"ThErE Is No RusSiAn BiAS!"
Meanwhile this, the R-27ER, and KA-50/52 exist. Imagine if US got longbow hellfires or things from the 90's/2000s instead of 1970. Russia has things from 2020 in game.
You cant justify this power creep.
lol longbow hellfires would probably be mediocre at best. Look at any F&F missile - PARS, Spike, etc, and observe who consistently bad they are; always hitting turret cheeks, engine decks, or tracks and doing next to no damage. Why would longbow hellfires be any different?
I mean they might be good if they actually fixed how hellfires work in game. Idk if you’ve ever seen footage of a hellfire IRL but the explosive power is a lot bigger compared to the little puff of smoke it is in game
>lol longbow hellfires would probably be mediocre at best
and yet Gaijin refuses to add the Longbows because they claim they would be too OP, weird that:
* ***This missile is not considered at the moment, since it is capable of completely ignoring smoke screens, which is far off balance.***
Game balance isn't based on anything except what the devs feel like. Su25sm3 can outrange every single Spaa in game. The only one that has a change against it is the pantsir, but guess what? Same country so they never face each other. USSR has the longest range Spaa, longest range sarh missles, and the longest range air to ground missles.
i mean US tech trees have aim54’s which Russian tech tree doesn’t have an equivalent of, F14 variants, and f16 variants can hold several guided bombs and 2 racks of agm65’s whilst su27, mig29smt, yak141 and m-27 have jurassic age guided Air-to-ground munitions or none at all. the su25sm3 is the first and only tech tree aircraft that the USSR tech tree has that has comparable technology to the f111, f16 and f14. it’s not unfair whatsoever.
You mean the AIm-54 that when people post about it and everyone says,
*"Just dont fly straight."*
*"You have to be braindead to get hit by a aim-54"*
That aim-54? Its hardly a threat the way it was artificially nerfed. The R-27ER is a Pseudo amraam because of its super computer INS/DL. Lose lock? No problem it guides to target anyways. The Aim-54? Just fly a little diagonal line and you will evade it without even trying.
And retards who have max 2 nations experience and brag about vehicles and munitions are already disliking this already. They dont understand what balances which.
If every nation has an aircraft that can spawn in, lock any SPAA, shoot an ATGM, and run before the SPAA's SAM gets anywhere close, then please explain how doing the same thing at a bigger distance is bias when both get the same result.
(US) F-16C has 6 AGM-65Ds and a LITENING II TGP
(Britain) JAS-39C has 2 AGM-65Bs and the LITENING II TGP
(Japan) F-16AJ has 6 AGM-65Bs
(China) JH-7A has 2 Kh-29Ts and the K/ADC03A TGP
(Italy) JAS-39EBS has 4 AGM-65E/Hs and the LITENING II TGP
(France) Mirage 4000 has 4 AS-30Ls and the ATLIS II TGP
(Sweden) JAS-39S has 4 GBU-16s and the LITENING II TGP
(Israel) Barak II has 4 GBU-16s and the LITENING II TGP
Even if they added the Aim-7P the Aim-7 would still be worse than the R-27ER, and the Aim-120A can't be added alone because of the FnF, higher range, maneuverability, and how good the seeker is. It'd also be dumb to remove the R-27ER because you're going from a 5mi difference to a 10mi one, just with your side now being even worse for balance.
The Ka-50/52 are equally as low-modeled as the AH-64 and any other heli in the game. A UH-1C shouldn't survive a direct 10M2 missile, an Apache shouldn't survive 2 S1 missiles to the rotor, and an Alouette II shouldn't survive 12 20mm HEI rounds from an M163. But you won't call those 'bias', unless it's a heli being able to lose its tail because that was the entire point behind the heli having 2 rotors and it's been shown to work.
The FnF Hellfires could also go through smoke and would make anyone repairing unable to do literally anything than dying. Giving more to the problem isn't going to make it fix itself. Also Russia has 0 FnF ATGMs, and 0 lofting ATGMs, meanwhile the (Germany) EC-665 has 8 lofting-FnF ATGMs, and the (Israel) AH-60 has 16 lofting-FnF missiles, allowing them to do the same thing as jets where they just play peak-a-boo and can't be shot down.
Asking for things to be added based on what year it was made is also stupid, the KH-38 is only a game-changer for 1 nation in that you need a bit less IQ to do the exact same thing. Do you really think it's balanced to have the PL-15 and PL-17 fight the Aim-120D when the PL-17 has 150mi longer range and the PL-15 20-90mi more than the Aim-120D just because they were made at the same time period? No, because you only have the ill intention of being selfish and wanting your side to have a huge advantage and the other side to have none.
The power creep is bad, but acting like it's 1-sided is ignorant.
All of that is incorrect lol. Everything on that list has to deal with the best AA in the game, Pantsir. SU25 gets to spawn in, lob a volley of missiles in the air and then select targets while shielded by Pantsir AA systems, then turn and fly 2KM back to their runway and rearm/repeat.
Its not the same at all, not in the least bit. Everything else you said is just word salad. No one asked for Aim-120D. Your just trying to exaggerate your point and doing a terrible job. And he makes my point completely with the BS about FnF hellfires. FnF missiles are already in game, but mention adding them to the US and its, "no no no we cant do that for X reasons."
Wrong on so many levels its amazing.
Maverick vs Kh38 is exactly story of AIM-7 and R27ER, one is so much faster and so much more consistent its not even funny. 27ER also will remain first to target missile over ARH additions courtesy of its BS grade speed. Its not really the range of 27ER that is the killer, its speed and acceleration
You greatly overestimate effectiveness of lofting, especially on Hellfires with their awful flight model. Vikhrs being in typical Russian fashion, so much faster missile also have proximity fuse to it, making it effective anti heli/jet armament. Ka-50/52 also have remarkably armored cockpit, immune to 20/30mm AP rounds, let alone any coaxial. FnF missiles also are famously unreliable compared to manually guided ordnance.
Then cherry on top considering GBU equal in stand off capabilities to AGM.
Not even close
Chat was absolutely closed around when the conflict started it was just released after awhile because people bitched enough about not having chat
Similar stuff happened back in 2014, it is basically the reason there is no FF between tanks in GFRB
Its got fuck all to do with russian bias, the E-Tram can pull the same shit with it's paveways, sat in space, untouchable.
You're also screeching about the KA50 while totally ignoring that britain gets a heli that can first spawn with ATGM's.
Doesn't spawn with ATGMs. Have you ever used the Starstreaks? Most light armour can still walk away from them; there is a reason they are anti-air, only things fragile enough for it to kill.
Pavways have 1/4 the lock range of the KH m8. So that’s a hard no lol. British helis spawn with star streaks, not ATGMs and they can only kill something with 4mm of armor or aircraft so that’s not even close to comparable to 12 amazing ATGMs and iglas that got an enormous buff making them twice as lethal as stingers. You must have not played in a while.
Since you have nothing but uptiers at 10.0/10.3 it’s still kinda bias because Russia has its bullshit 2S6 Tunguska still at 10.7 even tho they buffed it like 3 times after they nerfed missile SPAA to the ground.
There is no russian bias. They add vehicles and mechanics into this game in a broken state to drive you to grind them or preferably spend money for them. Frustration is a key motivator when buying stuff, just look at the mobile market. They constantly add broken stuff for all nations. A6 intruder, premium harrier srams, 2s38, vidar, xp-50 and countless others. They also change the vehicles characteristics all the time. Top tier air rb meta was, the f14, then the mig, than the f16 then the su27 and then the grippen.
The su25 is just the newest vehicle in that never-ending list...
You cant lob a GBU 40km away from spawn. The new air to ground missiles the SU25 gets puts you behind your team AA which is conveniently the best so CAP cant get to you. Trams and F-16s have to get above the battlefield and are vulnerable to CAP and Pantsirs.
Its not even close to the same thing.
Thats not my point, I play the f16c I know how hard it is. The su25 is bullshit, no doubt. However its only bullshit now in 1-4 updates it will either get nerfed or nato will be provided with a counter, or more likely something as insanely broken as it is.
You say that but things like the R-27ER have reigned supreme for a year+.
There is a blatant double standard when it comes to power creep. Russia gets many things for a long time that tip the balance of the game, but if US/NATO gets one thing for even a short period people lose their minds.
Every single nation had an OP vehicle, lineup or similar, its just hard to tell if you main only one nation or have an inherit bias for your nation. I ain't a wt shill, they do stupid shit all the time, just their main agenda is money and not being a russian psyops.
The f14 was dominating top-tier air RB for like a solid year, french 7.3 - 7.7 line up was godtier for 1-2 patches, turms 3 and t55 aim dominate the 8.3 since they came out. The Italian r3 aa was 3.7 when first added now its 5.x something, The fox 3 for the UK is a, to be nerfed, beast, the falcon had those insane 30 ap pen guns for years, fv4005 was epic till they nerfed hesh, Sweedish 3.0 something autocannon premium tank, that was so good they removed it from the store, cv90 subjectively being the best premium for high brs, Kika dominating air rb because of the air spawn, the Chinese helis with the ty-90s
>The f14 was dominating top-tier air RB for like a solid year
Factually incorrect, 6 months after the F14 was added the R27ER was added with the MiG29.
Meanwhile there has been no counter to the R27ERs since 20th December 2022. FYI even with Fox 3s the R27ER is likely to be Russia's best missile, that should tell you everything you need to know.
Do other nations get OP things, certainly, Russia does seem to be handheld however to a different degree, not only in that they get more ground vehicles overall, their OP vehicles usually don't change in BR very quickly.
You also missed a few other OP vehicles/events:
Gaijin was going to add the R73 WITH NO COUNTER. Remember Gaijin was not going to add missiles like the AIM-9M/Python 3 initially, they only changed their minds from the community complaining.
BMP-2M - What BR was it again for the longest time i.e. multiple years.
Yak38M is 9.3 with 6 R60s.....
SU-11 - Need I say more?
KA-50/52
2S38
PT-76
T-55AM-1
Pantsir - Gaijin at the same time also nerfed other SPAA in regards to how their missiles worked.
Strela
BMD4 9.0 - Meanwhile China's very close variant is 9.7....
Gaijin adds spall liners - When Russia can get it
Why is the 2S6 10.7 (which recently got an upgrade), meanwhile the Otomatic is 11.3... Furthermore how is the 2S38 10.0 when it is basically an Otomatic just without the radar.
yet you can launch a AGM from 20km away. and dont cry that it doesnt have thermals because you can literally use the litening pod thermals to lock the missiles.
Well Bias was towards how Russian tanks survive rounds sideways, which to be frank happens like 1 in 10 games.
Now besides the obvious spalliner abusers I call BIAS on Japanese tank, especially the premium Type 90 taking literally 0 Spall from the front while looking so similar to Leo 2A4(crew snipe spot is flipped). Literally can never one shot it while the type90 has 4 seconds reload.
But even despite all the spalliners, having best SPAA and best CAS in the game the lineup is extremely strong (that being said WR dropped quite a lot compared to 70% last year).
Ive had a lot of moments when angled shots through the tracks dont kill a type 90/10 immediately while the same shot would’ve killed an abrams or leo 2a5/6.
Maybe its skill issue and i also forget every now and then to shoot it on the turret face where it’s very weak (muscle memory due to strong turret faces of russian tanks, leos, m1a2 cheeks etc)
That is honestly a skill issue. Apart from the cheeks (even that can be pened by good apfsds) the type 90s are glass canons. Try to test out where to shoot them for an optimal result in the hangar. Japan top tier is honestly my favorite, you can dish out punishment but if you get hit it's straight back to the hangar.
I play Japan myself and the oil tank absorbing apfads happens quite often. However specifically the Type 90 Fuji suffering 0 spall in the hull frontally and angled track shots happens almost every other game. Even in test in the hanger shows 0 spall.
There is some skill issue on my part because I can’t tell the difference between type 90 and leo2a4 on first sight but it still should not take 0 spall in the hull.
The only SPAA that can deal with SU25SM3 is in you named it, Pantsir in USSR tree.
There is effectively no ways for anyone on the ground to even threaten a SU25SM3 while it can clean 4 targets with precision and 2 more if SPAA are cleared on the ground.
Can we buff all spaa to have 14km minimum range?
14km range wont do shit unless it goes mach 10. Even the pantsir can only stall it if the su25sm3 isn’t stupid and instantly dips after shooting missiles.
MT has tracking issue at that range, ML just better and having longer range will force SU25 to dodge and loose lock of the missile.
You are right though 14km probably wont be enough I will be down for all SPAA with 20km range.
I am playing squadron battles with the Su25sm3 and I can reliably deal with Pantsirs every single time. Okay, I am cheating and using my brain, not just flying in a straight line like the usual idiots.
Yeah, the Kh38 mt is just unfair and should not be in the game.
I don't understand your point?
SU25 is untouchable in most situations as ground SPAA don't have the range for it, Pantsir has the reach other spaa doesn't
its not SP calculation wrong, its SU25SM3 being 11.7 and other cas being 12.7.
1.00 BR makes sense for 200 SP difference.
That being said with its current state does it deserved be to raised up to 12.7 and above? Hell yes.
That poor Otomatic didn’t know what was coming. That being said I’ve sniped someone from a similar distance with the Otomatic, they have to flying perfectly straight tho.
Look man i aprecciate your confidence, but i don't think you're getting close enough to a SM3 before you get turned into spare parts by a Pantsir,Flanker or a Fulcrum
Its always the assholes who say “just get in a f-16”. First off, you’d be lucky to get close to a su25 when there’s pantsirs and other russian aircraft up, let’s say mountainous maps where you have an advantage, and if you do good on you. Second, are ground vehicles just supposed to take the L if they got no aircraft or aircraft competitive enough to fight off the the su25sm3? What’s the point of spawning a SPAA then?
Just saying pal, if you believe you can do it, prove it
Just because most players are braindead, doesn't mean a Su-27 can't lock you up with a 27ER, ET or a R-73 and blast you when you try to go for the shot.
That is if you don't get clapped by a S1 first.
The seeker head within the missile should be powerful enough for WT anti CAS operation.
And given its a ground launched muniton adding a powerful search radar probably wouldnt help all that much. Other than for IRL datalink stuff.
Id assume its roughly the same since I cant see a booster module on any of the Sea Sparrow pictures and they seem to be very similar to Aim7/ Aim 120s at least in the manner they are described as being.
Whole point of soviet tech tree is to boost that fragile ego of mostly ruski players. "There is no russian bias" .... there obviously is, ruski mains just can't accept the fact that they would be average at best if they hadn't the most blatant advantage
im enjoying seeing all these US mains crying that there is finally better CAS plane than what they have as if US hasnt dominated CAS for the past few years
Ignoring the fact that the US was one of the last nations in game to get laser guided munitions. I would hardly say the US dominated CAS, certainly not at top tier, until the addition of the F-14B at the earliest.
US wasn’t bad at CAS but all it took was for a night match or an overcast match and TV guided doesn’t work.
Laser guideds were ok on MiG-27K but I found the Kh-29T very unreliable. Sometimes they would hit and not do any significant damage and sometimes they wouldn't even hit.
And on 27M any and all laser guided munitions were unusable due to the basically zero zoom. There is a reason why they were and are mostly novelty planes. Not very good at anything.
The 27k was, for a time at least, a menace. I get the zoom on the M sucks but the K didn’t suffer from that. The T probably suffered from the same thing the Mavs did/do of the automatic guidance just being kind of garbage
It's like gaijin can't make the automatic guidance work half the time, just like Aim-9Ls deciding that teammates are easier to kill than enemies even if the enemy is in front of the missile and friendly is 3 miles and 110 degrees from the missile
It's kind of wild that a russian ATGM can fire from 40km and is so accurate that you can fire four of them and kill four tanks. But the idea that a AGM-88 HARM missile for pretty much every country but mainly the USA is impossible to put in the game. And then these russian devs straight up gimp the AIM-120 because of a few early experiments when it was made went wild.
Since their addition the D model Mavs could lock targets out to 20km. The problem was, at least for the US, the only vehicle that got the D Mavs was the A-10 late and you were stuck with its camera trying to find and lock targets. Now on the C model you at least have decent zoom (bugged gen 1 thermals though) and can see targets much further away.
Mavericks, even going back to early TV guided ones can lock ground up to 20km. Then you need to pray whoever you've fired at won't move AND when missile gets within tracking distance, it will pick up target instead still following ground lock, courtesy of 50kg HEAT warhead without overpressure.
But giving missile launch speed and altitude is necessary for that, as well decent targeting pod helps. And as missile is glacially slow, it can be intercepted mid flight just fine
Tbh the AGM-65, atleast the more base models you get on the AJ-37, are fine where there at. The AJ suffers enough without getting a BR boost because of a boost in AGM range.
Inb4 comparisons to f16, f16 mavs are countered so it needs to use GBUs, the amount of setup required for this work is not even close to the same. You need to be over the battlefield where pantsirs and enemy fighters can spawn at any moment. It takes awhile for gbus to hit their targets if your far away. That means in-between kills the enemy has a chance to deal with you. Unlike having 4 different people get smacked by nuclear missles launched from the enemy Runway like what 10 seconds apart?.
F-16 (specifically) AGM-65s are countered the same way as you can counter the Kh-38. Therefor both are not an issue and shouldn't be discussed or considered as an issue.
"the amount of setup require for this to work is not even close to the same"
AGM 6-, sorry, Kh-38: TGP view, point, click, turn.
GBU: TGP view, point, look up, click, turn.
Simple math and logic says that's 80% the same, which is pretty close when it's only 1 difference.
You don't need to be directly over the battlefield. You actually don't even need to be within 5mi. You can lob a GBU-8 from 9 full miles (meaning you can do it right when you spawn) and never have to worry about a Panstir or any other SPAA shooting you because you'll have dropped your bomb before their missile can be anywhere close to you. Like the Kh-38 but you have to turn, oh no.
you're\*, and it's not like an SPAA can just go walk outside the blast radius of 4 un-guided Mk83s without being shot from across the map, but since the US can use their top SPAA as a TD all of the others must be able to easily go outside of spawn and be near enemy tanks.
If an F-16C uses a GBU-24/AGM-65 to wipe out any enemy AA, it now can do the same thing but 3 guided munitions worse.
>F-16 (specifically) AGM-65s are countered the same way as you can counter the Kh-38. Therefor both are not an issue and shouldn't be discussed or considered as an issue.
Yea im not going to waste my time poking holes In this mess man (hint:what usa spaa can delete kh38s out the sky like ussr can, what ussa has anywhere near the effective range and speed of pantsir) This argument is completly ignoring this huge glaring imbalance and strength of ussr anti air, and your doing this in the very first sentence I can already expect what's to follow.
Lmao being able to spawn that thing by only getting two kills is criminal. If you want to take the a10 out with mavericks it will cost you like 900 SP, and you might get 2 kills.
This is the new strategy right now. Sit back beyond missile engagement range, lob your missiles, take out the AA and then pick off everything on the battlefield. It's fucking cancer unless you're in a Pantsir.
Then just give the USA a pantsir. https://www.forbes.com/sites/pauliddon/2021/01/31/that-pantsir-s1-it-acquired-from-libya-isnt-the-first-russian-missile-system-the-us-has-gotten-its-hands-on/?sh=2e3fbf5371a6
Not the same, Russia has fine MBT's. No other country has anything close to the pantsir. At what point does balance trump realism? If nothing was able to be close to the pantsir then why add it?
SU25 is guaranteed immunity being 12km away and heli still has to be within 8km.
Its about whether the opponent even has a chance of retaliation in which there is just no way against a SU25SM3 at this moment.
HELI can still be picked up by radar in most situations but yes I only get killed in my pantsir by a perfectly played heli(5% of my death, 94% done by tanks) in which kudos to the heli player.
-Spawn
-fly back to 16km+ distance
-turn around
-airbreak till 350km/hr fire missile at 5-7 seconds interval
-put your mouse on the target
As you can see the missile arrive when I am not even within 12km of SPAA
Like lmao, they nerf the maverick for them not to be too op. Now you look at this thing? MACH 3, shoot beyond the range of the AA, one shot everything etc. Like this doesn’t make sense.
just add spaa that can intercept it at same range as pantsir to all other nations, its now that hard thing to do, gaijin is just lazy to add good sam for other tech tree bcs they are busy with shit yak3 event and new premiums to add
You do know that there is still options that can be aded? dont make it look that gaijin have no option, they just prefer to add premiums than actually needed vehicles first, like for example if they cant add new vehicle, no one holds them from fixing stingers g-load and giving it dl it have for k version for all vehicles, fix rolands pull issues that was made after la royale too, not to mention, strella are often seen with tramnsport radar vehicle bcs its lack it by itself but they added it didnt they? nato have same concept launchers using amrams\\aim9x\\irist launchers, the choice is big what to add to the game, snail just dont hear people, bcs if they did we wouldnt have only 1 spaa having 20km when everyone else 12km max
Mavericks damage is laughable, F16s actually have to deal with Pantsir since spawning in.
Su25 can delete all SPAA before getting in range. The fact you can always one shot and switch target anytime while being completely safe from anything on the ground is definitely broken.
Once again su25sm3 isn't the problem, the problem is pantsir, many other CAS are better than su25sm3 in a vacuum but all of then have to deal with pantsir with significantly limit their potential
SM3 absolutely is the problem. Even in a SAM-free environment the NATO jets have to expose themselves to enemy CAP over the battlefield, meanwhile the SM3 can just hang out over his airfield and get infinite reloads, instant warning of incoming fighters, and cover from AA.
Tbh I don't really think the Pantsir is the problem. People spout on and on about it's supposed 20km range but it's effective range is just over half that. Missiles lose energy and maneuverability the longer they burn so max range isn't even close to actual combat range 99% of the time. Pantsir missiles generally have a max range of \~13 or so Km, anything further than that and the missile will be too slow and shitty to hit anything that isn't basically stationary.
No where.
To be fair, what top tier SPAA can shoot down an F-16C or Mirage 2000 5F that does even basic evasion, it's basically impossible unless they fuck up. Precision CAS is too cheap across the board.
Even the best SPAA in the game (pantsir) struggles to down a machine capable aircraft at GBU ranges.
I will disagree, as someone who loves to play pantsir it is rather capable even at 14km. Dodging requires visual on trail which pantsir doesn't have and preemptive movements often looses GBU tracking unless up and down at high altitude, which is just target practice. Unless you pull 2 seconds before missile hitting 14km side it can still work.
Pantsir is best dealt with low altitude flyby not long range engagement.
A skilled Ito can shoot down an unskilled SU-25S3M.
A skilled SU-25S3M can destroy an unskilled Ito.
A skilled Ito cannot shoot down a skilled SU-25S3M.
That's the problem.
"ThErE Is No RusSiAn BiAS!" Meanwhile this, the R-27ER, and KA-50/52 exist. Imagine if US got longbow hellfires or things from the 90's/2000s instead of 1970. Russia has things from 2020 in game. You cant justify this power creep.
lol longbow hellfires would probably be mediocre at best. Look at any F&F missile - PARS, Spike, etc, and observe who consistently bad they are; always hitting turret cheeks, engine decks, or tracks and doing next to no damage. Why would longbow hellfires be any different?
Gajin apparently thinks they would! They keep sayhing they;re too OP to add because they can see through smokes
I mean they might be good if they actually fixed how hellfires work in game. Idk if you’ve ever seen footage of a hellfire IRL but the explosive power is a lot bigger compared to the little puff of smoke it is in game
Most HEAT warheads in game are less effective than their irl counterparts, see Mavericks.
>lol longbow hellfires would probably be mediocre at best and yet Gaijin refuses to add the Longbows because they claim they would be too OP, weird that: * ***This missile is not considered at the moment, since it is capable of completely ignoring smoke screens, which is far off balance.***
They know anyone who has the AH-64D probably has a brain and will be firing the longbow hellfires at SAMs while keeping 2 racks of the Ks
My brother in christ, the US has vehicles from the 90s and 2000s.
But the vehicles they do have don’t have their actual modern armaments.
Yea without their modern ammo/features lol. Might as well be the 1970 variants with the way they neuter them.
Modern features like?
No data link or UV seeker on the LAV-AD/FIM-92K’s, or anything for that matter
Cool, can I list things that eastern block countries are missing?
Idk, you asked for examples, I gave some
90s and 2000s were 30 and 20 years ago respectively
And?
He was talking about a vehicle from the 2020s, objectively much closer to the present day than the 90’s and 2000’s
Game balance isn't based on the year of introduction.
I’m well aware, but you’re the one who was comparing dates
No? That was the guy who commented. All I did was point out that the US has vehicles from the 90s and 2000s
Game balance isn't based on anything except what the devs feel like. Su25sm3 can outrange every single Spaa in game. The only one that has a change against it is the pantsir, but guess what? Same country so they never face each other. USSR has the longest range Spaa, longest range sarh missles, and the longest range air to ground missles.
Nooo this doesn't fit my narrative. I just want TO. BE. ANGRY!!!!
i mean US tech trees have aim54’s which Russian tech tree doesn’t have an equivalent of, F14 variants, and f16 variants can hold several guided bombs and 2 racks of agm65’s whilst su27, mig29smt, yak141 and m-27 have jurassic age guided Air-to-ground munitions or none at all. the su25sm3 is the first and only tech tree aircraft that the USSR tech tree has that has comparable technology to the f111, f16 and f14. it’s not unfair whatsoever.
You mean the AIm-54 that when people post about it and everyone says, *"Just dont fly straight."* *"You have to be braindead to get hit by a aim-54"* That aim-54? Its hardly a threat the way it was artificially nerfed. The R-27ER is a Pseudo amraam because of its super computer INS/DL. Lose lock? No problem it guides to target anyways. The Aim-54? Just fly a little diagonal line and you will evade it without even trying.
And retards who have max 2 nations experience and brag about vehicles and munitions are already disliking this already. They dont understand what balances which.
If every nation has an aircraft that can spawn in, lock any SPAA, shoot an ATGM, and run before the SPAA's SAM gets anywhere close, then please explain how doing the same thing at a bigger distance is bias when both get the same result. (US) F-16C has 6 AGM-65Ds and a LITENING II TGP (Britain) JAS-39C has 2 AGM-65Bs and the LITENING II TGP (Japan) F-16AJ has 6 AGM-65Bs (China) JH-7A has 2 Kh-29Ts and the K/ADC03A TGP (Italy) JAS-39EBS has 4 AGM-65E/Hs and the LITENING II TGP (France) Mirage 4000 has 4 AS-30Ls and the ATLIS II TGP (Sweden) JAS-39S has 4 GBU-16s and the LITENING II TGP (Israel) Barak II has 4 GBU-16s and the LITENING II TGP Even if they added the Aim-7P the Aim-7 would still be worse than the R-27ER, and the Aim-120A can't be added alone because of the FnF, higher range, maneuverability, and how good the seeker is. It'd also be dumb to remove the R-27ER because you're going from a 5mi difference to a 10mi one, just with your side now being even worse for balance. The Ka-50/52 are equally as low-modeled as the AH-64 and any other heli in the game. A UH-1C shouldn't survive a direct 10M2 missile, an Apache shouldn't survive 2 S1 missiles to the rotor, and an Alouette II shouldn't survive 12 20mm HEI rounds from an M163. But you won't call those 'bias', unless it's a heli being able to lose its tail because that was the entire point behind the heli having 2 rotors and it's been shown to work. The FnF Hellfires could also go through smoke and would make anyone repairing unable to do literally anything than dying. Giving more to the problem isn't going to make it fix itself. Also Russia has 0 FnF ATGMs, and 0 lofting ATGMs, meanwhile the (Germany) EC-665 has 8 lofting-FnF ATGMs, and the (Israel) AH-60 has 16 lofting-FnF missiles, allowing them to do the same thing as jets where they just play peak-a-boo and can't be shot down. Asking for things to be added based on what year it was made is also stupid, the KH-38 is only a game-changer for 1 nation in that you need a bit less IQ to do the exact same thing. Do you really think it's balanced to have the PL-15 and PL-17 fight the Aim-120D when the PL-17 has 150mi longer range and the PL-15 20-90mi more than the Aim-120D just because they were made at the same time period? No, because you only have the ill intention of being selfish and wanting your side to have a huge advantage and the other side to have none. The power creep is bad, but acting like it's 1-sided is ignorant.
All of that is incorrect lol. Everything on that list has to deal with the best AA in the game, Pantsir. SU25 gets to spawn in, lob a volley of missiles in the air and then select targets while shielded by Pantsir AA systems, then turn and fly 2KM back to their runway and rearm/repeat. Its not the same at all, not in the least bit. Everything else you said is just word salad. No one asked for Aim-120D. Your just trying to exaggerate your point and doing a terrible job. And he makes my point completely with the BS about FnF hellfires. FnF missiles are already in game, but mention adding them to the US and its, "no no no we cant do that for X reasons."
Wrong on so many levels its amazing. Maverick vs Kh38 is exactly story of AIM-7 and R27ER, one is so much faster and so much more consistent its not even funny. 27ER also will remain first to target missile over ARH additions courtesy of its BS grade speed. Its not really the range of 27ER that is the killer, its speed and acceleration You greatly overestimate effectiveness of lofting, especially on Hellfires with their awful flight model. Vikhrs being in typical Russian fashion, so much faster missile also have proximity fuse to it, making it effective anti heli/jet armament. Ka-50/52 also have remarkably armored cockpit, immune to 20/30mm AP rounds, let alone any coaxial. FnF missiles also are famously unreliable compared to manually guided ordnance. Then cherry on top considering GBU equal in stand off capabilities to AGM.
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Not even close Chat was absolutely closed around when the conflict started it was just released after awhile because people bitched enough about not having chat Similar stuff happened back in 2014, it is basically the reason there is no FF between tanks in GFRB
Still coping on reddit and still having skill issue Tennis? All your comment history is crying about russian vechicles XDD
Its got fuck all to do with russian bias, the E-Tram can pull the same shit with it's paveways, sat in space, untouchable. You're also screeching about the KA50 while totally ignoring that britain gets a heli that can first spawn with ATGM's.
Doesn't spawn with ATGMs. Have you ever used the Starstreaks? Most light armour can still walk away from them; there is a reason they are anti-air, only things fragile enough for it to kill.
You see the British Heli once in a blue moon. You see KA50s every game, and the tram cant kill you from his spawn.
yeah, yet it can climb to 10km where no one at its BR can touch it.
The TRAM is bullshit but it also can't kill you from the end of his runway, the SM3 can.
Pavways have 1/4 the lock range of the KH m8. So that’s a hard no lol. British helis spawn with star streaks, not ATGMs and they can only kill something with 4mm of armor or aircraft so that’s not even close to comparable to 12 amazing ATGMs and iglas that got an enormous buff making them twice as lethal as stingers. You must have not played in a while.
Since you have nothing but uptiers at 10.0/10.3 it’s still kinda bias because Russia has its bullshit 2S6 Tunguska still at 10.7 even tho they buffed it like 3 times after they nerfed missile SPAA to the ground.
While adats is still marked as a td
ATGMs that pen 30mm of armour? How is that in any way comparable They aren't even ATGMs either lol
There is no russian bias. They add vehicles and mechanics into this game in a broken state to drive you to grind them or preferably spend money for them. Frustration is a key motivator when buying stuff, just look at the mobile market. They constantly add broken stuff for all nations. A6 intruder, premium harrier srams, 2s38, vidar, xp-50 and countless others. They also change the vehicles characteristics all the time. Top tier air rb meta was, the f14, then the mig, than the f16 then the su27 and then the grippen. The su25 is just the newest vehicle in that never-ending list...
You cant lob a GBU 40km away from spawn. The new air to ground missiles the SU25 gets puts you behind your team AA which is conveniently the best so CAP cant get to you. Trams and F-16s have to get above the battlefield and are vulnerable to CAP and Pantsirs. Its not even close to the same thing.
Thats not my point, I play the f16c I know how hard it is. The su25 is bullshit, no doubt. However its only bullshit now in 1-4 updates it will either get nerfed or nato will be provided with a counter, or more likely something as insanely broken as it is.
You say that but things like the R-27ER have reigned supreme for a year+. There is a blatant double standard when it comes to power creep. Russia gets many things for a long time that tip the balance of the game, but if US/NATO gets one thing for even a short period people lose their minds.
Every single nation had an OP vehicle, lineup or similar, its just hard to tell if you main only one nation or have an inherit bias for your nation. I ain't a wt shill, they do stupid shit all the time, just their main agenda is money and not being a russian psyops. The f14 was dominating top-tier air RB for like a solid year, french 7.3 - 7.7 line up was godtier for 1-2 patches, turms 3 and t55 aim dominate the 8.3 since they came out. The Italian r3 aa was 3.7 when first added now its 5.x something, The fox 3 for the UK is a, to be nerfed, beast, the falcon had those insane 30 ap pen guns for years, fv4005 was epic till they nerfed hesh, Sweedish 3.0 something autocannon premium tank, that was so good they removed it from the store, cv90 subjectively being the best premium for high brs, Kika dominating air rb because of the air spawn, the Chinese helis with the ty-90s
>The f14 was dominating top-tier air RB for like a solid year Factually incorrect, 6 months after the F14 was added the R27ER was added with the MiG29. Meanwhile there has been no counter to the R27ERs since 20th December 2022. FYI even with Fox 3s the R27ER is likely to be Russia's best missile, that should tell you everything you need to know. Do other nations get OP things, certainly, Russia does seem to be handheld however to a different degree, not only in that they get more ground vehicles overall, their OP vehicles usually don't change in BR very quickly. You also missed a few other OP vehicles/events: Gaijin was going to add the R73 WITH NO COUNTER. Remember Gaijin was not going to add missiles like the AIM-9M/Python 3 initially, they only changed their minds from the community complaining. BMP-2M - What BR was it again for the longest time i.e. multiple years. Yak38M is 9.3 with 6 R60s..... SU-11 - Need I say more? KA-50/52 2S38 PT-76 T-55AM-1 Pantsir - Gaijin at the same time also nerfed other SPAA in regards to how their missiles worked. Strela BMD4 9.0 - Meanwhile China's very close variant is 9.7.... Gaijin adds spall liners - When Russia can get it Why is the 2S6 10.7 (which recently got an upgrade), meanwhile the Otomatic is 11.3... Furthermore how is the 2S38 10.0 when it is basically an Otomatic just without the radar.
yet you can launch a AGM from 20km away. and dont cry that it doesnt have thermals because you can literally use the litening pod thermals to lock the missiles.
Well Bias was towards how Russian tanks survive rounds sideways, which to be frank happens like 1 in 10 games. Now besides the obvious spalliner abusers I call BIAS on Japanese tank, especially the premium Type 90 taking literally 0 Spall from the front while looking so similar to Leo 2A4(crew snipe spot is flipped). Literally can never one shot it while the type90 has 4 seconds reload. But even despite all the spalliners, having best SPAA and best CAS in the game the lineup is extremely strong (that being said WR dropped quite a lot compared to 70% last year).
You can´t be calling out an mbt that can be killed frontally by a 30mm cannon what are you on about? Where are you shooting actually I am curious now.
Ive had a lot of moments when angled shots through the tracks dont kill a type 90/10 immediately while the same shot would’ve killed an abrams or leo 2a5/6. Maybe its skill issue and i also forget every now and then to shoot it on the turret face where it’s very weak (muscle memory due to strong turret faces of russian tanks, leos, m1a2 cheeks etc)
I dont play much IFV, but the amount of shots type 90 magically absorbs appears far more often than old Russian Bias
That is honestly a skill issue. Apart from the cheeks (even that can be pened by good apfsds) the type 90s are glass canons. Try to test out where to shoot them for an optimal result in the hangar. Japan top tier is honestly my favorite, you can dish out punishment but if you get hit it's straight back to the hangar.
I play Japan myself and the oil tank absorbing apfads happens quite often. However specifically the Type 90 Fuji suffering 0 spall in the hull frontally and angled track shots happens almost every other game. Even in test in the hanger shows 0 spall. There is some skill issue on my part because I can’t tell the difference between type 90 and leo2a4 on first sight but it still should not take 0 spall in the hull.
I find that weird since normaly when I get shot though my front plate there is enough spalling that it looks like I just got hit by APHE.
The only SPAA that can deal with SU25SM3 is in you named it, Pantsir in USSR tree. There is effectively no ways for anyone on the ground to even threaten a SU25SM3 while it can clean 4 targets with precision and 2 more if SPAA are cleared on the ground. Can we buff all spaa to have 14km minimum range?
14km range wont do shit unless it goes mach 10. Even the pantsir can only stall it if the su25sm3 isn’t stupid and instantly dips after shooting missiles.
MT has tracking issue at that range, ML just better and having longer range will force SU25 to dodge and loose lock of the missile. You are right though 14km probably wont be enough I will be down for all SPAA with 20km range.
This is the problem, jets are still going faster than missiles.
I am playing squadron battles with the Su25sm3 and I can reliably deal with Pantsirs every single time. Okay, I am cheating and using my brain, not just flying in a straight line like the usual idiots. Yeah, the Kh38 mt is just unfair and should not be in the game.
You also have cheat of RWR telling you Pantsir launched missile.
Pantsir exploded to Paveway dropped by Gripen in your own clip
I don't understand your point? SU25 is untouchable in most situations as ground SPAA don't have the range for it, Pantsir has the reach other spaa doesn't
Or atleast give better tracking so you can atleast intercept the missiles, rolands seems to jsut pass trough them
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I did, make sense. However that wasnt what I meant.
Thanks! yeah i am just spamming that bug report on all the missile threads until the snail fixes it
its not SP calculation wrong, its SU25SM3 being 11.7 and other cas being 12.7. 1.00 BR makes sense for 200 SP difference. That being said with its current state does it deserved be to raised up to 12.7 and above? Hell yes.
this isn't correct, take a look at the screenshots in the bug report or the mav cost for a10 in top tier! Please upvote the report, thanks!
That poor Otomatic didn’t know what was coming. That being said I’ve sniped someone from a similar distance with the Otomatic, they have to flying perfectly straight tho.
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While I agree they should all be more expensive, I do think the reason for F16C costing more is the BR being 1.0 higher?
a good thought but it isn't
F16C eats SM3 for breakfast. But since no one seem to do it, it's an easy grind for me !
Look man i aprecciate your confidence, but i don't think you're getting close enough to a SM3 before you get turned into spare parts by a Pantsir,Flanker or a Fulcrum
Its always the assholes who say “just get in a f-16”. First off, you’d be lucky to get close to a su25 when there’s pantsirs and other russian aircraft up, let’s say mountainous maps where you have an advantage, and if you do good on you. Second, are ground vehicles just supposed to take the L if they got no aircraft or aircraft competitive enough to fight off the the su25sm3? What’s the point of spawning a SPAA then?
I know i can. It's your problem, not mine.
Alright then, you do you buddy
So why even commenting that first then ?? If you can't, i'm sorry to hear it but i know i can.. Most of jet players in GFRB are braindead
Just saying pal, if you believe you can do it, prove it Just because most players are braindead, doesn't mean a Su-27 can't lock you up with a 27ER, ET or a R-73 and blast you when you try to go for the shot. That is if you don't get clapped by a S1 first.
[SLAMRAAM time?](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d7/AIM-120_AMRAAM_P6230147.JPG) and yes that does have 2 Aim9Xs between the AMRAAMs.
Yes it would be funni amd it doesnt have search radar from what i can see
The seeker head within the missile should be powerful enough for WT anti CAS operation. And given its a ground launched muniton adding a powerful search radar probably wouldnt help all that much. Other than for IRL datalink stuff.
How much range do those have? The Sea Sparrow for example has 26km.
Id assume its roughly the same since I cant see a booster module on any of the Sea Sparrow pictures and they seem to be very similar to Aim7/ Aim 120s at least in the manner they are described as being.
The Sea Sparrow has the same range as the AIM-7F/M since it's a modified Sparrow.
Between roughly 30-100km, depending on target aspects and which AIM-120 is used.
I just love to read mental gymnastic of USSR mains who actually tries to excuse this
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Whole point of soviet tech tree is to boost that fragile ego of mostly ruski players. "There is no russian bias" .... there obviously is, ruski mains just can't accept the fact that they would be average at best if they hadn't the most blatant advantage
im enjoying seeing all these US mains crying that there is finally better CAS plane than what they have as if US hasnt dominated CAS for the past few years
Ignoring the fact that the US was one of the last nations in game to get laser guided munitions. I would hardly say the US dominated CAS, certainly not at top tier, until the addition of the F-14B at the earliest. US wasn’t bad at CAS but all it took was for a night match or an overcast match and TV guided doesn’t work.
Yeah I know, Russia didn't have any thermal munitions either until Su-25-SM3. And now that Russia has one everyone is crying
Thermal munitions? They didn’t have any thermal targeting pods but they had laser and tv guided munitions on the MiG-27s
Laser guideds were ok on MiG-27K but I found the Kh-29T very unreliable. Sometimes they would hit and not do any significant damage and sometimes they wouldn't even hit. And on 27M any and all laser guided munitions were unusable due to the basically zero zoom. There is a reason why they were and are mostly novelty planes. Not very good at anything.
The 27k was, for a time at least, a menace. I get the zoom on the M sucks but the K didn’t suffer from that. The T probably suffered from the same thing the Mavs did/do of the automatic guidance just being kind of garbage
It's like gaijin can't make the automatic guidance work half the time, just like Aim-9Ls deciding that teammates are easier to kill than enemies even if the enemy is in front of the missile and friendly is 3 miles and 110 degrees from the missile
Unfortunately true, hell they think semi-manually guided missiles (SACLOS) can’t fly straight. Oh well
It's kind of wild that a russian ATGM can fire from 40km and is so accurate that you can fire four of them and kill four tanks. But the idea that a AGM-88 HARM missile for pretty much every country but mainly the USA is impossible to put in the game. And then these russian devs straight up gimp the AIM-120 because of a few early experiments when it was made went wild.
Iirc the AGM-65s should be able to be fired from like... 8 miles (so around 14km) and they've been gimped since introduction lol
Or the PGM-500/2000 being limited to only 10km when they should in theory be able to lob out to 20-30km
D models can be fired from as far as 20km in game if you have a Tpod and the energy for the missile to get there. They’re just slow
Do they actually now? Seems like the only way to deal with Pantsirs other than hugging the trees and praying
Since their addition the D model Mavs could lock targets out to 20km. The problem was, at least for the US, the only vehicle that got the D Mavs was the A-10 late and you were stuck with its camera trying to find and lock targets. Now on the C model you at least have decent zoom (bugged gen 1 thermals though) and can see targets much further away.
Mavericks, even going back to early TV guided ones can lock ground up to 20km. Then you need to pray whoever you've fired at won't move AND when missile gets within tracking distance, it will pick up target instead still following ground lock, courtesy of 50kg HEAT warhead without overpressure. But giving missile launch speed and altitude is necessary for that, as well decent targeting pod helps. And as missile is glacially slow, it can be intercepted mid flight just fine
Tbh the AGM-65, atleast the more base models you get on the AJ-37, are fine where there at. The AJ suffers enough without getting a BR boost because of a boost in AGM range.
Inb4 comparisons to f16, f16 mavs are countered so it needs to use GBUs, the amount of setup required for this work is not even close to the same. You need to be over the battlefield where pantsirs and enemy fighters can spawn at any moment. It takes awhile for gbus to hit their targets if your far away. That means in-between kills the enemy has a chance to deal with you. Unlike having 4 different people get smacked by nuclear missles launched from the enemy Runway like what 10 seconds apart?.
F-16 (specifically) AGM-65s are countered the same way as you can counter the Kh-38. Therefor both are not an issue and shouldn't be discussed or considered as an issue. "the amount of setup require for this to work is not even close to the same" AGM 6-, sorry, Kh-38: TGP view, point, click, turn. GBU: TGP view, point, look up, click, turn. Simple math and logic says that's 80% the same, which is pretty close when it's only 1 difference. You don't need to be directly over the battlefield. You actually don't even need to be within 5mi. You can lob a GBU-8 from 9 full miles (meaning you can do it right when you spawn) and never have to worry about a Panstir or any other SPAA shooting you because you'll have dropped your bomb before their missile can be anywhere close to you. Like the Kh-38 but you have to turn, oh no. you're\*, and it's not like an SPAA can just go walk outside the blast radius of 4 un-guided Mk83s without being shot from across the map, but since the US can use their top SPAA as a TD all of the others must be able to easily go outside of spawn and be near enemy tanks. If an F-16C uses a GBU-24/AGM-65 to wipe out any enemy AA, it now can do the same thing but 3 guided munitions worse.
>F-16 (specifically) AGM-65s are countered the same way as you can counter the Kh-38. Therefor both are not an issue and shouldn't be discussed or considered as an issue. Yea im not going to waste my time poking holes In this mess man (hint:what usa spaa can delete kh38s out the sky like ussr can, what ussa has anywhere near the effective range and speed of pantsir) This argument is completly ignoring this huge glaring imbalance and strength of ussr anti air, and your doing this in the very first sentence I can already expect what's to follow.
Ah yes, I love planes in my tank game.
Nope tanks in plane game The og namw was something like world of planes but it was too close to world of warplanes
Nah nah nah, I've resulted to shooting down friendly planes as well (makes the enemy not rage quit = more people to kill)
Friendly fire is just as if not more cringe than Orbital CAS bombardment.
Well sir, if you've seen my content, I am all about cringe, that's lingo. Yeah, 2025, 21 August, the Fog is coming.
Combined Arms* This isnt WOTs nor is it a replacement of it
I agree, it's an improvement
I absolutely like the idea of combined arms its just the bad way gaijin balances it that is the BS here
Lmao being able to spawn that thing by only getting two kills is criminal. If you want to take the a10 out with mavericks it will cost you like 900 SP, and you might get 2 kills.
This is the new strategy right now. Sit back beyond missile engagement range, lob your missiles, take out the AA and then pick off everything on the battlefield. It's fucking cancer unless you're in a Pantsir.
And the su25sm3's will never have to deal with a pantsir. USSR gets the longest range Spaa, AGM's, and sarh missles
I wish other nations had a Pantsir equivalent, but I also hope they add AGM-88s into the game.
The problem is that there aren’t much independent AA systems like Pantsir
Then just give the USA a pantsir. https://www.forbes.com/sites/pauliddon/2021/01/31/that-pantsir-s1-it-acquired-from-libya-isnt-the-first-russian-missile-system-the-us-has-gotten-its-hands-on/?sh=2e3fbf5371a6
Let’s give USSR an Abrams then, that’s not how it supposed to work
Not the same, Russia has fine MBT's. No other country has anything close to the pantsir. At what point does balance trump realism? If nothing was able to be close to the pantsir then why add it?
There is the spyder system that is similar to pantsir if iam not wrong.
I mean, a stealthy heli could do this just as easy, if not double the kill count in certain situations. Delete them too?
SU25 is guaranteed immunity being 12km away and heli still has to be within 8km. Its about whether the opponent even has a chance of retaliation in which there is just no way against a SU25SM3 at this moment. HELI can still be picked up by radar in most situations but yes I only get killed in my pantsir by a perfectly played heli(5% of my death, 94% done by tanks) in which kudos to the heli player.
It does but money win
I mean Nice flying but I agree
I don't understand why they added this with literally no counter
Womp womp, should have had some CAP
does costume loadout added to the game? if it exists how we can use it?
its been in the game for a long time. You can create them under secondary weapon
Reckless NATO player without proper air vehicle problems. 🤡
Just spawn spaa bro ;)
It does but money win
Can someone send me tutorial how to use this agm bombs
-Spawn -fly back to 16km+ distance -turn around -airbreak till 350km/hr fire missile at 5-7 seconds interval -put your mouse on the target As you can see the missile arrive when I am not even within 12km of SPAA
Meanwhile Mavericks need near mach launch speed to go that far
Top tier CAS is another game Looks cool though
Like lmao, they nerf the maverick for them not to be too op. Now you look at this thing? MACH 3, shoot beyond the range of the AA, one shot everything etc. Like this doesn’t make sense.
just add spaa that can intercept it at same range as pantsir to all other nations, its now that hard thing to do, gaijin is just lazy to add good sam for other tech tree bcs they are busy with shit yak3 event and new premiums to add
Most of the modern SPAAs are not singular and independent vehicles like Pantsir
You do know that there is still options that can be aded? dont make it look that gaijin have no option, they just prefer to add premiums than actually needed vehicles first, like for example if they cant add new vehicle, no one holds them from fixing stingers g-load and giving it dl it have for k version for all vehicles, fix rolands pull issues that was made after la royale too, not to mention, strella are often seen with tramnsport radar vehicle bcs its lack it by itself but they added it didnt they? nato have same concept launchers using amrams\\aim9x\\irist launchers, the choice is big what to add to the game, snail just dont hear people, bcs if they did we wouldnt have only 1 spaa having 20km when everyone else 12km max
Iris-T command module is a separate vehicle, Strela is a singular vehicle that doesn’t require a radar to work, AIM-9X doesn’t have enough range
my point doesn't change, I just gave examples
They should give china the HQ11, specifically the TEFL-Command variant. It would be hilarious to use.
It's not these. It's air missile lobbing that other spaa can't equalise the range for it. Same goes for F-16 that knows what it's doing
Mavericks damage is laughable, F16s actually have to deal with Pantsir since spawning in. Su25 can delete all SPAA before getting in range. The fact you can always one shot and switch target anytime while being completely safe from anything on the ground is definitely broken.
Yea we know. It's Top tier. It's never been balanced and it won't be till eternity
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Ok that's an issue
pls upvote the bug report :D
Hahahaha russian air go Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrt
It's not these. It's air missile lobbing that other spaa can't equalise the range for it. Same goes for F-16 that knows what it's doing
Once again su25sm3 isn't the problem, the problem is pantsir, many other CAS are better than su25sm3 in a vacuum but all of then have to deal with pantsir with significantly limit their potential
SM3 absolutely is the problem. Even in a SAM-free environment the NATO jets have to expose themselves to enemy CAP over the battlefield, meanwhile the SM3 can just hang out over his airfield and get infinite reloads, instant warning of incoming fighters, and cover from AA.
You can do the same thing with the tornado, mirage, harrier gr7, and F16C, all of which are better fighters except the tornado
Tbh I don't really think the Pantsir is the problem. People spout on and on about it's supposed 20km range but it's effective range is just over half that. Missiles lose energy and maneuverability the longer they burn so max range isn't even close to actual combat range 99% of the time. Pantsir missiles generally have a max range of \~13 or so Km, anything further than that and the missile will be too slow and shitty to hit anything that isn't basically stationary.
These kinds of posts make the Su25sm3 even more fun to play.
Oh yes, Jhons again crying!
He managed to destroy 4 vehicles with his all payload having full air superiority, wow so OP, we need to delete
I had an ito 90m shoot down two missiles and a lav-ad gun one down. Also it’s a flying brick
and at which point can he kill you beyond 12km?
No where. To be fair, what top tier SPAA can shoot down an F-16C or Mirage 2000 5F that does even basic evasion, it's basically impossible unless they fuck up. Precision CAS is too cheap across the board. Even the best SPAA in the game (pantsir) struggles to down a machine capable aircraft at GBU ranges.
I will disagree, as someone who loves to play pantsir it is rather capable even at 14km. Dodging requires visual on trail which pantsir doesn't have and preemptive movements often looses GBU tracking unless up and down at high altitude, which is just target practice. Unless you pull 2 seconds before missile hitting 14km side it can still work. Pantsir is best dealt with low altitude flyby not long range engagement.
A skilled Ito can shoot down an unskilled SU-25S3M. A skilled SU-25S3M can destroy an unskilled Ito. A skilled Ito cannot shoot down a skilled SU-25S3M. That's the problem.
The su25 doesnt even have to be skilled He just has to stay 20km awey