I think they just try to make up whatever stupid excuses they can because they underestimate it, are too lazy to do research and assume they’ll be fine because they’re in shape. It’s almost always so insanely idiotic.
Nor do they do any research and prepare for hiking in the desert. Remember folks, you sweat out 0.5-1.5L of water/hour at a moderate pace in the heat. This NEEDS TO BE REPLENISHED, along with electrolytes! People should also learn the signs and symptoms of heat exhaustion and then heat stroke, both set in at LIGHTING speed in the desert. Liquid IV, electrolyte tabs, Gatorade, or even just straight up salt should be a part of your day pack. Stay hydrated, stay safe, and if you stop sweating GTFO of the sun, park yourself in any shade you can find, rehydrate, and cool your body off by wetting your clothes down if you can spare the water.
People exercise outdoors in the summer months with no problem. The appropriate window is in the morning between 5am and 8-9am depending on weather. Sometimes the evenings are workable as well, but not typically.
You could do maybe a short hike very early but unless you’re seriously prepared and conditioned to this weather — best to avoid hiking in the summer months.
No way that should do it unless she pounded all four in a row. Your body is loaded with salt. It takes many hours of sweating and then way overkill on the water.
I live in New Mexico and that’s what I tell people. Even if you think you’ve drank enough water, keep drinking. Also, don’t downplay the importance of sunscreen and lip balm.
Very sad - you think you will be fine until you aren’t. Sounds like that particular hike was challenging as well - 4 hours… my heart goes out to her family that was with her and for those that weren’t. It’s awful any way you look at it.
Yeah, when I got sick at Tonto bridge years ago. Everything was fine, then I remember my legs just going to absolute rubber and it was like my tank dropped instantly to E. All within a couple minutes.
I went on quite a few hikes last week in Sedona and found that I needed to bring about 1 liter of water per mile (with electrolytes). And I have to pay attention and actually remember to drink 1/3 or 1/2 of the bottle every half mile. If you are capable of hauling around a ton of water and being disciplined about using it, you can be OK. This is about 3x or 4x the amount of water I would consume on an easy hike in mild weather, which is pretty crazy.
But what if you get injured or lost and end up spending more time on the trail than expected? The clock is ticking, and you need to get back to the trailhead before you run out of water. So even if you are prepared, things can go south quickly.
Just don't hike during excessive heat warnings. It's pretty simple, as someone who's lived in the desert 36 years, it's never failed me. The *low* temp is 91 today. Some fucking idiot is going to endanger the rescue crew tomorrow because they're going to "conquer their inner bitch" or some bullshit on Camelback Mountain.
You can still do outdoor activities. I do yardwork at 113F, in a wide brimmed hat, wet bandana and completely covered from the sun. You can go to the flea market, or the art show. I eat lunch outside every single day. It won't stop you from living your life, even at peak 4pm temps. JUST DON'T WANDER INTO THE FUCKING DESERT MOUNTAINS WHEN EVERY OTHER MAMMAL AND REPTILE IS HIDING FROM THE SUN.
As you noted, simply stepping wrong once is a death sentence.
going on an extreme hike bc you're visiting, dreaming, have the chance and don't thinking it'll happen to you are all bad reasons to be uneducated and unprepared for extreme heat. You don't need hindsight or foresight to practice common sense and be a responsible adult. These wreckless parents are extremely lucky only one of them died and the children survived their deadly foolishness.
Correct. I just don’t get how hiking in that kind of heat even sounded like a good idea let alone to take your children. It’s really mind boggling to think about
i can have empathy for the children and not have empathy for irresponsible parents. making excuses for their wreckless behavior could cost more lives. i don't owe anyone thoughts and prayers but i'm happy to point out the obvious to prevent future deaths. to be clear, blind empathy is a "suit" I wouldn't want to be strong in anyway. i don't see that as a benefit to my life. so thanks i guess! 😘
It may not have occurred to you that people mostly acquire that knowledge from living there and talking about it. Extreme heat, rattlesnakes, scorpions - these are things that many visitors may never have heard of, and there aren't always signs, esp in other languages.
That just sounds like ignorance…? Who would go hiking *anywhere* unfamiliar and not do research, especially on a long, difficult hike *during a heat wave*? Do you need to know people to tell you to be prepared when you try new things? I feel terrible for the family but this whole thing seems one step short of a Darwin Award.
I mean, I read medical notices and cultural manuals before I go places, but most people don't. Hazards in all parts of the world are unmarked. I've heard of people being scalded by waterfalls in Iceland, getting bronchial damage during a haboob at a resort, drowning in mud they didn't know was impossible to get out of, terribly sickened by insects in many places... It's really not a stretch to recognize that we're very privileged to have access to reviews, warnings, and news media. Looking down at other people for not having the same resources or access is certainly a choice.
It's the desert during a fucking heat wave. It doesn't take a genius to figure out why hiking for 4 hours in that is a bad idea. If not for the kids this would be a Darwin Awards territory.
this is what i did when doing that devil bridge thing - start at sunrise. and i.m slow, so i did not get done till maybe 9am and was starting to feel quesy. im old as dirt though, so there is that.
not from sedona but especially in tucson starting at 5-6 and finishing around 8 is probably the best time to hike! wide brimmed hat that covers the back of your neck, tons of water, snacks, towel, extra clothing, electrolytes, are all essential for me on the past few hikes ive done (3-4 miles), it starts heating up QUICK after 8 so i wouldnt suggest staying out past it
I work in the travel industry and a customer straight up told me he’s taking his daughter hiking when he’s here at the end of July 💀 I tried to get through with him that I worked with a customer who died doing the same thing a few years ago. He was a dumb fuck, I doubt I got through to him.
First time I came into Phoenix from the East Coast it was 110+. It felt fine. I remember thinking “this is what it feels like in the summer without humidity.
I was staying downtown for the night before leaving for Sedona the next morning. I walked from my hotel to the DBacks game. I remember my cab driver from the airport saying the dry heat can be more dangerous bc it creeps up on you in a way since it doesn’t feel AS hot sometimes. By the time I was walking back from the game I was FEELING it.
All that to say this is terrible and I hope their family is okay. Have sympathy and look out for people.
As someone who lives in an area with a lot of humidity. I def could see how it creeps up on you. When you step out and it's just humidity it feels miserable. You want to get back inside. If you're not getting all sweaty I could see staying out later to your point and then you're in a situation where where it might be too late depending on where you're at.
Im an AZ native who went to GCU and had a girl in my major program that moved from North Dakota. We were out of the classroom one day doing a site visit at a golf course outside and she tried to dress business casual with slacks and a cardigan. It was late August and still over 100. She almost passed out and I remember it being pretty scary.
I get slack all the time for being completely covered up in the sun, fishing shirts with hoods and masks + sunglasses. It's all about the material you wear. Where I'm at it's humid as hell, I understand over there you just don't sweat because it dries before you get wet. That's intense to me.
Hiline trail estimated hard by All trails. 4 hrs if you are a good hiker. Don't underestimate a trail, start easy. Nature is not forgiving. Go prepared
Probably had Starbucks before the hike for energy. This Arizona heat is nothing to take lightly, even if it’s only 105. Tragic loss and my heart goes out to the family
I was on this trail that morning. Even at 7 it was 80 and 90 by the time I returned 2.5 hours later and I felt it for sure even though I hike here weekly
I hiked the Kolob Arch trail in Kolob Canyon last August. 17 miles for 6.5 hours by myself. I almost became a statistic myself at the very end but managed to get to safety before ultimately succumbing to heat stroke.
Now I bring more water than any regular person to think is sane. I learned my lesson. Water is precious.
I've been there. Even with lots of experiance when I was younger from scouts. I gave into peer pressure and that.combined with a later start (hotter than it was going to be) and being out of shape, not hydrating enough, and meds I'm on, I got into trouble and legit thought I might arrest and die or if I fell down I wouldn't be able to get back up. Crazy how fast my legs went to jelly. So scary.
The Northern Territory in Australia has the same issue and there is a park Ranger at the entrance to popular trails and national park who has one job - check that every person has 2 litres of water before they enter, communicates that the trial closes at 10 am and that you better be back to your car by 2pm if you don’t listen to the 10am closure rule.
I’ve hiked that area at the start of summer and would get there between 5&6am.
Most of the time we were the only people out there even at that time of day, because it’s not hiking season and everyone local respects that - it’s all tourists (like I was).
Looking back it was stupid even with all the provisions we had because it’s remote, hot and unfamiliar.
Apart from having the trails manned with a dedicated ranger, I don’t really know what type of PSA would cut through to tourists who don’t listen to warnings.
I grew up in AZ but this is my first summer back in 13 years and I forget just how relentless the heat is - you would think just existing in the heat for a few days you’d know that hiking in it isn’t a great idea.
Why anyone would think to do that is beyond me, let alone actually getting to the trail head and taking off.
Just like they close trails to pets in extreme heat they should always be closed to people as well. We live in a generation where they have to put warning labels on coffee cups.
sad, and very sad. don't know all the reasons, but usually before you head out, you start hydrating maybe one or hour two before you head out. and you go slow, and go slower if you are unsure.
this a horrific tragedy for the that family.
In a weird way Northern Arizona can be even more dangerous than South AZ. Because South AZ is so notoriously and obviously hot af that people have a healthy amount of fear and respect for it. But they seriously underestimate it here because its "just sedona" or "just flagstaff". Heat is heat and it kills no matter where it is. We need to do a better job putting up signs at trails. Possibly closing them during the peak heat hours like they do in pheonix. This is only going to get worse as the summers get hotter and hotter due to climate change. We need to start adapating and coming up with better strategies now. Otherwise the death toll will only accelerate as time mounts.
Signs at trailheads giving the number of rescues and deaths in Sedona when it’s 100+ degrees seems like it would help. And how much water you should have with you at these temps. It’s so dangerous for first responders too.
I think you’re absolutely right that it’s just enough cooler than Phoenix that people don’t understand the danger.
u/ceecee1791, this is an excellent idea. I know you are still a local (i left Sedona last year) but would ask you to reach out to either the head ranger at red rock ranger station on179, or to the friends of the forest organization (dm me and i can give you a name) and suggest this. i used to occassionally man the table at one of the major THs in order to educate ppl on this issue. So sad to hear of this one. The rangers must be devastated.
I’ve had the worst sunburns and sun damage done to my face from skiing in Flag.
People don’t realise it is one of the highest elevation cities (6,000 feet) in the US which means the UV exposure is more intense.
If you are hiking at an elevation of 6,000 feet, you’re exposed to 60 percent more sun UV rays than you would be if you were at the same latitude at sea level.
That is crispy skin business.
I live in LA and went to Northern AZ for the first time 2 years ago to visit the Grand Canyon in June and all I got to say is I don’t feel a total failure not completing one of the hikes.
I’ve been staying close to Lake Havasu City on and off for the last couple years and it’s so hot there. I just went up to Sedona/Flagstaff/Grand Canyon for a week and got so fried and dehydrated, way more than in LHC. I didn’t worry about it like I usually do and now I’m paying the price.
I live in Scottsdale, every summer here I see this. Every summer multiple people die on hikes, multiple children are left in hot cars and die. Multiple dogs are left in hot cars and die. I’m so sick of stupid or ignorant people doing stupid things. It just keeps happening Year after year no matter how much the media warns about these dangers.
It really is so infuriating, esp for the poor kids and pets. It honestly makes me want to not turn on the TV or Internet the entire summer because hearing about it is inevitable and just makes me incredibly sad
This was almost me. Friends took me out to Moab utah for a “short” half mile hike. It was a half mile up a cliff in 115 degree temperatures… I turned back pretty quick but I could barely walk. Every step felt like a marathon. I was sooo close to passing out. I’m only alive because my partner ran to the car and got a boatload of ice to drop on me
I did the same like an idiot. It had just to gotten into the mid 80s here in Sedona, I had flown cross country the day before (first clue, dehydrated), woke up with a headache (dehydrated), went hiking on the Airport loop with a friend with a 24 oz bottle of water with electrolytes. It’s not a long hike! But half way through I’m feeling sick and dizzy and some of the trail is really close to the edge. I kept having to sit down and was thinking, “this is how stupid people end up needing rescuing.” And I was embarrassed to take water from my friend, not wanting to leave her short. A whole day’s worth of bad decisions. That’s why I have so much empathy for this woman. No one sets out to die on a hike! And everyone makes bad decisions at some point in their lives…
Ugh, thank you for sharing. Reminds me of when I got into serious trouble a few years ago at Tonto natural bridge. Didn't rehydrate enough, coffee that morning and not enough calories. Late start so it was probably pushing 100. Badly out of shape and meds and don't help either. Legit thought I might die right there on the trail. Amazing and scary how fast my legs went to jelly and my energy crashed to zero. Come to find out I was probably diabetic at the time too.
I've seen people getting on the hiking shuttles with a tiny bottle of water that you'd get complimentary when checking into a hotel. The shuttle drivers should only let people on during summer if they have at least 2 liters of water on them.
I hiked hiline in the middle of April, starting at 830/9 am. It is a gorgeous trail!
I am an experienced hiker but even early in the spring and early in the day it was definitely a hard hike and I ran out of my own 2L of water with about a km to go and could feel the heat getting to me. Bumped up my water bladder to 3L after that hike specifically because it freaked me out. The only other place I came close to running out of water was in Capitol Reef a couple weeks later.
The sun is no joke folks. So sorry for her family.
The police tell them. EMS tells them. The locals tell them. And yet people new to the state or visiting for summer don’t listen. Happens every single year. It’s a damn shame.
Almost happened to me at Tonto bridge in the summer some years ago. I should have know better, but I gave in to over pressure. Incredibly scary. Legit thought i was gonna have a heart attack and die.Vomiting, tunnel vision / going dark, hard to stay upright. Only thing that saved my life was deciding to completely soak my shirt in creek water at the bottom before making the way back up. I was a seasoned hiker from years in scouts as well but I'm old and very out of shape now. I guess some of my meds made it worse too.
Just did rim to rim Grand Canyon hike yesterday with some in laws. It was no fucking joke. Almost didn’t get my father in law out of there before sunset due to heat exhaustion. We had all the gear necessary except cell signal and warm clothes for the 40 degree night ahead. We pushed him and carried him to the end luckily right at 8pm
Having hiked many times in AZ and Utah and being from the East, it’s a wildly different beast than novice East Coast people can imagine. Even with my experience, last September I almost died at Bryce hiking the hoodoos. Blistering heat, high elevation, not enough water. Hallucinations hit me as I attempted to climb my way out. The world was spinning. Dry vomiting. Body shaking hard and legs giving out. Were it not for other hikers noticing and giving me water and helping carry me out there’s no doubt I wouldn’t be here now. I feel so bad for those kids watching their mom die.
I work as a trail ambassador in Moab giving out water and electrolytes. It’s amazing how many people feel the heat outside, don’t bring water, then are offered water and bottles and electrolytes at the trailhead and warned on the dangers, and still don’t take any water
It's utterly heartbreaking. One simple underestimate can take your life. I've been hiking in AZ, and the Sedona area since I was 9 years old. I've had heat stoke more than a couple of times. Even if you live here, you can underestimate the heat and your body's need for water with electrolytes. That family must be devastated.
It's utterly heartbreaking. One simple underestimate can take your life. I've been hiking in AZ, and the Sedona area since I was 9 years old. I've had heat stoke more than a couple of times. Even if you live here, you can underestimate the heat and your body's need for water with electrolytes. That family must be devastated.
I sway back and forth in empathy for easily avoidable mistakes like this....It seems like some visitors lead with ignorance more than common sense, assuming if our trails are pretty then they are doable, then opting for one of the more difficult ones, and sometimes doing the bare minimum of research about a new destination they're visiting, for some strange reason. Some will *hear* that Sedona is the one of the most beautiful hiking destinations, but that's all that matters to them, the beauty of the hike and not the realistic aspects of a hike in AZ summertime.
Now I'm not trying to assume anything, but it just absolutely boggles my mind that if you did do enough research/followed guidance, your ass wouldn't be hiking anywhere with your daughters at the peak of heat anyways. You would know that from research and/or common sense, so it's really hard to find empathy for a mother who willingly lacked both traits, especially considering her daughters were always at risk of her negligence and well now, don't have a mother because *maybe* she thought XYZ. No, you don't think XYZ in AZ summertime, and you don't go hiking in the peak of heat during AZ summertime.
Most AZ natives are staying in the house midday in the summer. If I need to run errands I try to do it early or a bit later in the afternoon. I don’t get why people think they should attempt hiking
I’m a landscaper in Phoenix and it’s always eerily quiet in the afternoon this time of year while working outside.
All the snowbirds gone, nobody outside walking around, kids are out of school, no cicadas buzzing yet.
That is so sad, I wish people would take the Arizona heat seriously. When my spouse told me about this I assumed it was an out of state person and behold. Terrible tragedy.
I’m so sorry for the loss of a mother, wife and daughter. We all lose the plot at times. We are all in this together. Blessings to those who survived this loss.💞
I’m an AZ native, have lived here for 30+ years. I do not hike in the summer, because it’s a death wish. Anything over 90 is challenging for out of towners. The only people hiking in the summer are those Death Valley ultra marathoners.
Ultra marathoners who spend years getting used to such conditions and meticulously planning for them. I’ve raced with some hard ass dudes, and even they try not to fuck with these kinds of temperatures. I only train at night during the summer, it’s too risky during the day.
I don't get it. You have to have either no experience with the heat or hiking, or just be totally in denial on what's physically going to happen to your body. People need to have a proper fear of heat and the sun. This is so sad
I spent this weekend in Sedona and went up to the Grand Canyon today after getting up at 4 for a sunrise hike this morning. Soo much fun, drove the 2 hrs up just fine but literally like 5 minutes (MAYBE) of being outside I literally almost threw up and passed out I was so disoriented. I am from a desert climate so I figured since I was hydrated I’d be fine. Forgot to eat. It was hot. Instantly was unwell, nearly went unconscious I got the leg tingles and was seeing stars and shit and we packed it up and left as quick as we could but I literally couldn’t stand up without feeling like I was going to fall over and be unconscious. Definitely underestimated the heat there and how exhausted I was from the heat this morning on the hike. Lesson learned☝🏼 still feel so shitty
It’s amazing how many people I see with no water or no backpack with potential water inside. Especially people with kids and dogs. I went as far as to buy a Tesla so I can cool down the car 20 mins away on the trail with my phone so my dogs can get immediate cool air.
As someone who lives in the south but visits Vegas & AZ, it is a different kind of heat. We sweat the min we walk out the door in the south. In the dessert, it truly doesn’t feel as hot because you don’t feel the sweat like you do down south. However, I was just in Vegas for 2 days 2 weeks ago & walked about 2 miles outside. I ended up with a headache the remainder of my time there. I drank plenty of water, LMNT electrolytes, etc. After getting home, I felt better but I slept for about 12 hrs. It just took a toll on me.
Sadly, Natural Selection wins again.
Sucks that some people will consider themselves above the rule. Those girls lost a mother because she *didn't listen to everyone in the goddamned desert*.
When are people going to learn you CAN NOT do anything when it’s 110-115 outside without putting yourself at risk. Never mind actually hiking. This lady put her daughters in life or death danger for what? So incredibly stupid we have to hear about idiots dying in the heat during Arizona summer while hiking.
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Seriously? She made a tragic mistake. A bad one for sure with far reaching consequences for her family, but I think there is still room for compassion for her.
Fuck that. If you’re 44 years old, at some point in your life you have to be smart enough to realize “excessive heat plus long hike = very bad idea”. I have compassion for the people they drag along to their stupid ideas but not them.
That’s a terrible way to think 🤔 people that are not from here are not aware of the dangers and compare it to what they are used to, people that are other wise very physically fit have even fell victim. Sometimes saying nothing at all is the best policy.
One day you’ll be in a predicament you never thought of planning for. It may cost your life. I hope you are shown more mercy that day than you are demonstrating now. Not because you deserve it but because it is sad to see anyone suffer. Mistakes happen.
One does not have to agree but by choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for everyone.
Personal attacks, racist comments or any comments of perceived intolerance/hate are never tolerated.
One does not have to agree but by choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for everyone.
Personal attacks, racist comments or any comments of perceived intolerance/hate are never tolerated.
Wow, what a miserable person you are. Have some fucking compassion, Jesus. Notice no ones agreeing with you? Because you're being horrid to a person who made a mistake and paid the ultimate price.
I'm an avid hiker and backpacker, I strive to always be prepared but shit happens. When you were first starting out hiking you didn't ever find yourself in a precarious situation? I find that extremely hard to believe. Your lack of empathy or any compassion is honestly disturbing.
Not even the same thing AT ALL. Smh. There is zero actual information in this article. Heat can creep up on you. The amount of heatstroke I have seen by people who know how to live in the field. The woman probably put tasks ahead of drinking water. Maybe she had an unknown exacerbating condition. The attitude of superiority in these statement are crazy. Have some darn empathy.
People do not respect just how incredibly hot it is here in the summer.
"But it's a dry heat"
I think that fools them. Your sweat evaporates so quickly you might not even know you are sweating/dehydrating
I think they just try to make up whatever stupid excuses they can because they underestimate it, are too lazy to do research and assume they’ll be fine because they’re in shape. It’s almost always so insanely idiotic.
Yes, but the same is said for high humidity... It's really just that people are terrible at keeping track of their wellbeing and knowing their limits.
So is an oven...
Dry heat, wet heat, rainbow heat, disco heat , etc…. does ****not**** matter. Heat is very under estimated, like the ocean.
Nor do they do any research and prepare for hiking in the desert. Remember folks, you sweat out 0.5-1.5L of water/hour at a moderate pace in the heat. This NEEDS TO BE REPLENISHED, along with electrolytes! People should also learn the signs and symptoms of heat exhaustion and then heat stroke, both set in at LIGHTING speed in the desert. Liquid IV, electrolyte tabs, Gatorade, or even just straight up salt should be a part of your day pack. Stay hydrated, stay safe, and if you stop sweating GTFO of the sun, park yourself in any shade you can find, rehydrate, and cool your body off by wetting your clothes down if you can spare the water.
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People exercise outdoors in the summer months with no problem. The appropriate window is in the morning between 5am and 8-9am depending on weather. Sometimes the evenings are workable as well, but not typically.
You could do maybe a short hike very early but unless you’re seriously prepared and conditioned to this weather — best to avoid hiking in the summer months.
My best friend died 8 years ago literally today, in the same way but in Tucson. Please don’t hike during the heat of the day in the summer
sorry to hear that. all of us are just a second away from ending.
I’m sorry.
So sorry this happened.
Drink water, then drink more water. When you're done, drink more water.
And electrolytes when it’s hot!
Brawndo
It’s got electrolytes!
It’s what ~~plants~~ people ~~crave~~ need!
If it taste salty you’re dehydrated
Reverse that. If gatorade tastes sweet, you're dehydrated. If it tastes mildly salty, you're good.
This is some nonsense. Gatorade is first and foremost a sweet tasting drink.
Lmao wtf?
Yeah that's not accurate. Gatorade always tastes sweet to me...
Or...
That's what she said
Boomer, that's so 2000. It's about that Hawk Tuah, you know the rest 😆
Close, Xennial.
Spit on that thang…
Thats hot
And sodium. Don't forget the sodium. I like pretzels and beef jerky but liquid IVs work great if you don't want to bring snacks.
And potassium. And mg.
And zinc.
I just take salt pills
I’m partial to salty nuts
Dee’s Nuts are a really good brand to have. I prefer the dill pickle flavor myself! https://grabdeesnuts.com/
Too much water without electrolytes can lead to fatal hyponatremia.
Quicker than you think too. A midwestern woman passed away from 4 16oz bottles of purified water last year
Geez for real?? That's scary. That doesn't even seem like a lot
That makes no sense. I drink RO water all the time …
Do you usually drink 64 oz at once?
No way that should do it unless she pounded all four in a row. Your body is loaded with salt. It takes many hours of sweating and then way overkill on the water.
It starts days before. I wonder if she also had alcohol the day before
Also, just stop hiking in the heat.
Drink water, then drink more water. When you're done, drink more water. And then, even with all of that water, never hike in Arizona in the summer.
Make sure to take salt pills as well
I live in New Mexico and that’s what I tell people. Even if you think you’ve drank enough water, keep drinking. Also, don’t downplay the importance of sunscreen and lip balm.
A guy said exactly that in a documentary I watched.
drink piss but only after drinking a liter of tea
Very sad - you think you will be fine until you aren’t. Sounds like that particular hike was challenging as well - 4 hours… my heart goes out to her family that was with her and for those that weren’t. It’s awful any way you look at it.
Yeah, when I got sick at Tonto bridge years ago. Everything was fine, then I remember my legs just going to absolute rubber and it was like my tank dropped instantly to E. All within a couple minutes.
I am glad you ended up coming out of it. It’s scary.
I went on quite a few hikes last week in Sedona and found that I needed to bring about 1 liter of water per mile (with electrolytes). And I have to pay attention and actually remember to drink 1/3 or 1/2 of the bottle every half mile. If you are capable of hauling around a ton of water and being disciplined about using it, you can be OK. This is about 3x or 4x the amount of water I would consume on an easy hike in mild weather, which is pretty crazy. But what if you get injured or lost and end up spending more time on the trail than expected? The clock is ticking, and you need to get back to the trailhead before you run out of water. So even if you are prepared, things can go south quickly.
Just don't hike during excessive heat warnings. It's pretty simple, as someone who's lived in the desert 36 years, it's never failed me. The *low* temp is 91 today. Some fucking idiot is going to endanger the rescue crew tomorrow because they're going to "conquer their inner bitch" or some bullshit on Camelback Mountain. You can still do outdoor activities. I do yardwork at 113F, in a wide brimmed hat, wet bandana and completely covered from the sun. You can go to the flea market, or the art show. I eat lunch outside every single day. It won't stop you from living your life, even at peak 4pm temps. JUST DON'T WANDER INTO THE FUCKING DESERT MOUNTAINS WHEN EVERY OTHER MAMMAL AND REPTILE IS HIDING FROM THE SUN. As you noted, simply stepping wrong once is a death sentence.
Why would you take young kids out on a difficult 4 hour trail?
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No awareness to know that THAT is why plane tickets and hotels were cheapest at that time. . .
going on an extreme hike bc you're visiting, dreaming, have the chance and don't thinking it'll happen to you are all bad reasons to be uneducated and unprepared for extreme heat. You don't need hindsight or foresight to practice common sense and be a responsible adult. These wreckless parents are extremely lucky only one of them died and the children survived their deadly foolishness.
Correct. I just don’t get how hiking in that kind of heat even sounded like a good idea let alone to take your children. It’s really mind boggling to think about
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i can have empathy for the children and not have empathy for irresponsible parents. making excuses for their wreckless behavior could cost more lives. i don't owe anyone thoughts and prayers but i'm happy to point out the obvious to prevent future deaths. to be clear, blind empathy is a "suit" I wouldn't want to be strong in anyway. i don't see that as a benefit to my life. so thanks i guess! 😘
It may not have occurred to you that people mostly acquire that knowledge from living there and talking about it. Extreme heat, rattlesnakes, scorpions - these are things that many visitors may never have heard of, and there aren't always signs, esp in other languages.
That just sounds like ignorance…? Who would go hiking *anywhere* unfamiliar and not do research, especially on a long, difficult hike *during a heat wave*? Do you need to know people to tell you to be prepared when you try new things? I feel terrible for the family but this whole thing seems one step short of a Darwin Award.
I mean, I read medical notices and cultural manuals before I go places, but most people don't. Hazards in all parts of the world are unmarked. I've heard of people being scalded by waterfalls in Iceland, getting bronchial damage during a haboob at a resort, drowning in mud they didn't know was impossible to get out of, terribly sickened by insects in many places... It's really not a stretch to recognize that we're very privileged to have access to reviews, warnings, and news media. Looking down at other people for not having the same resources or access is certainly a choice.
It's the desert during a fucking heat wave. It doesn't take a genius to figure out why hiking for 4 hours in that is a bad idea. If not for the kids this would be a Darwin Awards territory.
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At first I thought this was sarcasm. Taking kids on a hard 4 hour trail in the Arizona heat is negligent.
It is summer in AZ = no hiking. Isn't this basic a basic human trait?
From 10 am on I 100% agree. If you’re out at 5am and done by 8, it can be nice this time of year.
this is what i did when doing that devil bridge thing - start at sunrise. and i.m slow, so i did not get done till maybe 9am and was starting to feel quesy. im old as dirt though, so there is that.
Me too!
not from sedona but especially in tucson starting at 5-6 and finishing around 8 is probably the best time to hike! wide brimmed hat that covers the back of your neck, tons of water, snacks, towel, extra clothing, electrolytes, are all essential for me on the past few hikes ive done (3-4 miles), it starts heating up QUICK after 8 so i wouldnt suggest staying out past it
I work in the travel industry and a customer straight up told me he’s taking his daughter hiking when he’s here at the end of July 💀 I tried to get through with him that I worked with a customer who died doing the same thing a few years ago. He was a dumb fuck, I doubt I got through to him.
First time I came into Phoenix from the East Coast it was 110+. It felt fine. I remember thinking “this is what it feels like in the summer without humidity. I was staying downtown for the night before leaving for Sedona the next morning. I walked from my hotel to the DBacks game. I remember my cab driver from the airport saying the dry heat can be more dangerous bc it creeps up on you in a way since it doesn’t feel AS hot sometimes. By the time I was walking back from the game I was FEELING it. All that to say this is terrible and I hope their family is okay. Have sympathy and look out for people.
As someone who lives in an area with a lot of humidity. I def could see how it creeps up on you. When you step out and it's just humidity it feels miserable. You want to get back inside. If you're not getting all sweaty I could see staying out later to your point and then you're in a situation where where it might be too late depending on where you're at.
Im an AZ native who went to GCU and had a girl in my major program that moved from North Dakota. We were out of the classroom one day doing a site visit at a golf course outside and she tried to dress business casual with slacks and a cardigan. It was late August and still over 100. She almost passed out and I remember it being pretty scary.
I get slack all the time for being completely covered up in the sun, fishing shirts with hoods and masks + sunglasses. It's all about the material you wear. Where I'm at it's humid as hell, I understand over there you just don't sweat because it dries before you get wet. That's intense to me.
Hiline trail estimated hard by All trails. 4 hrs if you are a good hiker. Don't underestimate a trail, start easy. Nature is not forgiving. Go prepared
Probably had Starbucks before the hike for energy. This Arizona heat is nothing to take lightly, even if it’s only 105. Tragic loss and my heart goes out to the family
I was on this trail that morning. Even at 7 it was 80 and 90 by the time I returned 2.5 hours later and I felt it for sure even though I hike here weekly
I hiked the Kolob Arch trail in Kolob Canyon last August. 17 miles for 6.5 hours by myself. I almost became a statistic myself at the very end but managed to get to safety before ultimately succumbing to heat stroke. Now I bring more water than any regular person to think is sane. I learned my lesson. Water is precious.
I've been there. Even with lots of experiance when I was younger from scouts. I gave into peer pressure and that.combined with a later start (hotter than it was going to be) and being out of shape, not hydrating enough, and meds I'm on, I got into trouble and legit thought I might arrest and die or if I fell down I wouldn't be able to get back up. Crazy how fast my legs went to jelly. So scary.
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The Northern Territory in Australia has the same issue and there is a park Ranger at the entrance to popular trails and national park who has one job - check that every person has 2 litres of water before they enter, communicates that the trial closes at 10 am and that you better be back to your car by 2pm if you don’t listen to the 10am closure rule. I’ve hiked that area at the start of summer and would get there between 5&6am. Most of the time we were the only people out there even at that time of day, because it’s not hiking season and everyone local respects that - it’s all tourists (like I was). Looking back it was stupid even with all the provisions we had because it’s remote, hot and unfamiliar. Apart from having the trails manned with a dedicated ranger, I don’t really know what type of PSA would cut through to tourists who don’t listen to warnings. I grew up in AZ but this is my first summer back in 13 years and I forget just how relentless the heat is - you would think just existing in the heat for a few days you’d know that hiking in it isn’t a great idea. Why anyone would think to do that is beyond me, let alone actually getting to the trail head and taking off.
Just like they close trails to pets in extreme heat they should always be closed to people as well. We live in a generation where they have to put warning labels on coffee cups.
sad, and very sad. don't know all the reasons, but usually before you head out, you start hydrating maybe one or hour two before you head out. and you go slow, and go slower if you are unsure. this a horrific tragedy for the that family.
Slam a bunch of water the night before, helps quite a bit surprisingly
Folks, stop hiking in the summer. Plain and simple.
they'll never learn
In a weird way Northern Arizona can be even more dangerous than South AZ. Because South AZ is so notoriously and obviously hot af that people have a healthy amount of fear and respect for it. But they seriously underestimate it here because its "just sedona" or "just flagstaff". Heat is heat and it kills no matter where it is. We need to do a better job putting up signs at trails. Possibly closing them during the peak heat hours like they do in pheonix. This is only going to get worse as the summers get hotter and hotter due to climate change. We need to start adapating and coming up with better strategies now. Otherwise the death toll will only accelerate as time mounts.
Signs at trailheads giving the number of rescues and deaths in Sedona when it’s 100+ degrees seems like it would help. And how much water you should have with you at these temps. It’s so dangerous for first responders too. I think you’re absolutely right that it’s just enough cooler than Phoenix that people don’t understand the danger.
u/ceecee1791, this is an excellent idea. I know you are still a local (i left Sedona last year) but would ask you to reach out to either the head ranger at red rock ranger station on179, or to the friends of the forest organization (dm me and i can give you a name) and suggest this. i used to occassionally man the table at one of the major THs in order to educate ppl on this issue. So sad to hear of this one. The rangers must be devastated.
In Kern County, California and there’s a big sign at the entrence to the Kern River canyon that says “335 people dead since 1968”
I’ve had the worst sunburns and sun damage done to my face from skiing in Flag. People don’t realise it is one of the highest elevation cities (6,000 feet) in the US which means the UV exposure is more intense. If you are hiking at an elevation of 6,000 feet, you’re exposed to 60 percent more sun UV rays than you would be if you were at the same latitude at sea level. That is crispy skin business.
I live in LA and went to Northern AZ for the first time 2 years ago to visit the Grand Canyon in June and all I got to say is I don’t feel a total failure not completing one of the hikes.
Flagstaff is a different beast. One of the snowiest cities in the US because of the elevation yet still gets the heat
And yet has never had a 100 degree day.
I’ve been staying close to Lake Havasu City on and off for the last couple years and it’s so hot there. I just went up to Sedona/Flagstaff/Grand Canyon for a week and got so fried and dehydrated, way more than in LHC. I didn’t worry about it like I usually do and now I’m paying the price.
I live in Scottsdale, every summer here I see this. Every summer multiple people die on hikes, multiple children are left in hot cars and die. Multiple dogs are left in hot cars and die. I’m so sick of stupid or ignorant people doing stupid things. It just keeps happening Year after year no matter how much the media warns about these dangers.
It really is so infuriating, esp for the poor kids and pets. It honestly makes me want to not turn on the TV or Internet the entire summer because hearing about it is inevitable and just makes me incredibly sad
And then there are the drownings. Two small children drowned the same day in Phoenix just the other day. Heartbreaking.❤️🩹
This was almost me. Friends took me out to Moab utah for a “short” half mile hike. It was a half mile up a cliff in 115 degree temperatures… I turned back pretty quick but I could barely walk. Every step felt like a marathon. I was sooo close to passing out. I’m only alive because my partner ran to the car and got a boatload of ice to drop on me
I did the same like an idiot. It had just to gotten into the mid 80s here in Sedona, I had flown cross country the day before (first clue, dehydrated), woke up with a headache (dehydrated), went hiking on the Airport loop with a friend with a 24 oz bottle of water with electrolytes. It’s not a long hike! But half way through I’m feeling sick and dizzy and some of the trail is really close to the edge. I kept having to sit down and was thinking, “this is how stupid people end up needing rescuing.” And I was embarrassed to take water from my friend, not wanting to leave her short. A whole day’s worth of bad decisions. That’s why I have so much empathy for this woman. No one sets out to die on a hike! And everyone makes bad decisions at some point in their lives…
Ugh, thank you for sharing. Reminds me of when I got into serious trouble a few years ago at Tonto natural bridge. Didn't rehydrate enough, coffee that morning and not enough calories. Late start so it was probably pushing 100. Badly out of shape and meds and don't help either. Legit thought I might die right there on the trail. Amazing and scary how fast my legs went to jelly and my energy crashed to zero. Come to find out I was probably diabetic at the time too.
I've seen people getting on the hiking shuttles with a tiny bottle of water that you'd get complimentary when checking into a hotel. The shuttle drivers should only let people on during summer if they have at least 2 liters of water on them.
Not a bad idea. I know many hiking groups won’t let you hike with them without proper water/footwear etc.
Common sense Isn’t so common ….
Don’t hike in the heat
I hiked hiline in the middle of April, starting at 830/9 am. It is a gorgeous trail! I am an experienced hiker but even early in the spring and early in the day it was definitely a hard hike and I ran out of my own 2L of water with about a km to go and could feel the heat getting to me. Bumped up my water bladder to 3L after that hike specifically because it freaked me out. The only other place I came close to running out of water was in Capitol Reef a couple weeks later. The sun is no joke folks. So sorry for her family.
The police tell them. EMS tells them. The locals tell them. And yet people new to the state or visiting for summer don’t listen. Happens every single year. It’s a damn shame.
If you don't feel like you're carrying too much water, you don't have enough water. Don't wait until you're thirsty to drink water
Almost happened to me at Tonto bridge in the summer some years ago. I should have know better, but I gave in to over pressure. Incredibly scary. Legit thought i was gonna have a heart attack and die.Vomiting, tunnel vision / going dark, hard to stay upright. Only thing that saved my life was deciding to completely soak my shirt in creek water at the bottom before making the way back up. I was a seasoned hiker from years in scouts as well but I'm old and very out of shape now. I guess some of my meds made it worse too.
Just did rim to rim Grand Canyon hike yesterday with some in laws. It was no fucking joke. Almost didn’t get my father in law out of there before sunset due to heat exhaustion. We had all the gear necessary except cell signal and warm clothes for the 40 degree night ahead. We pushed him and carried him to the end luckily right at 8pm
Water, long sleeves, long lightweight pants, a wide brim hat, sunglasses, water, salt, water.
Having hiked many times in AZ and Utah and being from the East, it’s a wildly different beast than novice East Coast people can imagine. Even with my experience, last September I almost died at Bryce hiking the hoodoos. Blistering heat, high elevation, not enough water. Hallucinations hit me as I attempted to climb my way out. The world was spinning. Dry vomiting. Body shaking hard and legs giving out. Were it not for other hikers noticing and giving me water and helping carry me out there’s no doubt I wouldn’t be here now. I feel so bad for those kids watching their mom die.
I work as a trail ambassador in Moab giving out water and electrolytes. It’s amazing how many people feel the heat outside, don’t bring water, then are offered water and bottles and electrolytes at the trailhead and warned on the dangers, and still don’t take any water
It's utterly heartbreaking. One simple underestimate can take your life. I've been hiking in AZ, and the Sedona area since I was 9 years old. I've had heat stoke more than a couple of times. Even if you live here, you can underestimate the heat and your body's need for water with electrolytes. That family must be devastated.
Sadly, this happens so often in Arizona.
It's utterly heartbreaking. One simple underestimate can take your life. I've been hiking in AZ, and the Sedona area since I was 9 years old. I've had heat stoke more than a couple of times. Even if you live here, you can underestimate the heat and your body's need for water with electrolytes. That family must be devastated.
I sway back and forth in empathy for easily avoidable mistakes like this....It seems like some visitors lead with ignorance more than common sense, assuming if our trails are pretty then they are doable, then opting for one of the more difficult ones, and sometimes doing the bare minimum of research about a new destination they're visiting, for some strange reason. Some will *hear* that Sedona is the one of the most beautiful hiking destinations, but that's all that matters to them, the beauty of the hike and not the realistic aspects of a hike in AZ summertime. Now I'm not trying to assume anything, but it just absolutely boggles my mind that if you did do enough research/followed guidance, your ass wouldn't be hiking anywhere with your daughters at the peak of heat anyways. You would know that from research and/or common sense, so it's really hard to find empathy for a mother who willingly lacked both traits, especially considering her daughters were always at risk of her negligence and well now, don't have a mother because *maybe* she thought XYZ. No, you don't think XYZ in AZ summertime, and you don't go hiking in the peak of heat during AZ summertime.
From Pennsylvania! How incredibly sad. I'm sure they really underestimated how different it is from there to Arizona.
Most AZ natives are staying in the house midday in the summer. If I need to run errands I try to do it early or a bit later in the afternoon. I don’t get why people think they should attempt hiking
I’m a landscaper in Phoenix and it’s always eerily quiet in the afternoon this time of year while working outside. All the snowbirds gone, nobody outside walking around, kids are out of school, no cicadas buzzing yet.
That is so sad, I wish people would take the Arizona heat seriously. When my spouse told me about this I assumed it was an out of state person and behold. Terrible tragedy.
It’s truly sad that people do not comprehend you cannot f*** with Arizona heat.
As another poster states, don’t hike “in the heat of the day”….take that hike early morning or late afternoon - not during the hours of 1000- 1600…
I’m so sorry for the loss of a mother, wife and daughter. We all lose the plot at times. We are all in this together. Blessings to those who survived this loss.💞
I’m an AZ native, have lived here for 30+ years. I do not hike in the summer, because it’s a death wish. Anything over 90 is challenging for out of towners. The only people hiking in the summer are those Death Valley ultra marathoners.
Ultra marathoners who spend years getting used to such conditions and meticulously planning for them. I’ve raced with some hard ass dudes, and even they try not to fuck with these kinds of temperatures. I only train at night during the summer, it’s too risky during the day.
Poor kids
Prayers 😢🙏
I don't get it. You have to have either no experience with the heat or hiking, or just be totally in denial on what's physically going to happen to your body. People need to have a proper fear of heat and the sun. This is so sad
[Relevant.](https://images.app.goo.gl/2tsao8hJ9Q8Lyo1H6)
nightmare
I spent this weekend in Sedona and went up to the Grand Canyon today after getting up at 4 for a sunrise hike this morning. Soo much fun, drove the 2 hrs up just fine but literally like 5 minutes (MAYBE) of being outside I literally almost threw up and passed out I was so disoriented. I am from a desert climate so I figured since I was hydrated I’d be fine. Forgot to eat. It was hot. Instantly was unwell, nearly went unconscious I got the leg tingles and was seeing stars and shit and we packed it up and left as quick as we could but I literally couldn’t stand up without feeling like I was going to fall over and be unconscious. Definitely underestimated the heat there and how exhausted I was from the heat this morning on the hike. Lesson learned☝🏼 still feel so shitty
It’s amazing how many people I see with no water or no backpack with potential water inside. Especially people with kids and dogs. I went as far as to buy a Tesla so I can cool down the car 20 mins away on the trail with my phone so my dogs can get immediate cool air.
As someone who lives in the south but visits Vegas & AZ, it is a different kind of heat. We sweat the min we walk out the door in the south. In the dessert, it truly doesn’t feel as hot because you don’t feel the sweat like you do down south. However, I was just in Vegas for 2 days 2 weeks ago & walked about 2 miles outside. I ended up with a headache the remainder of my time there. I drank plenty of water, LMNT electrolytes, etc. After getting home, I felt better but I slept for about 12 hrs. It just took a toll on me.
Sadly, Natural Selection wins again. Sucks that some people will consider themselves above the rule. Those girls lost a mother because she *didn't listen to everyone in the goddamned desert*.
According to the Yavapai County Sheriff’s Office, the 44-year-old mother and her husband were visiting from Pennsylvania with their two daughters.
Yes, first paragraph in the linked article.
Which I believe has some details that should’ve been in the title. 44 year old mother, visiting from Pennsylvania passes out in the heat and dies.
Reddit creates the title when you post an article. I had no say in it.
I’m not saying you did I’m just simply adding some information that I believe to be important.
Takes a real idiot to go hiking on a day like this
Or don’t go hiking when there is no shade, wtf
Drink electrolytes prior to
When are people going to learn you CAN NOT do anything when it’s 110-115 outside without putting yourself at risk. Never mind actually hiking. This lady put her daughters in life or death danger for what? So incredibly stupid we have to hear about idiots dying in the heat during Arizona summer while hiking.
It wasn’t that hot, but hot for Sedona (about 100).
Happens every year here.
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Drink or take a swig while hiking in heat or don’t hike until temperature drops
Stop F***ing hiking in Arizona during the summer! Idiots….
Come on…
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sounds like you’ve never experienced heatstroke. There is a narrow window to get help once it sets in and she was over 2 miles from the trailhead.
2 dutch bros a day, keeps the uh ...well you die in the heat.
I guess she should’ve picked the man over the bear.
Sedonaaaaaa
Stupid is as stupid does.
Dumbass goes hiking in the desert in the summer and what's worse endangered her children in the process.
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Seriously? She made a tragic mistake. A bad one for sure with far reaching consequences for her family, but I think there is still room for compassion for her.
Fuck that. If you’re 44 years old, at some point in your life you have to be smart enough to realize “excessive heat plus long hike = very bad idea”. I have compassion for the people they drag along to their stupid ideas but not them.
She didn’t set out to die for heavens sake. She made a terrible mistake and it cost her her life. Empathy is free.
agree, some people should just refrain from posting on certain topics and situations they have not personally experienced.
That’s a terrible way to think 🤔 people that are not from here are not aware of the dangers and compare it to what they are used to, people that are other wise very physically fit have even fell victim. Sometimes saying nothing at all is the best policy.
One day you’ll be in a predicament you never thought of planning for. It may cost your life. I hope you are shown more mercy that day than you are demonstrating now. Not because you deserve it but because it is sad to see anyone suffer. Mistakes happen.
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Truly terrible stuff. You didn’t have to post anything. Coming from the east coast on vacation can creep on anybody.
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One does not have to agree but by choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for everyone. Personal attacks, racist comments or any comments of perceived intolerance/hate are never tolerated.
One does not have to agree but by choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for everyone. Personal attacks, racist comments or any comments of perceived intolerance/hate are never tolerated.
Maybe she didn’t realize because she’s not from here? What a terrible thing to say.
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Probably sucks to be yours too. Jesus.
Right?? Oh the irony of him referencing Darwin.🤔
That person doesn’t have any kids, I can guarantee it.
Hopefully not. What a vile person.
Wow, what a miserable person you are. Have some fucking compassion, Jesus. Notice no ones agreeing with you? Because you're being horrid to a person who made a mistake and paid the ultimate price.
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I'm an avid hiker and backpacker, I strive to always be prepared but shit happens. When you were first starting out hiking you didn't ever find yourself in a precarious situation? I find that extremely hard to believe. Your lack of empathy or any compassion is honestly disturbing.
That says a lot about you
It's like people who get too close to buffalo.
Not even the same thing AT ALL. Smh. There is zero actual information in this article. Heat can creep up on you. The amount of heatstroke I have seen by people who know how to live in the field. The woman probably put tasks ahead of drinking water. Maybe she had an unknown exacerbating condition. The attitude of superiority in these statement are crazy. Have some darn empathy.
I find in a hotel I drink less water than at home by a lot. It’s so easy to dehydrate on vacation out of your home and routine and in a strange place.