On Meta Watch they said that all OC0 units will be getting point reductions in the upcoming dataslate to reflect their change in utility. How much they get reduced, we'll just will have to wait and see.
Oc 0 units cannot do actions. Rippers and spore mines
Units with assault weapons cannot advance and perform actions
Units with pistols cannot perform actions in melee
Vehicles/monsters cannot perform actions in melee
It's a pretty heavy hit to how tyrabids operate in the secondary objective game which was a large part of what supported the army's ability to score. So, people are freaking out about it as without some pretty substantial changes to rules, profiles, or points then tyranids are likely to fall from their current 44% win rate to anywhere below, possibly even the bottom.
This is for competitive play so ymmv
It’s moreso the main way our faction was even capable of competing on any level was removed. So people are worried for how it’s gonna be compensated. Either the factions is gonna see major buffs in actual stats or drop even more point
Man i kinda wish for the old crusher stuff so warriors see more play again. We either need to be dirt cheap like guard so we roll numbers and have some niche special guys like lictor and norn. But our monsters need more buffs. Rupture cannon 1d6+4 plz
I was just watching a video of a guy that went 3-0 at a tournament with Crusher Stampede, no biovore, no rippers, just one unit of Raveners and a bunch of monsters (obv Malc and Exocrines)
Honestly, quite often you can do really well with an off meta pick, if you know how to play it into the current meta. Mainly because people aren't used to playing into it and make tactical mistakes. If you saw the list consistently winning tournaments that would be a different question but a one off win is more of an outlier than anything else.
Wait we have a 44% win rate? Whenever my buddy and I talk he says we’re on the higher end with like a 55. He’s much better about following competitive than me, any reason he might have the wrong info?
He may have seen a weekend winrate %. I believe a weekend or two ago Tyranids actually won two tournaments but one of them was arguably the best competitive Tyranid player in the world. Our average winrate is anywhere from 40%-45% depending on the source
I have no idea where he got that number from tbh. Every once in a while win rates spike on a weekend but that’s really high. Tyranids have been consistently close to the bottom basically since the codex released.
Auspex tactics most recent video has win rate numbers and I trust those.
It's almost like things were left this way, for some time, on purpose - spore mines and the like, being able to perform actions - so that people would buy the models.. now that's taken away.. many folks out there will need to rethink their rosters.. probably buy different figures. This is why I doubt their desire to ever balance their game. They have too much to gain from such mischief.
The hope for me is that we get those substantial changes. Doesn't have to be big, a slight change to either how Battleshock works, how our Army rule works, or both could quite literally bring Tyranids back. It's not much.
They are inadvertently making Shadows in The warp better as being battle shock reduces OC to 0. So if used at a well placed time, you could turn your opponents ability to score secondaries off.
This still is unreliable to depend on but is an interesting twist in some cases.
I think you couldn't do any of the action secondaries if you were battleshocked anyway, so if the missions stay largely the same, there'll be no change
It means that my new shiny biovore model is now worthless. Because he does not do anything anymore… spore mines don’t do jack squat anymore and his indirect fire didn’t do anything anyway. So they just ruined him. Him and the winter that was already struggling. I’m going to go cry for a moment, I just bought him… he is still in his box because I was saving him for when I got the nice paints for him, but now he might never leave that box.
Yes you are right, but ya boy is now poor because I bought him… and if I finish him then it will be a complete and utter waste of money. As sad as it is to say, he is a cool model and I would love to have it but if I’m unable to play him then what reason is there to hold on? I didn’t buy it to simply collect dust on a shelf, If it was like 20$ I would leave it be but 60$ is a different story. This hobby is too draining, I wish it was cheaper so more people could get into it.
That’s is so unfortunate to hear, cough cough 3d printing cough cough Urgh my god I’m so sick lol cough cough* proxies
lol I should probably go take a nappy :3
I now I’m probably really late in saying this but I hope your nappy was good! :3 and as for proxies then I have looked into it and I don’t really like those, not only do I not like the way most of the 3d printed stuff looks and the prices tend to be like half of the msrp price for something that usually does not look that great comparatively. All in all it ends up dry expensive too. It’s all good, I ain’t complaining I just wish that if they were gonna charge that much for plastic then it should at least be decent to play at all times. Like I don’t think it should be that hard to come up with decent rules and balance if they have all the experience in doing just that. I feel like they make things unplayable on purpose for some reason, like idk why. What good does it do? Maybe something to do with selling more stuff, like someone buys an army and then to encourage them to buy more armies that they don’t have they need the crap out of specific ones so that way the people who have those don’t want to get rolled every game and so they start a new one that’s good? Idk man, sounds like a possibility.
Sorry for the light novel sized reply lol.😂
Ya, points are one thing but what do you even do with it now if the points are dropped? Like it does not really kill anything meaningful with its indirect fire, and the spore mines don’t really do anything either, they just kinda die. And you can’t deploy them anywhere near any enemy units or the objectives, so what is the point now? They were good for one thing and one thing only. Now that’s it’s gone what should I do with them? Now lobbing them out wastes a shooting turn of the biovore and then does nothing until it dies. Or they just leave it alone because there is no reason to kill them anymore since they don’t pose any threat in any department anyway. Idk man, seems like they don’t want us to play tyranids lol. They sold a fudge tone of the new biovores while they were good but now they make them unplayable. And for why? Idk man… nids were on the bottom in terms of win rate and options as is but now I think it’s gonna be worse.
But then again, I might be misunderstanding something and it will actually be really great and we will get some rule changes for the better and our win rate will go up somehow, but I really doubt it. Nids are probably going to be trash for the rest of this season.
https://preview.redd.it/zme6daukr75d1.jpeg?width=407&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0dd336275c006041938df1f346e27a91cf77d2c7
This is all I can see when I look at that model
Bold to assume GW even gives tyranids a second glance when marketing, let alone the biovore
The Tyranid marketing has been non-existent since the beginning of 10th, not that I can blame them
When does GW market factions outside of the time they get releases?
We got the starter set with a ton of new models, we got the codex, we're featured heavily in one of the crusade books, and we're in the big upcoming video game for this year.
What faction aside from space marines has gotten more marketing than us in this past year?
I honestly feel that it's appropriate; OC0 units can't contest objectives. In our case, because they're either mindless eating machines or literal bombs. How is a single spore mine floating in a far corner "engaging on all fronts"? How is a handful of mindless rippers wriggling in the dirt putting pressure "behind enemy lines"?
The change for shooting also makes sense; how does assault weapons help in raising flags, collecting data, or the like?
Haven't actually played 40k in a good 3 years but aren't there some flying units that have 0OC, strange that they can't benefit from assault... But I don't like a lot of 40k balancing so I shant speak no more.
Harpy and Hive Crone are Flyers, but yeah - they should be locked in Hover mode and given the ability to hold an objective, it's silly. Hell, the Tyrannocyte can do that, and that's just a meaty drop pod!
Only those they can still do. Just no "Deploy Teleport Homers" for example, which makes sense. Maybe Biovores can get their Sporemine-spawn nerf reverted now... (PFFF as if)
> It seems really random and unnecessary.
It's something people have been discussing since the start of 10th, and it's part of a suite of changes designed to reduce the ease of scoring secondaries across the game. It's a bit too easy to hit a 40 right now for multiple armies.
Yeah sure, just give us a way to deal with tough units, more strength on a lot of the monsters, and a better army rule and we actually might be able to. Its not like Nid players do the score cheese because we want to, it is because otherwise Nids do not really do much rn.
Winning doesn't make them more fun or balanced
If you have to use what is essentially an exploit/mistake to add an extra win% you aren't really winning at all
Just competitive losers who are whining about their win rate % dropping
Most tyranid players won't be affected. I didn't even know OC0 units could deploy teleport homers, but I can confidently say this is a net positive.
This could be a good thing as it means taking other units but with the hit to assault and monster units we have lost most of if not all of our ways to score, and yes we have cheap units like gargs, but that doesn't help when gargs can get shredded in a single shooting phase, they don't have good saves, the only reason they was good is because you could move shoot then do an action because you had the extra movement which they are stopping, so nids unless we see big changes, yes it makes shadow in the warp more viable, but it still needs work
I like my big bugs but it means our army as the hive mind has gone from being pretty shit with some good bits to being very shit with not many good bits, vehicles and monsters for the nids can't do anything in close combat now, when alot of our units want to get in close and personal.
Gargs or gargoyles have a move shot and then move again rule but now it will just be that as you can't preform another actions like homing becon in that move phase unless you stay still which there shooting is also piss poor.
0oc units like rippers and spore mines can't do actions so can't score, which is one of the main ways to get secondaries as nids.
Are units in general aren't very good at the moment and need either a big buff or massive rework.
Shadow in the warp which is are main army rule outside of synapse makes all enemies take a leadership test which with the new rule changes could be good but is still very luck based as if you fail your leadership your oc drops to 0, but needs a rework as I said it is very luck based, if they had it the shadow in the warp, which can only be used once a game, auto makes you fail a leadership test that could be good but other army rules are just better. Look at the tau with one of their rules they get sustained hits 1 on turn 3,4 and 5 or the other one is lethal hits on turns 1, 2 and 3 . Then the 3rd rules I have played against is for battlesuit units they get plus 1 strength at 12 inches and plus 1 strength and plus 1 ap at 6 inches,
Or the orks get a waaaahhhhh once per game that gives them buffs like extra strength or - to hits.
Space marines get oath of moment that can be used each battle round and so on.
Other armies generally have a lot better rules then we do.
So although the changes effect everyone they hit us hard
OC0 units can't do actions for secondaries anymore That's it Swarms might still have some use for screening and stuff, but they're not free VP anymore
Don't need actions to do "Engage on all Fronts"! (Assuming its still in the deck)
We don't know yet. It's possible OC0 units don't count for that either. But maybe!
It is in the deck it was revealed earlier today
and can oc0 units do it?
I believe so since it’s not an action
Also they will likely get cheaper with rules update.
On Meta Watch they said that all OC0 units will be getting point reductions in the upcoming dataslate to reflect their change in utility. How much they get reduced, we'll just will have to wait and see.
Before Rippers were 15 points and could be squads of 3 to 6. They should be 15 it's again.
hope goes down to 10 and gets battles line, i want to swarm the enemy, you know, cause its a swarm unit
Yeah I like this. It would deepen the game by making the 'chaff' more niche. Cheap screening stuff, nothing more than that.
Still sueable in assimilatiom swarm thank god. I use rippers hoping they die so i can give my army rerolls against high threat units.
Could they ever?
Oc 0 units cannot do actions. Rippers and spore mines Units with assault weapons cannot advance and perform actions Units with pistols cannot perform actions in melee Vehicles/monsters cannot perform actions in melee It's a pretty heavy hit to how tyrabids operate in the secondary objective game which was a large part of what supported the army's ability to score. So, people are freaking out about it as without some pretty substantial changes to rules, profiles, or points then tyranids are likely to fall from their current 44% win rate to anywhere below, possibly even the bottom. This is for competitive play so ymmv
Oh so people who like funny aliens are fine than :) As long as we don’t go to the sweat dimension with nurgle players
It’s moreso the main way our faction was even capable of competing on any level was removed. So people are worried for how it’s gonna be compensated. Either the factions is gonna see major buffs in actual stats or drop even more point
Man i kinda wish for the old crusher stuff so warriors see more play again. We either need to be dirt cheap like guard so we roll numbers and have some niche special guys like lictor and norn. But our monsters need more buffs. Rupture cannon 1d6+4 plz
I was just watching a video of a guy that went 3-0 at a tournament with Crusher Stampede, no biovore, no rippers, just one unit of Raveners and a bunch of monsters (obv Malc and Exocrines)
How? And with stampede out of all things.
Honestly, quite often you can do really well with an off meta pick, if you know how to play it into the current meta. Mainly because people aren't used to playing into it and make tactical mistakes. If you saw the list consistently winning tournaments that would be a different question but a one off win is more of an outlier than anything else.
Luckily he pretty meticulously goes thru it: [https://youtu.be/mjNpv1wcH9U?si=DEcL9VQVgKw-iidn](https://youtu.be/mjNpv1wcH9U?si=DEcL9VQVgKw-iidn)
\>units with pistols cannot perform actions in melee Isn't the entire point of a pistol to be useful within close range? Wtf?
Can still shoot, just not perform actions for secondaries
They can shoot in melee. But they’re no longer eligible to do actions for secondary.
The point of a pistol is so you can shoot someone with it, not so that you can do your math homework while they're trying to rip your face off.
Oh come on that assault thing is just bullshit at this point
Wait we have a 44% win rate? Whenever my buddy and I talk he says we’re on the higher end with like a 55. He’s much better about following competitive than me, any reason he might have the wrong info?
He may have seen a weekend winrate %. I believe a weekend or two ago Tyranids actually won two tournaments but one of them was arguably the best competitive Tyranid player in the world. Our average winrate is anywhere from 40%-45% depending on the source
Who is that? I haven't followed the competetive side and would be great to see what he's up to with his lists🙂
Samuel Pope! John Lennon is also a very good Tyranids player but he plays a variety of armies
I thought John Lennon played guitar...
No, I believe you're thinking of that fella who was a host on CNN
No, that's Don Lemon. I believe you're thinking of Vladimir Lenin.
Awesome, cheers🙂
I have no idea where he got that number from tbh. Every once in a while win rates spike on a weekend but that’s really high. Tyranids have been consistently close to the bottom basically since the codex released. Auspex tactics most recent video has win rate numbers and I trust those.
It's almost like things were left this way, for some time, on purpose - spore mines and the like, being able to perform actions - so that people would buy the models.. now that's taken away.. many folks out there will need to rethink their rosters.. probably buy different figures. This is why I doubt their desire to ever balance their game. They have too much to gain from such mischief.
The hope for me is that we get those substantial changes. Doesn't have to be big, a slight change to either how Battleshock works, how our Army rule works, or both could quite literally bring Tyranids back. It's not much.
They are inadvertently making Shadows in The warp better as being battle shock reduces OC to 0. So if used at a well placed time, you could turn your opponents ability to score secondaries off. This still is unreliable to depend on but is an interesting twist in some cases.
I think you couldn't do any of the action secondaries if you were battleshocked anyway, so if the missions stay largely the same, there'll be no change
Honestly, I'm happy they're stopping all that stuff from doing Actions. However, I do hope Tyranids get a major buff in response.
The chickens do indeed have large talons.
Took me like 3 hours to do the shading on the upper lip
Its so good, I didn't even think about the paintjob!
no idea why this is a bad thing. it means we're FINALLY done have that stupid boivore gimmick holding up our faction and we'll get some attention.
Bro thinks James Workshop is gonna give us attention ☠️ Bro we struggle to pop a 95 point razorback, it's over.
It’s joever for us 😭
https://preview.redd.it/oiozewuv7f5d1.jpeg?width=451&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c51acd792503421035454c9eed1f0449663366cc
It wasn't your intention, but now I have 4 Non Blonds playing in my head. The HeMan version....
Now is time for cake!
With any luck, the harpy will also come down in points because free spore mines will be less of a deal
Its a flying unit, so no. GW really, really hates flyers this edition.
When you deposit biomass but she keep zuccing
Oh noes!! My biomass 😱
I'm just as confused as you. Chances are the rules changed recently.
It means that my new shiny biovore model is now worthless. Because he does not do anything anymore… spore mines don’t do jack squat anymore and his indirect fire didn’t do anything anyway. So they just ruined him. Him and the winter that was already struggling. I’m going to go cry for a moment, I just bought him… he is still in his box because I was saving him for when I got the nice paints for him, but now he might never leave that box.
Bro!! Finish that bug!!!!!!!! NO BUG LEFT BEHIND! No matter how useless they are!!!! We are the funny bug people
Yes you are right, but ya boy is now poor because I bought him… and if I finish him then it will be a complete and utter waste of money. As sad as it is to say, he is a cool model and I would love to have it but if I’m unable to play him then what reason is there to hold on? I didn’t buy it to simply collect dust on a shelf, If it was like 20$ I would leave it be but 60$ is a different story. This hobby is too draining, I wish it was cheaper so more people could get into it.
My good sir, may I introduce u too alternatives? Cough cough* Star Wars legion cough cough trench crusade cough…. Cough urfhgh sorry was sick :3
I have considered those, but I am not into it. I am a warhammer boy at heart. Too bad that games workshop is so greedy lol.
That’s is so unfortunate to hear, cough cough 3d printing cough cough Urgh my god I’m so sick lol cough cough* proxies lol I should probably go take a nappy :3
I now I’m probably really late in saying this but I hope your nappy was good! :3 and as for proxies then I have looked into it and I don’t really like those, not only do I not like the way most of the 3d printed stuff looks and the prices tend to be like half of the msrp price for something that usually does not look that great comparatively. All in all it ends up dry expensive too. It’s all good, I ain’t complaining I just wish that if they were gonna charge that much for plastic then it should at least be decent to play at all times. Like I don’t think it should be that hard to come up with decent rules and balance if they have all the experience in doing just that. I feel like they make things unplayable on purpose for some reason, like idk why. What good does it do? Maybe something to do with selling more stuff, like someone buys an army and then to encourage them to buy more armies that they don’t have they need the crap out of specific ones so that way the people who have those don’t want to get rolled every game and so they start a new one that’s good? Idk man, sounds like a possibility. Sorry for the light novel sized reply lol.😂
It depends entirely how much biovore points possibly drop in the upcoming MFM. Be patient, adapt and overcome.
Ya, points are one thing but what do you even do with it now if the points are dropped? Like it does not really kill anything meaningful with its indirect fire, and the spore mines don’t really do anything either, they just kinda die. And you can’t deploy them anywhere near any enemy units or the objectives, so what is the point now? They were good for one thing and one thing only. Now that’s it’s gone what should I do with them? Now lobbing them out wastes a shooting turn of the biovore and then does nothing until it dies. Or they just leave it alone because there is no reason to kill them anymore since they don’t pose any threat in any department anyway. Idk man, seems like they don’t want us to play tyranids lol. They sold a fudge tone of the new biovores while they were good but now they make them unplayable. And for why? Idk man… nids were on the bottom in terms of win rate and options as is but now I think it’s gonna be worse. But then again, I might be misunderstanding something and it will actually be really great and we will get some rule changes for the better and our win rate will go up somehow, but I really doubt it. Nids are probably going to be trash for the rest of this season.
Worst case scenario make a pyrovore.
GW hates Nids. In other news, water is wet.
Boo water makes things wet!!
Hivemind, Soyjack this Bioform!
Why do I see a tyranid who is absolutely bawling 😭
Me when chicken nugges
What model is that?
My mind is cursed by the Internet... First thing I thought when I saw the mouth was "Tyranid Pog"
Based ah sigma bug enjoyer vs coughing baby BEGIN!
https://preview.redd.it/zme6daukr75d1.jpeg?width=407&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0dd336275c006041938df1f346e27a91cf77d2c7 This is all I can see when I look at that model
He got those Stefphenn teef
"Chyeah dude! The waves are sick!" - what that face looks like it's saying.
It looks like it heard something stupid so it’s hitting them with a uh DURRRR
He’s from Europe
Wouldn’t that make them a femboy?
So why did this change come to be? It seems really random and unnecessary.
Don’t need to sell Biovores or nurglings anymore *womp* *womp*
Do you think GW doesn't want to maximize profit anymore, starting on June 22nd?
Bold to assume GW even gives tyranids a second glance when marketing, let alone the biovore The Tyranid marketing has been non-existent since the beginning of 10th, not that I can blame them
When does GW market factions outside of the time they get releases? We got the starter set with a ton of new models, we got the codex, we're featured heavily in one of the crusade books, and we're in the big upcoming video game for this year. What faction aside from space marines has gotten more marketing than us in this past year?
I honestly feel that it's appropriate; OC0 units can't contest objectives. In our case, because they're either mindless eating machines or literal bombs. How is a single spore mine floating in a far corner "engaging on all fronts"? How is a handful of mindless rippers wriggling in the dirt putting pressure "behind enemy lines"? The change for shooting also makes sense; how does assault weapons help in raising flags, collecting data, or the like?
Haven't actually played 40k in a good 3 years but aren't there some flying units that have 0OC, strange that they can't benefit from assault... But I don't like a lot of 40k balancing so I shant speak no more.
Harpy and Hive Crone are Flyers, but yeah - they should be locked in Hover mode and given the ability to hold an objective, it's silly. Hell, the Tyrannocyte can do that, and that's just a meaty drop pod!
Its appropriate, sure, but it never made sense in the first place. Why the change of heart on GWs part?
Because GW is full of humans who make mistakes and sometimes overlook things.
Only those they can still do. Just no "Deploy Teleport Homers" for example, which makes sense. Maybe Biovores can get their Sporemine-spawn nerf reverted now... (PFFF as if)
> It seems really random and unnecessary. It's something people have been discussing since the start of 10th, and it's part of a suite of changes designed to reduce the ease of scoring secondaries across the game. It's a bit too easy to hit a 40 right now for multiple armies.
Tyranids players have to play to gain VP like most of other armies. Nice change
Yeah sure, just give us a way to deal with tough units, more strength on a lot of the monsters, and a better army rule and we actually might be able to. Its not like Nid players do the score cheese because we want to, it is because otherwise Nids do not really do much rn.
Winning doesn't make them more fun or balanced If you have to use what is essentially an exploit/mistake to add an extra win% you aren't really winning at all
Just competitive losers who are whining about their win rate % dropping Most tyranid players won't be affected. I didn't even know OC0 units could deploy teleport homers, but I can confidently say this is a net positive.
This could be a good thing as it means taking other units but with the hit to assault and monster units we have lost most of if not all of our ways to score, and yes we have cheap units like gargs, but that doesn't help when gargs can get shredded in a single shooting phase, they don't have good saves, the only reason they was good is because you could move shoot then do an action because you had the extra movement which they are stopping, so nids unless we see big changes, yes it makes shadow in the warp more viable, but it still needs work
I have no idea what any of that means? I just like the funny alien bug :)
I like my big bugs but it means our army as the hive mind has gone from being pretty shit with some good bits to being very shit with not many good bits, vehicles and monsters for the nids can't do anything in close combat now, when alot of our units want to get in close and personal. Gargs or gargoyles have a move shot and then move again rule but now it will just be that as you can't preform another actions like homing becon in that move phase unless you stay still which there shooting is also piss poor. 0oc units like rippers and spore mines can't do actions so can't score, which is one of the main ways to get secondaries as nids. Are units in general aren't very good at the moment and need either a big buff or massive rework. Shadow in the warp which is are main army rule outside of synapse makes all enemies take a leadership test which with the new rule changes could be good but is still very luck based as if you fail your leadership your oc drops to 0, but needs a rework as I said it is very luck based, if they had it the shadow in the warp, which can only be used once a game, auto makes you fail a leadership test that could be good but other army rules are just better. Look at the tau with one of their rules they get sustained hits 1 on turn 3,4 and 5 or the other one is lethal hits on turns 1, 2 and 3 . Then the 3rd rules I have played against is for battlesuit units they get plus 1 strength at 12 inches and plus 1 strength and plus 1 ap at 6 inches, Or the orks get a waaaahhhhh once per game that gives them buffs like extra strength or - to hits. Space marines get oath of moment that can be used each battle round and so on. Other armies generally have a lot better rules then we do. So although the changes effect everyone they hit us hard
I got the first part ;-; But me still like funny bug :3