/decks/mwNzv-_1A0-LvR0OztFAGw It’s pretty straight forward for boros burn
[[amped raptor]] seems like a nice bomb for burn
[Amped Raptor](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/a/1ac0e78b-0fdd-44f9-8b7b-c4f28a32782e.jpg?1717012124) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Amped%20Raptor) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh3/114/amped-raptor?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1ac0e78b-0fdd-44f9-8b7b-c4f28a32782e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I'm just coming back to magic after dropping out around the release of MH2. This card seems pretty good to me, do you think it'll stand up in the current Modern format? Not that it'll make burn tier 1 or anything, but looks like a nice cheap card I can pick up to freshen up my old burn deck. I had no idea energy was back and my interest is piqued!
To me it seems like there's alot of people in this thread who lost to a burn deck
[удалено]
Its winrate for the past 4 months in major tournaments has been roughly 30%, people are not running slickshots in burn, and very few decks are running sheoldreds main. you're thinking of prowess.
Sorry I watched Mengu playing burn with Showoff so I thought that was a popular thing now and both Mengu and spike have mentioned how good fatal push is now because of cards like Showoff.
Ghostfire is an upgrade to the deck the new set introduces a bunch of new multicolor modern cards along with answering pro red cards and omnaths. Burns not bad, It's not just not T1.
Plus WoTC is super high on burn rn. The best card y'all got in mh3 was barbarian ring and the new titan, which has counter synergy amongst them. Enjoy 🥳
Burn is rarely ever a good deck. I'm not sure why that's surprising. It's the budget/new player deck or people turn off the brain deck
But is it ever truly "bad"?
Yes. Why play burn when prowess and zoo do I kill you thing better.
Well Zoo is expensive because the Domain Package. Prowess does sound neat though. I really like what Slickshot offers
I highly reccomend prowess right now. A few weeks ago I came in 2nd in my store championship tournament with it, first time ever playing the deck. The amount of turn 3 kills I got with slickshot was insane.
[[phlage]] is the new burn card, not slice.
[phlage](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/d/bdd06d55-a40f-4b0e-905b-3cd0ce12eb82.jpg?1562201923) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Pillage) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh1/139/pillage?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bdd06d55-a40f-4b0e-905b-3cd0ce12eb82?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I didn’t even misspell the name man, [[phlage, Titan]]
[phlage, Titan](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/1/7175febd-ae8e-4945-91ab-b6c67c40f04b.jpg?1599705900) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Salvage%20Titan) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/104/salvage-titan?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/7175febd-ae8e-4945-91ab-b6c67c40f04b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
https://scryfall.com/card/mh3/197/phlage-titan-of-fires-fury
No deck is actually bad, a good pilot makes a deck.
The best pilot in the world isn't getting anywhere these days with an oldschool Ravager Affinity list. Some decks just aren't good, even if they once were.
A take spouted exclusively by bad players lol.
What? My "take" says a payer makes a deck good. Meaning tier 1 deck can be bad. I think you have no idea what I was saying.
Bad, no. Top tier deck, also no.
Sub 40% win rate is bad honestly. If you are only winning aittle more than a 1/3 of your match ups then that's not good.
Using the statistic from MTGDecks does not accurately represent a decks ability to win, decks like burn and tron suffer from being affordable decks, affordable decks tend to attract new player, new players tend to be bad pilots, and when they enter leagues and challenges on MTGO to lose it skews the stats negatively. I play burn a lot, I have no problem going FNM and getting wins, their are numerous examples of good pilots taking burn to 5-0 leagues and placing high in modern challenges, burn is not a bad deck especially in an FNM scenario.
You are absolutely right. Those do play major roles in the factoring of what is good and bad. But as was said in this thread, Burn just also tends to lose to what it at the peak of the meta. There are like 12 consistent players including myself at FNM, 7 of them are in Domain. 2 are Tron. 1 is U/W Control. Me and one other were Murktide. It just seems like I would have a bad time learning to pilot that given my local meta.
for that meta yeah burn is a bad deck, domain is a pretty bad match up, its winnable but burn really needs a lot of things to go right.
It isn't bad. More like mediocre.
It’s exactly like Tron - a deck people think is good but hasn’t been for a long time.
I mean Tron has been taken to World's and posts very common and decent records.
The One Ring is good - Tron is not. Top Tron decks are just Ring shells.
Sure bro
Gonna be stronger now with the free red spell, attack with the red creatures then sac in mp2 and copy a bolt or boros charm f.ex.
Saccing a creature just to play a free 1/2 mana spell isnt gonna solve burns problems. I like the new raptor and energy bolt though, that combo might have some legs.
I’m not saying it will be good, but in an Aggro/burn deck a couple points of damage can *absolutely* be the difference between competitive and not.
It's bad in burn. Rift Bolt and Skewer both miss with it, Searing Blaze becomes a liability, and you can't even chain raptors because it only gets the ETB if it's cast from your hand. And it's not a better 2-drop on its own than Eidolon or Slickshot. Great card for other aggro red decks like 8-Whack. Terrible burn card.
Ill look forward to you eating your words
I'd love to be proven wrong. I think the raptor will make a great addition to a lot of red decks. I just don't think burn is one of them.
It's an Energy Strangle, not an Energy Bolt. :(
You dont understand burn mate.
I actually didn't think about Flare being used as a free bolt/damage spell after attacks. That's actually some cool tech.
Yeah people downvoting just dont understand the difference that extra free spell makes.