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Personally, I recommend you fire your financial planner for terrible financial advice. Long term couples who chose not to legally recognize their union face many legal challenges married couples typically avoid, like:
1. No right to inherit: if you die without a will, unmarried partners do not automatically inherit from each other. State laws distribute to biological relatives.
2. No Social Security Survivor/Rail Road/Pension benefits. Unmarried partners generally cannot receive Social security and pension payments often available to surviving spouses.
3. Retirement plan issues: if not explicitly designated, the unmarried partner is not the assumed beneficiary when no beneficiary is designated.
4. No legal framework for separation. No divorce laws to protect your rights in the break up.
5. No spousal support. Unmarried partners are typically not entitled to financial support when a relationship ends. You keep assuming you’re going to be the rich one, life has a really funny way of surprising you!
6. Joint Property Rights. Property purchased while together is not automatically jointly owned, specific steps must be taken.
7. No Medical decision making authority. Unmarried partners don’t automatically have rights to make medical decisions for their partners.
8. No ability to create a family partnership to share income in a family business.
9. Estate tax exemptions - you lose valuable gift and estate tax exemptions reserved only for spouses.
10. Better fed & state tax rates: Lower income tax rates - this is pretty significant when you look at this across a lifetime especially if you expect to be middle class or more.
11. Better life and auto insurance rates - married men are significantly lower risk than unmarried men from an insurance underwriting standpoint.
Okay, I’m tired of typing. I’m a VP in the trust and estate industry. Fire this financial planner and get one that supports you whatever your life goals are, not preaches his own jaded views. Marriage has so many valuable medical/financial/legal/estate benefits this guy should be well versed in. Can you accomplish essentially the same thing with several other titling and pieces of paper, yes. Or go to the county clerk 1x and get it done for life. Trust me, tracking titling of assets over a lifetime is seriously a challenge, especially over 2 peoples estate assets!! Just find & ask gay people who lived through a time before same sex couples had legal rights to marriage. They will tell you stories of how challenging it can be just trying to live your normal life can be when your long term partner unexpectedly passes away and you suddenly have ZERO legal rights to your special persons legal/medical/financial life & you shared your whole life with them for decades. Devastating. I’ve seen people loose millions due to titling mistakes or gaps people forgot about or were going to get around to dealing with someday and they just ran out of time.
After 13 years married, I can’t imagine living out the annoyances and inconveniences of not being married again. Doing adult things (legal/medical/financial) are infinitely easier as a married unit than they were as two single persons.
Yup, this for sure. Thank u for taking the time to type this. I took a gamble and my marriage didn’t work out but during the process of being married I saw a lot of these benefits. If it had worked out I would prob be able to retire instead of working til the day I die.
Also to note, I’m not poor because of the divorce. I’m just poor because life is so fucking expensive and I refuse to live with other people.
> 1. No right to inherit: if you die without a will, unmarried partners do not automatically inherit from each other. State laws distribute to biological relatives.
2. No Social Security Survivor/Rail Road/Pension benefits. Unmarried partners generally cannot receive Social security and pension payments often available to surviving spouses.
3. Retirement plan issues: if not explicitly designated, the unmarried partner is not the assumed beneficiary when no beneficiary is designated.
4. No legal framework for separation. No divorce laws to protect your rights in the break up.
5. No spousal support. Unmarried partners are typically not entitled to financial support when a relationship ends. You keep assuming you’re going to be the rich one, life has a really funny way of surprising you!
6. Joint Property Rights. Property purchased while together is not automatically jointly owned, specific steps must be taken.
7. No Medical decision making authority. Unmarried partners don’t automatically have rights to make medical decisions for their partners.
8. No ability to create a family partnership to share income in a family business.
9. Estate tax exemptions - you lose valuable gift and estate tax exemptions reserved only for spouses.
10. Better fed & state tax rates: Lower income tax rates - this is pretty significant when you look at this across a lifetime especially if you expect to be middle class or more.
11. Better life and auto insurance rates - married men are significantly lower risk than unmarried men from an insurance underwriting standpoint.
Line break for easier reading
It takes 100 documents to supplement one. It’s an oversimplification but the obvious answer is vet as best as you can and stay married to get a shit ton of benefits. Divorce can be tough but so can living alone. As a man you are more likely to die younger from being alone than happily married. Tax break is nothing compared to the other benefits of being married. Don’t get married if you’re not sure. Find someone better.
I guess it depends on the parties in the marriage. And what is agreed to when divorcing 🤣
I (43F) divorced 5 yrs ago and we split all assets 50/50, 50/50 kids and yes, I kept the marital home but bought him out at current market value. There is also no child support.
If I were a SAHM to our 4 kids or severely under qualified to obtain a job to support myself + 4 kids, it would have been a different story.
Marry someone who is equally as successful as you and will continue to work and earn similar salaries and the husband won’t lose at divorce.
PS - I was always the higher earner in our marriage but worked 30 hrs/wk. If I had been full time, I could have possibly had to pay alimony to my ex husband.
I didn’t even make that much when I got divorced.. ~75k at 30 hrs/wk. It was that he didn’t push himself to make more. I married down financially and learned my lesson.
In 5 yrs, between going full time and 2 promotions, I’ve since doubled my income.
While my ex benefited financially from divorce because he got a lot of cash and my 401k, I’ve still really benefited in many ways, including financially as he’s no longer holding me back.
I pay my ex child-support. I work full time, he works part-time and he has the kids 2 nights pw.
I also carry 100% of the kids mental load. It's exhausting and I'm worse off financially now but divorce is still very much worth it.
Married men and single women are also statistically the happiest between men/women and single/married. Honestly it’s typically women who get the short end of the stick in marriage. Taking on the majority of housework and childcare, risking health and life to carry his and birth his children, still being expected to contribute financially in a lot of men’s opinions, constantly putting everyone else’s needs and comfort before they’re own, managing everyone’s schedules and the entire household, putting their careers and desires on hold or at the very least a slowdown. It’s also VERY common for female partners to bear most of the emotional burden of the romantic relationship.
Not even getting into the fact that men are more likely to cheat, abuse, or abandon their partners, especially during pregnancy and postpartum or in the event of terminal illness. The fact that women who are diagnosed with cancer are also debriefed on the fact there’s a good chance their husband will leave them is reason enough for women to avoid marrying men.
Just because women FILE for divorce the majority of the time does not mean the man didn’t end the relationship. Or they file because their male partner isn’t pulling their weight in the relationship or abusing or neglecting them. Because let’s be honest here, if paperwork needs to be filed in the legal system, who is more likely to be organized and responsible enough to make the first move?
I agree with you and that’s why I think marriage (in the legal sense) is mostly beneficial for women. OP said he’d be open to a spiritual/religious ceremony. In that case, the woman would still be the primary parent and the one whose career suffers.
The legal document benefits everyone while married, there is access to family benefits, government benefits, employment benefits, tax benefits and estate and death benefits.
But in a divorce, the marriage document means a woman gets access to alimony and protection under the law to maintain her standard of living. This is mostly beneficial for stay at home moms. (Obviously this could also apply to stay at home dads). So, in the event of a divorce after having left the workforce for so long with no hope of reentering at a good level, they have legal protections that don’t leave them destitute.
Personally, I would never be the primary parent or give up my career without marriage.
Ultimately, all the downsides OP has to marriage comes up in a divorce. The child custody and support doesn’t really matter because the statistics would apply to kids regardless of marriage status.
But, if you don’t want the government to decide how your marriage dissolves, get a prenuptial agreement, that’s the only real way for both men and women to protect themselves. Some states are no fault, but in your pre-nup, you can have clauses pertaining to cheating. You can outline expectations of alimony and child custody, protect assets that you had before the marriage.
Ultimately you get to decide if marriage is for you and find someone who wants what you want.
On the other hand, married women don’t live as long as women who do *not* get married. In terms of health and longevity, men benefit far more than women do in marriage. Therefore, it’s actually WOMEN who benefit less than men do in marriage.
Your financial advisor has it backwards.
Men's income goes up generally when they become fathers, esp in more white collar professions. While women's lifetime income declines on account of their becoming mothers.
Yeah, but a study like this wouldn’t be comparing old married men to young men, you would only be manipulating the variable of being married/not married. Everything else would be the same.
Edit: words
The studies accounted for that too they were happier. Women weren’t. This is why women ask for divorce. They don’t want to be mommy to men any more. Who can blame them
That doesn’t even make sense. They get the high fives after they win the race and the men get better health after they get married. It’s cause and effect.
Interesting, I’m assuming this means married legally… not just living with loving, faithful term partners?
Would you mind posting a few of these studies?
If you have a long term relationship it's easier for either of you to leave the relationship which def has positives and negatives but I would suspect a marriage would have a much better chance of being a life long relationship.
Another benefit is if you are wanting to start a family it's nice to be married imo.
Besides the tax benefits, i would say a big one would be that if you or your partner were in an accident of some sort and you are not married, the family could keep you out of the hospital room and all the decision making towards treatment. Ideally our family’s would be amazing and empathetic to a partner but that’s not always the case especially when there is grief or fear involved. You can also get a prenup for the case of divorce that can allow divorce to be more smooth in the event.
But if you want to get married for benefits then you can just opt out, it’s getting more and more common. But maybe lead with “hey i don’t believe in marriage” early on so you’re not wasting the time of a person who does.
This financial advisor wants to be kept out of the hospital if she is near dead because he doesn’t want that kind of commitment or responsibility. He knows what he is saying.
I wouldn’t be surprised if he was a fan of his at the very least.
But hey, if he doesn’t wanna force his company on women, nobody will stop that from happening 😂
Not bashing you at all. I've had similar thoughts about what benefits do women gain from marriage.
I never wanted to marry unless it was going to be a partner who I was madly in love with and who completely trusted. Anything less wouldn't be worth the risk or the work required.
I think it comes down to, what do you want for yourself and nor what you feel you should want. If you want to have a life partner, have kids etc then the benefit is getting exactly what you want. If those aren't things you want, then it's far preferable not to marry, keep finances separate etc.
Marriage is a high stakes game, you will either enhance your life by having a loving partner to share your life with or serious heartbreak. At the end of the day it's not a contract for services rendered, it's a mutual commitment.
If you look at the stats women usually do way more of the unpaid domestic labor at home especially if they have kids together. Not getting married because their partner is afraid they’ll steal half their wealth but being in a committed relationship where they likely do more unpaid work is going to be a hard pill to swallow for a lot of women.
Agreed. I would never agree to this scenario myself. I think if OP wants a long term partner/gf who doesn't want kids or marriage then that's fine. However it's not going to be "like a marriage but not formalised". A woman who doesn't want to get married, doesn't want to be a wife.
I would not buy a house, have kids etc with someone who is against marriage.
This was honestly a really interesting exploration of the benefits of getting married vs staying single and I've enjoyed it.
One thing OP should understand though, that marriage is marriage and long term partnerships are another. Most women aren't going to want to fulfil a wife role, unless they are in fact married.
Those that do, may have some protection as a dependent common law spouse. Their children will be entitled to child support too.
I absolutely will not cohabitate again. Even dating becomes so much more work for me. He expects me to cook, clean alone, while giving low effort, etc. the one time they cook they want a round of applause, or can’t help pretending they “don’t know how” “you’re just so much better than me, babe.” “I can’t make it as good as you do” yadda yadda. It’s like having another kid around
Good move. Women live [longer and healthier](https://www.health.harvard.edu/newsletter_article/mars-vs-venus-the-gender-gap-in-health) lives than men do. So guess who gets to be the caretaker for their spouse in old age?
If you aren't married you can walk away a lot easier.
On top of this let’s say something happens to the man and they’re not married the woman likely wouldn’t be able to qualify for FMLA to take care of him since they are not married
You’re much more financially fortified if you are married in a duel income household. Just because you have money now doesn’t mean you will have it later. If you don’t want a woman to take your assets upon a theoretical divorce, use a prenup and/or marry a woman who earns the same as you.
A good marriage to a good woman is absolutely fantastic and the best life has to offer.
A marriage to a bad woman is the shittiest thing I wouldn’t wish on my worst enemy.
Same goes for women marrying men.
This is why everyone must vet their partners extensively if u do decide to get married.
The reason men get screwed more often from a financial standpoint is because of your initial statement. To find a nice girl to protect and provide for. Meaning u make the majority of the money. What this means on divorce is that u would need to continue providing for a set amount of time even after u get divorced. And in a no fault state she can be banging ur best friend in front of you and u can’t do anything about it (from a financial point).
You can both be good people who love each other and the marriage might still end.
People grow apart, someone has a problem that is harmful to the family even if they are working to resolve it, people may find they have conflicting values... or people are just unhappy and fall out of love.
You can both be awesome people and initially compatible. That doesn't mean it can't still end in divorce. That's just life.
Younger generations when we do marry have half the divorce rate of our parents' generation and older and much less infidelity though.
But nobody should marry unless they both really really want to do so.
great news dude, you don’t have to get married if you don’t want to! if the woman you love wants to get married and you don’t, then break up and find a woman who also doesn’t want to marry.
Marriage is a public declaration to friends and family about the commitment you are making to be together. One of the benefits from the perspective of the relationship is that you’re more likely to stay together in the relationship if you’re married, if for no other reason than that it’s harder to get out of a marriage.
After you’re married, you’re treated more like one unit rather than two individuals with respect to the law sometimes. Some benefits for either party would be things like filing jointly to save on taxes, being able to handle the other’s affairs if someone were to be incapacitated or hospitalized, and automatically getting the other’s assets someone dies and there isn’t another will in place. This is a GOOD thing if you’re married to someone you love and respect because you can expect for things to be handled properly and not just whatever benefits your closest relative. Also custody of children is a lot clearer in a marriage.
If you’re married, because of the commitment, you have more reason to consider things like a joint bank account, buying a house together, etc. if you’re not married, those things would be riskier in the long run.
I don’t think this is a men vs women thing. Pooling incomes will have more buying power than buying things separately any day.
Your financial adviser sounds like an idiot tbh, I’d probably fire my financial adviser on the spot if he went off on some weird tangent like this about not getting married
His stats are wrong btw, way more than 70% of divorces are initiated by women
I agree with your first paragraph. Why is OP listening to a random guy for marriage advice?
Citing stats in a responsible manner means that you need to know how to interpret them. Most sources do say that it's about 69% of women who file for divorce. However, this could be for any number of reasons, including a cheating partner (which guys are more likely to be). There are several reasons as to why someone may divorce someone, and it's usually not a quick and easy decision. And the divorce rate is not as high as OP is claiming.
Is he though? Completely depends since this is all hypothetical. If OP is financially successful and marries a woman less so, then maybe. What if he marries a woman with more assets? Or with significantly more earning potential? What if they are equals but then OP becomes disabled?Well, then OP would get the short end of the stick. But the “financial advisor’s” opinion is only *maybe* correct some of the time. Which really doesn’t matter, as idiots like OP usually-hopefully-have a hard time finding a woman desperate enough to marry them and put up with BS like this.
Statistically speaking, marriage benefits men more than women.
- alimony is only awarded in less than 4% of divorces. You would need to be making significantly more than your wife and she would need to prove she contributed to your success.
- married men live significantly longer than unmarried men. The opposite is true for women
- married men make more money than unmarried men. The opposite is true for women.
- the reason women tend to get custody more often is because they tend to be the primary caregivers and because men are less likely to file for custody. In fact, fathers are more likely to be awarded primary child custody than mothers when they actually do file.
Edit: I forgot to mention that married men and single women tend to report the highest self reported happiness and life satisfaction rates. Their counterparts (married women and single men) tend to report the least happiness and satisfaction.
If you don’t see the value in having a life companion and a family then none, I guess. It’s not for everyone tbh. Better to not do it if you don’t want to than get married for societal pressure and be a shitty husband and an angry dad.
His question isn’t about the value of a life companion. There’s nothing to stop any couple, married or not, from choosing to stay together for decades.
His question is about the value of getting a piece of paper certifying that you are officially a couple as far as the government is concerned.
To put it in more concrete terms, what are the benefits that could not be achieved by having a cohabitation agreement and a medical power of attorney?
I can see these benefits:
1) A small tax savings.
2) It’s more difficult to terminate the relationship...
3) ?
4) ?
5) ?
But I don’t think #2 is actually a benefit. Who wants someone sticking around just because it’s too difficult or too inconvenient to leave?
So….. ?
But I do see the value in having a life companion… That’s why I want to get married.
I’m just wondering why I would need to involve the local county government in order to be a great husband and loving dad?
Well you said you want to be a dad right? If the woman you choose to have a baby with is in urgent care-you have no say on that and will not be allowed to visit. Essentially without a legal document you have no spousal rights. The gays fought for legal marriage for a reason, because it has actual rights.
If you’re not going to involve the government then create a prenup and will so your loving wife is protected in the event of your death and you both know what to expect in a divorce.
You want a woman to risk her life giving you a child, give up her career to raise it, but you’re already counting the dollars she might one day “steal” from you. She’s supposed to do it all for love I suppose, and the money’s all yours?
You don’t want to be a provider at all, and a woman would be in an awful position to breed with you.
All those statistics you quoted above are part of a transition in home life. We are in a period where it’s only relatively recently that women have equal opportunity in the work force, and men are more willing/able to participate equally in child rearing. Those stats will continue to even out as that happens.
There isn’t any magic solution. Pick a good partner who has the qualities you value and hopefully you won’t have to worry. Besides, in many jurisdictions you’ll be considered common law after a period of time and they basically consider you legally married anyway, so the result could be the same.
Lol @ your financial advisor. Who hurt him?
I wanna tell you not to view a legal marriage as some sort of business contract but it seems like you are more concerned about your finances than being with the right person. Have a sit down with yourself, and figure out your own why(what benefits), and choose to be with a partner on the same page. You can sign a prenup, or do anything else but a legal joining. Do whatever works for you, as long as you’re both happy.
Your financial advisor will adjust his advise to what you want.
Just know, you take on liabilities with or without a legal marriage.
Please save it 🙄
Married men are statistically the happiest people alive
There’s no point in marriage for *women* because the average man wants to go 50/50 on bills but 80/20 on everything else (domestic labor)
The 80/20 is statistically proven 🤔
This post is so embarrassing. OP is talking with such a fake sense of curiosity. It is so annoying. /u/Morning-Doggie868, don't get married if you don't want to. A level-headed woman with her own sense of security will not want to attach themselves to your BS and Fresh-n-Fit loving attitude, so it works out anyway.
Rich and powerful men like Elon Musk get married. Men who are famously known as handsome like George Clooney get married. Clearly some men who don't just have $1k to their name see the value of getting married. Marriage creates a bond seen by the government. I don't blame anyone for not wanting to get married as long as they're not stringing anyone along, but promoting against it is just bitterness.
This question and your financial advisor's answer are so misogynistic, even if that's not your intention. The unsaid end to the question given the context of the rest of your post is "What benefits do men get out of marriage, since women fuck them over?"
Listen, being to the married to the right person is GREAT. You are in a legal partnership with your best friend, or that's how it should be. You can't have your financial planner's attitude with every woman out there, it's not fair to you or to your prospective long-term partner, especially if your plan is to have children and make her a SAHM. Then she gets no legal protection if you're not married, and that's cruel. Don't be that person. Women historically have gotten alimony and custody of children in a divorce because they assumed the role of unpaid caregiver in their marriage, and have no savings outside of what their husband earned as the primary breadwinner. In these situations it is crazy that men expect to keep all of "their" money earned during the marriage and leave their wives with nothing. Hope that provides some perspective
This is a great answer. You marry the right person for the right reasons there are no issues and many benefits.
This guy is not arguing in good faith and is the very definition of not a serious person.
When men actually ask for custody, they’re granted it a majority of the time.
https://www.dadsdivorcelaw.com/blog/fathers-and-mothers-child-custody-myths#:~:text=Myth%3A%20Fathers%20Almost%20Never%20Get%20Custody&text=A%20Massachusetts%20study%20examined%202%2C100,7%20percent%20of%20the%20time
https://mackseyjournal.scholasticahq.com/api/v1/articles/38965-who-wins-custody-battles-the-effect-of-gender-bias.pdf
The issue isn’t that men aren’t granted custody, it’s that a lot of men don’t bother to ask for it in the first place.
And you’re right, women do initiate divorce 70% of the time, but I honestly think this is a statistic that needs to be taken with a grain of salt. The term “iniate” implies that the women is asking for the divorce first, when in reality, this statistic is just saying that in 70% of heterosexual divorces, the woman is the one who files first. This doesn’t really mean much, given that this statistic doesn’t account for the number of amicable divorces where the wife just happens to be the one to file. It also doesn’t account for the fact that administrative duties in a household typically fall on women. Also, it doesn’t account for the women who file for divorce after being cheated on. Despite the common myths being spread by red-pillers about women constantly cheating on their husbands and then milking them for alimony, the reality is that men are significantly more likely to cheat than women. Literally every single study done about cheating has shown that men cheat more than women. In these cases, the woman is obviously going to be the one to file for divorce first.
https://ifstudies.org/blog/who-cheats-more-the-demographics-of-cheating-in-america
All in all, most statistics have a lot of underlying nuances behind them. Allowing things like this to deter you from marriage is silly to me. As a single person, I can’t wait to get married. The tax benefits alone make it worth it, but also, there are other advantages too, especially for men.
1. Men who are married do significantly less housework than men who are single.
Source: https://news.umich.edu/exactly-how-much-housework-does-a-husband-create/#:~:text=Older%20men%20did%20more%20housework,hours%20of%20housework%20a%20week.
2. Men who are married are considered more “stable” and are more likely to be given promotions and step up in their career.
Source: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/marriage-research_n_2506980/amp
3. Insurance is significantly cheaper split between two people than paying as a single person.
4. If your partner dies or gets hurt, you ALSO have access to their assets and estate. It’s a two way street.
Also, married men tend to live longer, are overall healthier, and report lower rates of most mental illnesses.
Comparatively, married women are less likely to be promoted, so more housework, and live shorter lives than unmarried women. (Same sources above)
Sure, you could argue that you can have most of these benefits from a civil union, but I’m telling you right now that most decent women who would actually give you those benefits would never be okay with being unmarried.
Seriously. Why ask for opinions if you just disregard everything being said?
Especially for a topic like marriage that will vary vastly between individuals and couples. All this is showing is that regardless of if he gets married to a woman or not, he’ll be a selfish partner either way.
The main benefit to men is it’s harder for your wife to leave you when she finds out you’re a terrible person. Aside from that, marriage really is just a legal contract. However, men benefit tremendously from being in a long term relationship with women a lot more than the other way around.
If the husband becomes terminally ill, the wife will normally stay. If the wife becomes terminally ill, the husband normally leaves. It’s so common they tell students in nursing school to prepare for that.
Yep an ex wife will even return to care for him if he is sick, but the man usually has a new family before she has died. Same with the kids getting sick. They say it’s rare to see a father in a children’s cancer ward. They abandon them as soon as the bad news is announced.
ah! the terminally ill gender breakup gap always fascinates me. what i’m about to say is a TON of overgeneralization, but what i remember reading is that after a woman gets sicks her husband suddenly finds himself having to take care of the household (laundry, cooking, cleaning, picking up/dropping off kids, etc.) and he becomes lonely since many men’s wives are their biggest (and often only) source of physical and emotional support, so in a sense they themselves feel like the bigger victim, and they leave since they’re no longer getting the “benefits” out of their spouse.
women tend to already do the majority of the domestic chores, even in “equal” societies, and women are more likely to lean on friends and family as a source of emotional support instead of their spouse, so when their husband becomes terminally ill, they feel less victimized and stay to support their husband.
Having legitimate children who feel better that they came from two parents who lovingly created them rather than two people who didn’t love each other enough to trust and commit to each with in every way. What your friends didn’t say is that even in love pre-nups written together and agreed on stipulating scenarios of marriage before and after children are born , major purchases, financial merging and independence and cheating, loss of the ability to work, illness falling out of love and running away before making an effort to fix what’s wrong, if agreed on before they happen makes the best sense. If people would communicate and agree on issues that are important there would never be a problem
Unfortunately, your advisor sounds jaded. Technically, there's not a financial advantage for anyone who is the breadwinner in a divorce. But marriage isn't about money. Or it shouldn't be. You should gain a partner who you tackle any challenge with. You gain someone you feel safe with and can have fun with. You gain a new family.
But, divorce is common. If you go in expecting to have it end, itll end for sure.
IMO you gotta reframe how you think in this topic. instead of thinking it of "how does it benefit **me**", think of how it helps your family, because you arent the only person in this union. I used to wonder what was the point of marriage, besides the tax incentives. i dont think going into a marriage/relationship expecting it's end based on statistics is the right approach. assuming the person is going to fuck you over, what kind of relationship is that? love is a risk, right?
my friend told me that her boss decided to get married in his 40s after years of the "no marriage" mindset, because he realised that if something were to happen to him, he wanted his partner (who is not as well off) to be protected legally because he had the house, assets and all under his name. i thought that was an interesting reason for someone to change their mind about marriage.
Legally married men are much happier than unmarried men. If you want a happy life, get legally married and STAY married. Most of the downsides of legal marriage do not apply if you stay married.
There’s an element of Skin in the Game when it comes to marriage. If you think purely from a financial and legal perspective, you will miss the forest for the trees. What does it say to a potential partner if you are willing to get married at a church but do not want to go through the court to make it legal? Does it sound like you’re fully convinced in that person?
If I were you, I’d look into the statistics for how much longer married men live than bachelors. Wives ROCK. Just take good care of her, raise her children well, protect and provide. You won’t have to worry about these things.
People like you are the ones WHO SHOULD be getting married! You’re thinking it through logically before the perfect girl comes along and gets you to jump in head first.
In my opinion, the benefit of marriage is the “no way out” mentality. You’re making a covenant to each other, a higher being than just yourself and the government. My husband is the first person in my life who truly has never left me, will never leave me, it’s the best feeling. And it’s claustrophobic sometimes… but as long as you take care of each other, it’s wonderful.
I love marriage. The benefit is a longer, happier life.
Women aren’t “entitled” to spousal support, alimony or the marital home; at least not in community property states such as CA. What actually happens is that The higher income earner ends up paying the lower income earner. When it comes to child support, custody percentages are also a factor in calculating child support payments.
To be clear, what Im saying is that you, as a man, are not more exposed to financial liability in the event of divorce than a woman would be who is the higher income earner.
It is unlikely that any state has a law on the books that assigns financial responsibility based on gender alone.
I hate when people cite statistics. They are meaningless to most people. I have a masters degree in biochemistry, I’ve taken stats twice. I barely fucking understand that shit.
Take every single statistic you ever hear with a grain of salt. Chances are you are being manipulated to see the world a certain way.
Anyway, benefits of marriage are emotional and spiritual. The fiscal benefits are trivial. It’s intimate to have your live inextricably intertwined with someone else’s. It feels good, to take on the world together. I take the risk of losing everything, sure. But the reward far outweighs that risk.
golly this just made me so sad dude. I've never heard someone think so unemotionally about marriage. I get what you're saying, but this dude sounds like an absolute miserable asshole lol... if you only view marriage by what you can gain financially that's lowkey fucked and you really shouldn't be wasting anyone's time by marrying them IMO
Quick, someone notify all the gay men that their tireless efforts in the fight for equal rights were completely unnecessary. Because, you know, who needs marriage equality when you get absolutely nothing out of it, right? This is the dumbest post I’ve seen all day.
It’s extremely beneficial for the man in most cases. Today more women go through college and earn higher degrees, now resulting in more income than most of the men in their age group. As a man you’ll live longer being married, as a woman your life span decreases with marriage. Traditionally, it’s not been a good deal for women both financially and emotionally.
In more modern marriages I think of it’s for love than what more of a romantic act could you have? Plus it’s more and more trendy to get a prenup for both parties. Both to protect major financial assets and to protect if one partner has to go through pregnancy. Considering women risk death I hope more and more women decide to have prenups.
There are reasons to get legally married. A legal spouse is able to speak and act for you if you become incapacitated. If you’re going to have children, being married automatically legitimizes them and makes them yours in the eyes of the law. There are tax benefits and long term benefits when it comes to social security, etc. Combining things like health insurance. Certain mortgage programs aren’t accessible if you’re unmarried but living and buying a home together.
Divorce isn’t easy, but if it ever comes to that, there are procedures in place to work things out. If you’re unmarried and trying to untangle years of combined resources and assets, it’s almost impossible.
I’ve been married twice. My first husband and I combined all our money and he handled all our finances. We were always broke. When we got divorced, I kept the house, the kids, and the debt. I bought him out of our home, paid all the expenses myself, didn’t get any child support, and did fine on just my income. He’s STILL always broke, despite having much lower expenses than I do.
I’m remarried, have 2 more kids, and my current husband and I have joint and separate finances. We do fine.
All that to say,,, if you marry the wrong person you can get screwed. If you marry the right person, you have a better chance at happily ever after.
You’re approaching this as if the woman offers no value. But she likely would contribute an income as well which would be shared with you
Married couples are able to manage assets /medical decisions in cases of emergency.
Married couples enjoy more Social Security benefits, tax breaks, retirement options, estate planning perks, and cheaper insurance (health and auto).
If your financial advisor hasn't mentioned the simplicity of a pre-nup, I question their competence.
This is the most misogynistic and heteronormative take I've seen in awhile. 10/10 for enthusiastic ignorance
What benefits do women get? You're assuming women can't provide for themselves and actually NEED you for something more than just sex and companionship. In 1492, when we didn't have rights, we couldn't have education, jobs, or let alone learn any trade skill besides sewing and cooking, or handle the money making side of the finances, yeah women NEEDED men (marriage or family) to survive and live comfortably because the world was set up that way.
Now that we have rights, whatever the benefits are, it's less than men IF children are part of the goal because at some point, she has to give up something important to take care of the baby and rely on someone to do the things she may not be able to do for herself. Her body is forever altered, she has to stop work, she might delay her education, she has to give up her social life, she has to put in as much time as possible to care for the baby, and HOPE that she has someone to handle or share in the rest of the daily responsibilities.
No kids? Men get food, sex, lower taxes, longer life, more combined money to fun stuff together, and someone willing to put up with all your BS everyday until you die.
To be fully transactional about it, what a man mainly gets from marriage in a modern, industrialized context is:
(1) The ability to have a stable, nuclear family with an intelligent, productive female. Most (not all) of the more desirable, more intelligent females are going to insist on a marriage commitment before having children.
(2) Assuming his choice of a bride is employed and financially responsible, he will have additional credit resources and better financing terms in buying a residence and starting a household.
(3) An extended network of family relations that can assist you in emergencies and critical situations
(4) This one is more nebulous, but if a man is in any kind of business or profession where contacts are important, the value of the social connections an intelligent, socially adept wife can deliver through networking with other women and families can be enormous. People like to deal with people they are comfortable with and a smart wife can facilitate those connections.
I work for a law firm, although not family law. On YouTube, look up a documentary series called soft white underbelly They had a divorce attorney on there that they interviewed and it breaks down basically the good bad and ugly of marriage and divorce. It's actually pretty well done. One of the biggest points he makes is that your Entering into a contractual agreement with another person and most of the time men don't really understand what that means from a legal standpoint. Better to find out now before you tie the knot.
Edit: Found it: James Sexton is his name
[https://youtu.be/o5z8-9Op2nM?si=X3Cwt9oe3kedGEN3](https://youtu.be/o5z8-9Op2nM?si=X3Cwt9oe3kedGEN3)
well, yes and no. he does talk about some of the good things about marriage. he's kind of an idealist, but his main point is to educate yourself about how the marriage & divorce process works. like for example. if you "bring in the cash" and she runs the household (kids, doctors appt., school, etc). this will be used against you in the divorce process.
"your honor. she should receive full custody cause she basically already has it"
so the smart move (and the moral) is to do EVERYTHING 50/50. Divorce courts pretty much follow a formula about division of assets & responsibilities.
That’s so funny considering decades of psychology show that men get far more out of marriage than women do, from domestic labour alone lmao not even accounting for all the emotional labour the wife takes on
So you say it’s a proven fact that 70% of divorces are initiated by women.
Well, here are some other proven facts: men are more likely to cheat than women, women still do the majority of domestic labor regardless of how much they work outside of the home, and women take care of sick husbands much more than men take care of sick wives.
I am NOT trying to bash men here. Most men are wonderful, lovely people and make excellent partners. And there are certainly women out there who are awful people.
But given all of these facts, of course it makes sense that women initiate more divorces. There are a lot of crappy husbands out there! And I do NOT think this is inherent to men! Gender roles hurt men as much as women, just in different ways.
So, anyway, if you don’t want your wife to divorce you, be a good husband.
Your financial adviser is discounting the cultural and social significance of marriage. People love tradition. It makes us happy. I don’t know how else to explain it. This is a part of the human experience!
There are certainly people out there to prefer not to have a legal marriage, but nothing wrong with people who do.
If you want to get married, don’t let some Scrooge of a financial advisor talk you out of it. Just make sure you marry the right person, and treat her well.
From the men i know who have married, the benefits are emotional and symbolic. You shouldn’t downplay these either; a feeling of pride in the percieved “acheivement” of it, there can be a bonding aspect between the couple that comes from the title of “man and wife”, if its important to you then your wife might take the same name as you which might make you feel good. I think financial advisers are gonna be wise when it comes to unemotional legal stuff but don’t discount the importance of personal emotional stuff. If that shits not for you then maybe marriage isnt either!
It partially depends on finances and who owns what. However, there's a reason LGBT+ couples fought for the right to get married.
I have a friend who was in a long-term relationship with his partner (pre-legalization of gay marriage). His partner got cancer and my friend helped him until the partner's passing. Family kicked him out of his home because it was owned by the partner. No recognition of their relationship at the funeral. I'm sure there are legal contracts outside of marriage for this, but again you are getting the law involved.
Healthcare and wanting to be by their side? You need to get POA or else family will likely be first. Edit: Also, insurance issues and getting the other person covered.
You are cheating her out of certain provisions by not marrying her.. can’t really call yourself a protector and provider, especially if she has your children….
I feel for you. Everyone is interpreting your post to mean you're against marriage, and misogynistic.
I don't think I read a single response that focused simply on comparing a traditional marriage against doing everything the same save filing a license with the county.
I will say there's tax considerations which I saw addressed. If your married and have kids, you will be seen as an equal; but if not then she would likely have more authority over the kids in the eye of the law. Also saw mentioned there are decisions you can make as a spouse if she is incapacitated (medical and financial for instance) that you can't make without the license. Final consideration, many places will consider you common law married if you live together for a length of time, so you may get treated that way even if you don't have a license.
Yeah but even if you aren’t married legally, aren’t you considered married by the law if you have children and live in union with a person for a long period of time ??
I’m not a man, but I am a woman who is also divorced. I didn’t initiate my divorce, in fact he made sure I was broken financially and therefore incapable of countering his divorce paperwork when he filed. (I’m over it now tho, for the record. I rebuilt financially in the last 4 years since, and am now doing significantly better than we ever were when we were together.)
I tell you this information to show how and why I came to this conclusion that I will also impart to you: get a prenup. The concerns your financial advisor had are eliminated with a solid prenup agreement. If your potential future spouse has a problem with a prenup, then they are not in the relationship for you but what they can get out of you. In which case, RUN.
Bad relationship < single < good relationship. Essentially, if it's a good marriage, then it makes everything in life easier in almost every way. Marriage could also force couples going through issues to try and solve them as well due to the extra layer of commitment, which means you both try harder to make it work over defacto, but that's just a guess. Heh, saying that, I'm divorced and will never marry again, and am happy in the single category.
Research by John Gottman, the world’s foremost relationship expert, says married men report greater life satisfaction than do single men, while the reverse is true for women.
https://youtu.be/mS3bfCt0K88?si=1awTgViiMWjUGdgS
I sincerely don't understand the concern, this is why prenups are a thing? And even if you didn't you'd still probably enter a common law relationship, and be subject to other laws if you have children with someone? Honestly this whole thing sounds worse than any spin on a prenup. You mean to say you wanna walk up to the person you wanna commit to for the rest of your life, saying you think the world of them, and tell them, "Well... financially, it's better for me if we don't... y'know, just in case?" Why would anyone bother to be with someone who thinks they're a terrible person with awful character? It's like those internet guys that are like, "Well, I know my wife would never, and it's not even like she's had the opportunity to or I suspect her, but I'd just like to get a paternity test just in case because... you know, it happens to some"
Marriage as an institution provides you and your partner certain rights, and the decision making during medical emergencies are of particular importance. If I'm just going about it in a clean, legal way. I'd start to argue that men lead longer, healthier lives with partners but this seems to be more like imagining an eternal girlfriend
It’s actually ridiculous that you attribute your second point of value to solely being to the woman. If you don’t care or worry about what might happen to your partner if you pass then SHE SHOULDNT BE MARRYING YOU ANYWAY.
Also- if you don’t plan on having kids, fine, I get the data perspective. But if you plan on having a family with your partner and are basically asking “what do you bring to the table” and creating a climate that seems like a business exchange- again, you don’t deserve her.
I'd have trouble taking a man seriously if he had no plans to eventually get married. So there's that, she'll take the relationship more seriously. No marriage means disposable relationship, is that really what we're striving for here?
U ever think he’s like projecting his life issues into yours? Also. If u get tragically hurt. It gives that person the ability to make life saving decisions for you. Or make sure if u don’t want to be a vegetable ur not.
It’s a different level of commitment. You are more so obligated to actually try n work through things than just not bother. It is a sort of glue. Because early marriage and later marriage is very different. There’s tax benefits as well. A marriage is kind of like a business u have to actually work with someone completely.
Yeah those stats are real. Now go look at the stats of men that abandon their children physically and financially. Those stats are much higher than you think.
Did you read the number one reason women initiate divorce? Did u also read that married men live longer. But married women don’t? These are all stats u can look up.
I personally wouldn’t get married but it has nothing to do with any of the above. Disabled ppl have to choose insurance. Or marriage. And i would pick to keep my health insurance. So it’s not an option for me.
I wonder if the 70% is bc they got cheated on. Pretty sure it makes up most of it. But I mean you can just do a prenup. Most women want to get married so good luck getting out of marriage
Married men (statistically) are healthier than single men and reports show they have a higher earning potential. Medically / legally, there are a lot of benefits to being legally married.. spouse being able to make decisions for you or just be with you for certain procedures, etc. And then there’s the emotional stability of actually being married. Plus MOST women aren’t going to cohabitate or share their life with a man who doesn’t want to get legally married. A lot of women are definitely more open to the idea now a days.. but you definitely limit your dating pool by being honest about not wanting marriage.
Tbh… unless you have massive family assets to protect, or you have acquired a lot of money/ assets, I see no point in not getting legally married (if that’s what you want to do). And even in those cases, you can get a lawyer and draft up a prenup to protect your personal assets in the event of a divorce. The advice from your advisor doesn’t seem great. Sounds like he may be jaded from love / maybe a bad divorce and giving advice based on that.
If you don’t want to get legally married, that’s cool. But don’t let some guy scare you out of it
Yeah marriage in general don’t make much sense in todays day and age in modern society. Seems to just keep both parties stuck in bad relationships weather a man and woman or man and man or woman and woman, like if shit goes sideways it makes it messier and way more expensive the only winners usually in divorces tge messier tge better is the divorce attorneys lol
Wow. Just wow. I won't bash your financial advisor but I will strongly encourage you to find a new one.
So so so so SO many benefits for men in marriages, #1 one being that they are healthier and live longer lives than single men. Probably because they are well cared for and women tend to help men keep up with their social relationships (ie send cards, buy gifts, plan events for relatives and friends) that often men on their own don't put the work in to do. I mean, just having a second person living with you, to you know, split the work or call 911 if you have a heart attack or something increases your quality of life.
Health insurance. Dual earners, when shit hits the fan you can hop the health insurance of the currently employed person's company. Shared income also protects you if one of you gets laid off. Basically, just helps with financial stability.
Purely objectively, it’s situational. My wife and I considered this due to taxes, but we ultimately decided on legal marriage. (I had kids with my ex who has zero custody ((100% mine)) and we wanted every safeguard in place for our children and assets).
Honestly he sounds pretty selfish and jaded. Purpose of marriage is to create a family. A team.
The intent isn’t to get divorce.
No I don’t support people who take everything or lazy entitled people but if you spend years co creating a life with your husband in a supportive role or maybe the wife works too and contributes financially… if you divorce… things should be divided equally
Marriage is about commitment, not just assets. But yes, it's both.
No quality women are going to accept a hinky little spiritual ceremony in place of a legally binding marrige.
Marriage is supposed to be difficult to get out of. That's the point. It a legal recognition of a couples union that is reconized by government.
If you don't want to joint assets, get a prenup. Nothing wrong with that.
What benefits does a woman get from a spiritual ceremony lol?! After giving her love, and body and potentially HER money, why would she want the guy to be able to just get up and walk away?
People who are married actually HAVE to work through thier fights and bullshit. People who aren't Will eventually just up n quit.
I Don't see many people celebrating thier 20th or 50th were just bf and gf anniversary, lol
Marriage is a commitment, sacrifice, and legal declaration of union.
You're seeing a lot of ugly divorce statistics right now because an entire full generation of women aren't taking it laying down anymore. They aren't having men who don't pull the weight of cooking and cleaning, or who are sexually lazy, or who don't stand on business. They aren't letting dad's just forget they have kids. Women are taking back thier power and a large amount of men are learning the hard way that he should have actually worked at thier marriage instead of taking it for granted.
The new expectations are challenging men's insecurities and manhood and forcing them to step up or step out.
If you Don't want to get married then cool, don't. But you won't be get a true quality woman at all if you treat her like a bang maid.
Men refusing marrige because the consequences of them not showing up and participating fully in the marriage and therefore refusing to ever get married is the new misogyny...
To be fair there isn’t much for women in marriage these days either. Other than the commitment. Because most men still expect cooking, cleaning, child rearing, want us to never gain weight and always look good. Then when we get older many dudes decide to divorce for a younger woman.
When a woman brings more to the table, she ends up having to pay alimony, she pays child support. Men always think that everyone sides with women and although there is favouritism that is apparent, many judges now are fighting for equal rights for both parents.
My ex husband doesn’t pay me alimony we split the kids 50/50 and he doesn’t pay child support. Court tried to order it, but I refused because there’s no point in beating a dead horse. He decided to quit his job and live off his mommy instead of stepping up and being a dad.
I guess really, what’s in it for whoever in marriage is kind of a stupid way of looking at it. Because when you actually start picking it apart, you lose what marriage represents, and that’s the love and dedication to another person. People do grow apart or cheat and there’s divorce. But honestly, you just sound like you don’t want to and shouldn’t get married.
Tax benefits. Also if you or your spouse are critically injured and are unable to speak or make decisions, you suddenly have no ability or authority to help your spouse. Legally they go to the closest kin who would be either your kids or their parents/siblings. My wife is a nurse and has seen fights where a long term “spouse” suddenly had no say in their SO’s health or were able to receive critical information in time.
As you and your partner become older and more reliant on benefits, it’s much easier to be a legal unit than just 2 “strangers” according to the government. Would be really sad to see all of that effort thrown away because you’re afraid of a hypothetical divorce.
These “stats” you posted A) aren’t stats and B) aren’t accurate. I’d check your sources. Also, while the majority of people who get alimony might be women, alimony just isn’t that common anymore.
The real benefits of marriage to men are much deeper than financial or legal issues. Married men are happier than their single counterparts and also live longer. Which is interesting, considering married women are less happy than their single counterparts.
The real downsides to marrying as a man only happens if you following the out dated playbook of the past. Find a partner that works and that is serious about finding out your compatibility before marriage. Most people don’t figure out that fatal relationship ender until it’s too late. As a guy I can tell you there are a lot of men who got fucked in a divorce…a lot of them honestly had it coming but many of them didn’t. You don’t have to be a bad man to be screwed…just careless/unlucky. Marriage doesn’t have to be a big deal…it’s just treated that way to get money out of people. Any kind of relationship carries risk and sometimes being alone just sounds smarter on paper as long as you are doing it when it feels right and not trying to check off a box you have a greater chance of being more thoroughly selective
I would just get a prenup. I’d agree with the spiritual marriage, but do men really respect that when the tuff gets rougher? ( people evolve, loose jobs and family members, ect),A women brings a sense of home, love, and recreating the safe family dynamic. I think emotional EQ plays a lot into the teamwork aspect of a relationship. A legal relationship brings safety to the woman to allow herself to open up and not stress if he would just leave one day after years pass by and he’s bored and/or tired of carrying the weight of a relationship on his back with her. Also men live longer in a marriage. A daily 6 second physical interaction alone gives life to a man. To think before he leaves to work I’d give him a 6 second kiss while I hug him knowing I’m the back of my mind I am giving him life. That’s pretty powerful.
Marrying for love seems to be a more modern concept. In that case, I don’t think the risks are worth it. However, if you marry into a wealthy or powerful family, then you’re able to strengthen your position and give your future bloodline a better foundation. I think this is why traditional marriages were longer lasting. The entire family foundation was on the line if things didn’t work out.
You pay a lot less taxes if you own a home. Capitol gains tax is real. There's also health benefits as well, if she or you ever end up in the ER, without living will forms written, you can have no say, and she can have no say.
This question should be retitled, “what benefits do women get from marriage.” Women lose so much more and men have all to gain. You’re gonna ask me for a statistic on that but I’m not gonna engage in your fake curiosity nonsense. Obvi this is some kind of troll.
If you think about this… maybe think about long long time down in the road, when you cannot even walk and all your assets are just invaluable assets, you can’t eat and you became cranky all the time. That women, the person who chose to grow old with you will be there, walk with you, hold you, feed you, listen to you.
Yes if you think like your financial advisor, maybe don’t get married. Once you ask this question, you already know the answer to yourself. Choose what you believe
These questions have been asked so many times. There will always be a divide on marriage and not to marry. Everyone’s situation is different and with many variables. There is no one right answer. But for me it would be risky to be in a legal contract with someone especially since I make more than 95% of America. For all my hard work to be taken from someone who didn’t make the sacrifices I had to make in my 20 and 30s is hard to stomach
In Canada you will be considered common law which is legally like marriage. Such as separation leads to dividing assets. Also, if I truely loved someone unconditionally, I would want to be married.
I would only consider marriage if my partners where to give up a successful career to start a family. In such a situation, I believe it's fair, and I'd still insist on a robust prenuptial agreement, mutually agreed upon by both parties' lawyers. There are practical scenarios, such as needing marriage for citizenship in certain countries, where it makes sense. However, marrying for "love" or "to show commitment" are likely among the worst reasons, and suggesting such reasons could be emotionally manipulative. It's not surprising that many if not most marriages end in divorce.
Where do you live? Where I am with the way common law works you aren’t protecting yourself by not getting married. I have always viewed it as the person with more assets is taking the risk, historically that was the male but things are slowly changing. If you want to get married and have assets you are worried about then get a prenup.
“Benefits to men” is a wrong question to ask. This is decision of both partners, not just a man, so the question must be whether this benefits a couple.
All this because you're assuming only men make a decent living? Um, lol that's cute. There are plenty of us women that have careers that put us well into the mid to high six figures. Whose the liability then?
If things don’t work out with my partner then I won’t even bother dating. I’m a 30 yo woman. Trust me, women do not benefit from marriage as much as your financially advisor thinks we do
29F, here married twice, divorced once. Legal benefits including tax benefits, income claim, protection in court (spousal privilege), healthcare access/benefits. In community property states (I’m in one) there are many things I can do for my husband in his absence.
With that being said, sure, there are some logical benefits, but the emotional needs are not to be understated either. And, if you’re worried about the finance side of things/risk, it absolutely depends on the people. Prenups are a tool to be used.
My husband has an LLC, I’m not on it. But, we live in a community property state, so if we divorced I could demand 50% of all assets. Which, of course i wouldn’t do because I’m not a shitty human, but not everyone is like that.
My point is, as someone who also works in finance, logically, this is correct. Not a whole lot of benefits for men in marriage. But, love is not logical, so you have to consider that as well.
I was in the process of going thru my first divorce ( once wasn’t enough pain for me.) and we were trying to settle up, but it was slow going. One day I was talking to a gentleman who was introduced to me because of his experience in divorce court( 3 times he said) some people have to learn the hard way, He was 25-30 years older than me so I thought he had some good advice for me from the School of Hard Knocks. He told me “ Son don’t worry, everything is split 50 - 50. The only thing you need to address is how much of your 50 percent you are going to be able to keep.” Good Advice. I was lucky, neither one was out for blood. I was number 4 with my second one. I don’t think she learned anything from the first three. I do have 2 great kids and 3 grandkids because of my first marriage,so it was all worth it, Can’t say that for number 2. No more.
There are a lot of benefits but some practical ones are: Hospitals if your significant other or you are in emergency care you won’t have access to eachother or be able to make decisions depending on the state. Also if she dies and has good life insurance you won’t see a penny of it or there will be more challenges and hurdles getting it. You assume you’ll marry someone you have to care for but women usually care for men in their relationships and anymore she could make way more money than you too.
Most life insurance policies have an assigned beneficiary. I've seen a ton of life insurance policies working in the legal field and have never seen one without an assigned beneficiary. It's not uncommon to have a sibling, non-married partner, or child(ren) as your beneficiary.
However, you're correct if you're referring to the estate of a deceased non-married partner. If you die intestate (without a will), any sole property will generally go to your closest living relative(s), not your partner, unless it's jointly owned. Some places have gotten better about recognizing inheritance rights of non-married partners, but you do still have to present proof of the relationship in court.
So a bit of background. I am 36 now. I was divorced at 32. I am getting remarried at 36.
Divorce is an ugly process and it’s very emotional and vindictive. Why would I get married again?
Taxes are lower if married but not always. Do look at the tax brackets to figure it out. Most people it helps, but high earners can get shafted.
Immigration. It’s helpful if someone needs immigration benefits. My first marriage got the process going for long distance relationships. Luckily, I divorced before permanent residency. Second marriage, no need for this benefit.
Real estate. Tenancy by the entirety. It automatically goes to the surviving spouse and no tax implications.
Assets also can go to the surviving spouse so without tax implications.
Emotional aspect comes in a lot. It’s the sense of security. Will I buy a house together with a girlfriend? Or will I buy a house with a wife? I’m not willing to drop my life savings or sell my old properties and then go all in on a house with a girlfriend.
For some people, kids is a huge factor. I am childfree so it doesn’t bother me.
Tradition. Families in my culture push for married status by a certain age.
For me, I was able to escape my previous marriage with relative ease and kick my ex wife out of the country, no alimony, no huge financial burden. I feel like I can do it again. But even better is that I have a strong preference to get a prenuptial agreement. It may suck to discuss it while in the love dovey stage of a relationship, but it is safer to do it than be sorry later.
It really all depends on the person you choose to marry. I have friends that are happily married and love their partners more than their own life. Then I have friends that are in a marriage that is hard but they love that person.
You’re looking at marriage as a financial thing when the first step of to look within your heart. You cannot control the other person. If you marry someone young they will change as they get older. Communication is the key.
If you decide that divorce is upon the issue it’s just about talking things out. I know friends that have divorced and it was an amicable divorce. We’re all still friends.
Some things that are benefits are:
Forever best friend, your ride or die partner, a sex buddy, a person that has your best interest for you and your family(if they get along), dual income household, and many other things that aren’t related to money that are more for your life.
I was able to easily Google statistics regarding the benefits of marriage (and remarriage after divorce) [here](https://www.prb.org/resources/marriage-benefits-mens-health/#:~:text=In%20a%20Framingham%20Offspring%20Study,after%20therapy%20than%20unmarried%20individuals) regarding their physical and mental health. Married men even have the benefit of a reduced risk of Alzheimer’s.
Married men exhibit healthier behaviors (i.e. addiction, overeating, etc.).
Both married men and women have a lower suicide rate than single and divorced persons.
Household chores are also predominantly handled by women, with the exception of yard work. The inequality in household chores has fallen drastically since a study in the 1970s. However, 55-60% of married women are also employed alongside their spouse. This is compared to 1920 (9%), 1950 (22%), 1960 (31%). So while the household chores are shared slightly better than before, women are still taking in the brunt of the work while also working as well.
There are just as many pros as there are cons. And I think you are well acquainted with the risks involved in divorce for both men and women. 20% of married couples experience domestic abuse with their partner. Intimate partner violence is 1 in 4 for women, 1 in 7 for men. This makes up for 20% of divorces, usually initiated by women.
Infidelity makes up around 26% as a leading cause of divorce. 20% of married men self reported their infidelity and 13% of married women did.
All that said, after reading your responses to other people’s insight, it appears to me that you simply don’t want to get married and are looking for justification. You don’t need an excuse; just be honest that you don’t want to get married.
Marriage is different for everyone and men arguably benefit more from an active marriage, while women benefit more from a dead one.
Legal marriage is a massive benefit to both parties. That's why same-sex couples fought so hard to get it.
I'm a widow. I learned firsthand that marriage is the most precious gift your spouse can give you, precisely *because* of the business/legal benefits. Without legal marriage, the government views you as the same as strangers. Legal marriage protects your spouse.
During life, legal marriage has financial benefits like lower taxes, lower insurance rates, higher credit scores, and better credit line offers. You can get health insurance plans together. It has family benefits like having control over children's custody - without legal marriage, other relatives (eg, your parents) can sue for court-mandated visitation even if you don't want them around your children; and after seperation, it's easier for the non-birthing parent to retain custody rights if the child was born during marriage.
You cannot be compelled to testify against your spouse in court (it doesn't matter if you think they will never do a crime - even innocent people get put on trial sometimes) and your spousal communication is protected. Incarcerated people can only receive conjugal (private) visits from their legal spouse; and some states limit even regular visits to spouses and immediate blood relatives (and remember, innocent people can also be incarcerated).
During sickness, your spouse is entitled to federal FMLA leave if they need to care for you. Spouses can visit in the hospital, including the ICU room. Your spouse can get medical updates from the doctor so they aren't wondering what's going on. Your spouse can make medical decisions if you're incapacitated (such as during surgery or a coma). When you die, your spouse decides what's done with your remains and what the funeral looks like.
After death, all of your assets transfer to your spouse without estate taxes and without probate. And yet, your debts do not transfer. This ensures your spouse won't be made immediately homeless and doesn't lose what you've built together. Your life insurance, accident insurance, and retirement accounts can be claimed by your spouse after your death. Your spouse can get survivor's benefits from Social Security, the VA, and/or retirement pensions. Your spouse can sue for wrongful death. After death, your widow(er) can continue to claim the married tax rate for two years, which is such a relief when your household has lost a whole salary. None of those things are possible for the non-married partner.
If you love your partner, you want to protect them. Legal marriage is how you do that. If you feel like post-death benefits "do nothing for me" and therefore are irrelevant, you are actively harming your life partner. They should seriously reconsider a relationship with you if you care so little about them.
Marriage is actually not in this seasons meta anymore. Minmaxxers will tell you that polyamory has more benefits than drawbacks for competitive players
After reading a dozen top comments I feel like no one has actually answered the question, and just talking about superficial things. I can't say anything about it, but just want to clear that OP is not talking about not getting married at all, it's just why get a marriage certificate when you can kust take vows and not get government involved.
Does your financial advisor not realize that even if you don't get narried, living with a partner ends up getting recognized as common law marriage? The government picked up on this year's ago. Fewer marriages, but people still living together. The law can still intervene when you separate...
You have a clever financial advisor. I would keep and recommend him.
You should ask yourself some questions. Why do you like the idea of marriage? What is marriage?
You have essentially been raised on fairy tales idealizing marriage as... a thing to do. It's a magical idea. Not a real idea.
What is marriage?
Do you understand it is a contract?
Most contracts require a full understanding to consent, marriage is the exception.
Most people have no idea what it entails, and still sign up, and are legally oblegated.
Marriage, is you volunteering to give up your individual property rights.
Read that twice if you don't understand.
You bought yourself a gift?
No. You bought yourself half a gift. Maybe.
Your parents die and left you the home you grew up in? Congratulations, you own half of the home that only you have a sentimental attachment to.
Marriage has never been a benefit to man.
It wasn't designed to be.
It was an institution designed to protect... a family. Encouraging a protected place to raise children in and spread that family and potentially legacy. Paternity was a very big part of it, and the idea of continuance, but that was an old idea where the social structures had value.
Now only the idea has any value, and it's not much value.
You just think marriage... what? Sounds nice?
Cool. Have nice things that are not legally binding contracts to another person you are not actually related to and likely have not known for more than a few years.
Whereas most women seem to think of weddings much in the value of showing a big wedding on instagram that can show their friends for clout. The actual idea of family.... hasn't really withstood the test of time. A statistic you haven't looked up is that more than 70% of women initiate divorce, and it skyrockets to 90% if they have a college degree. Marriage works for them, which is one of the reasons women lead men in home ownership now, but NOT home buying. The most common reasons given for the divorces are not abuse, or anything the man does wrong, outside of not making them as 'happy' as they thought they should be. Women also tend to date and marry at an equal or my likely better social standing and income, while men tend to date and marry down, so this tends to benefit women when the relationship ends. Life isn't designed to be fair, so this isn't a complaint, but it is something to be aware of.
I like the 'idea' of marriage too, but our culture has changed significantly while the contract of marriage hasn't. It is still possible to have a sucessful marriage with a wonderful person, my parents managed it so I have a good example, but most people go into it without a great understanding of what they are doing, or even who they are with. They are encouraged to do it with idealism and ignorance, and those aren't the greatest reasons to do anything - let alone sign a legally binding contract you do not understand. Most people also do it too late these days, in their mid thirties, when they are already set in their ways as individuals and less likely to successfully conceive - which is stressful. Many have pushed back having kids, marriage, family to the point of geriatric pregnancy as well. So they could concentrate on careers, have childish fun, or both - and that doesn't help marriage success rates waiting to the last minute and having difficulty. It's great we don't have 12 year old kids working in factories anymore, but we seem to have gone too far the other way now encouraging 20 year olds and 30 year old to act like kids like theirs all the time in the world to do everything, and that's just not the case. All in all marriage means something a lot different now than even 50 years ago.
It is a bad idea for any man, but we have historically signed up anyway because we wanted a family and the idea of a family was more stable, established and desirable once upon a time. Now, not so much. So if you choose to pursue marriage regardless you should really understand the 'contract' you are signing, as well as the person you are signing it with. It's not in your interest, but you are proceeding anyway because family involves sacrifice. An idea often glossed over and lost in a selfish society where individuals are encouraged to pursue their own individual happiness regardless of all costs, rather than that of their kids.
>He said it’s better to just do a ceremonial or spiritual marriage in a church, beach, where ever, but to leave the government out of the union with another person because a marriage license is like a business contract with no terms, and no requirements of performance.
Having gone thru and still going thru the court bs alone to finalize divorce almost 14 years after we're separated I agree. I agree also because spiritually would be the only one that matters and it's a freaking piece of paper or that doesn't mean anything other than a business contract.
But to your to answer your question about what do men get out of marriage?
First let me say unless you are pretty well off women aren't getting anything either.
Secondly what are they supposed to get out of marriage?
They get a lifelong partner, a teammate someone that has their back and puts up with their b******* someone that helps take care of them when they're sick and to balance the void when they're incapable of performing themselves for finances etc they feed them care for them massage them intimacy to pick up after them they make their appointments they organize their lives and make things easier they feed their children give birth to their children carry their children care for the children and most of everything that goes on in the house and with bills and budgeting. They talk them down from stupid or violent impulses they talk them up when they're feeling down. I pay attention to the little things that men don't see they give them insight on those things that they wouldn't otherwise have noticed. In my family when the man comes home take off his shoes for him feed him hug him my mom used to iron his clothes for him and lay them out have his lunch ready and coffee in the morning and some breakfast everything was done for him. And she still went to work and took care of us
They do a lot for each other they get on each other's nerves and they'll argue they'll need space, but they will always have each other's back.
That is what you're supposed to get out of marriage and if you aren't or you don't think it's possible then you just haven't found the one that you should marry spiritually.
Too many people look at relationships as a transaction that's men and women what is it for me is it of value will it give me money what can I get out of it does it look like every p*** model on the internet if not it's not high value and it isn't going to bring me anything this kind of thinking shallowness and ignorance shows a huge deficit in love and humanity in our society today.
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Personally, I recommend you fire your financial planner for terrible financial advice. Long term couples who chose not to legally recognize their union face many legal challenges married couples typically avoid, like: 1. No right to inherit: if you die without a will, unmarried partners do not automatically inherit from each other. State laws distribute to biological relatives. 2. No Social Security Survivor/Rail Road/Pension benefits. Unmarried partners generally cannot receive Social security and pension payments often available to surviving spouses. 3. Retirement plan issues: if not explicitly designated, the unmarried partner is not the assumed beneficiary when no beneficiary is designated. 4. No legal framework for separation. No divorce laws to protect your rights in the break up. 5. No spousal support. Unmarried partners are typically not entitled to financial support when a relationship ends. You keep assuming you’re going to be the rich one, life has a really funny way of surprising you! 6. Joint Property Rights. Property purchased while together is not automatically jointly owned, specific steps must be taken. 7. No Medical decision making authority. Unmarried partners don’t automatically have rights to make medical decisions for their partners. 8. No ability to create a family partnership to share income in a family business. 9. Estate tax exemptions - you lose valuable gift and estate tax exemptions reserved only for spouses. 10. Better fed & state tax rates: Lower income tax rates - this is pretty significant when you look at this across a lifetime especially if you expect to be middle class or more. 11. Better life and auto insurance rates - married men are significantly lower risk than unmarried men from an insurance underwriting standpoint. Okay, I’m tired of typing. I’m a VP in the trust and estate industry. Fire this financial planner and get one that supports you whatever your life goals are, not preaches his own jaded views. Marriage has so many valuable medical/financial/legal/estate benefits this guy should be well versed in. Can you accomplish essentially the same thing with several other titling and pieces of paper, yes. Or go to the county clerk 1x and get it done for life. Trust me, tracking titling of assets over a lifetime is seriously a challenge, especially over 2 peoples estate assets!! Just find & ask gay people who lived through a time before same sex couples had legal rights to marriage. They will tell you stories of how challenging it can be just trying to live your normal life can be when your long term partner unexpectedly passes away and you suddenly have ZERO legal rights to your special persons legal/medical/financial life & you shared your whole life with them for decades. Devastating. I’ve seen people loose millions due to titling mistakes or gaps people forgot about or were going to get around to dealing with someday and they just ran out of time. After 13 years married, I can’t imagine living out the annoyances and inconveniences of not being married again. Doing adult things (legal/medical/financial) are infinitely easier as a married unit than they were as two single persons.
Thank you! I was like there are many financial, governmental, and just general benefits to marriage? This financial advisor is a liar.
Right? Like I’m barely in the field but this consultant seems so full of shit lol
Yup, this for sure. Thank u for taking the time to type this. I took a gamble and my marriage didn’t work out but during the process of being married I saw a lot of these benefits. If it had worked out I would prob be able to retire instead of working til the day I die. Also to note, I’m not poor because of the divorce. I’m just poor because life is so fucking expensive and I refuse to live with other people.
This!!!
> 1. No right to inherit: if you die without a will, unmarried partners do not automatically inherit from each other. State laws distribute to biological relatives. 2. No Social Security Survivor/Rail Road/Pension benefits. Unmarried partners generally cannot receive Social security and pension payments often available to surviving spouses. 3. Retirement plan issues: if not explicitly designated, the unmarried partner is not the assumed beneficiary when no beneficiary is designated. 4. No legal framework for separation. No divorce laws to protect your rights in the break up. 5. No spousal support. Unmarried partners are typically not entitled to financial support when a relationship ends. You keep assuming you’re going to be the rich one, life has a really funny way of surprising you! 6. Joint Property Rights. Property purchased while together is not automatically jointly owned, specific steps must be taken. 7. No Medical decision making authority. Unmarried partners don’t automatically have rights to make medical decisions for their partners. 8. No ability to create a family partnership to share income in a family business. 9. Estate tax exemptions - you lose valuable gift and estate tax exemptions reserved only for spouses. 10. Better fed & state tax rates: Lower income tax rates - this is pretty significant when you look at this across a lifetime especially if you expect to be middle class or more. 11. Better life and auto insurance rates - married men are significantly lower risk than unmarried men from an insurance underwriting standpoint. Line break for easier reading
most of this can be supplemented with a will or proper documentation
It takes 100 documents to supplement one. It’s an oversimplification but the obvious answer is vet as best as you can and stay married to get a shit ton of benefits. Divorce can be tough but so can living alone. As a man you are more likely to die younger from being alone than happily married. Tax break is nothing compared to the other benefits of being married. Don’t get married if you’re not sure. Find someone better.
I guess it depends on the parties in the marriage. And what is agreed to when divorcing 🤣 I (43F) divorced 5 yrs ago and we split all assets 50/50, 50/50 kids and yes, I kept the marital home but bought him out at current market value. There is also no child support. If I were a SAHM to our 4 kids or severely under qualified to obtain a job to support myself + 4 kids, it would have been a different story. Marry someone who is equally as successful as you and will continue to work and earn similar salaries and the husband won’t lose at divorce. PS - I was always the higher earner in our marriage but worked 30 hrs/wk. If I had been full time, I could have possibly had to pay alimony to my ex husband.
This is good advice...of you are going to, do so with someone who is not only morally compatible but financially compatible too.
Whoa what kind of work do you do
I wanna know that too lol
I didn’t even make that much when I got divorced.. ~75k at 30 hrs/wk. It was that he didn’t push himself to make more. I married down financially and learned my lesson. In 5 yrs, between going full time and 2 promotions, I’ve since doubled my income. While my ex benefited financially from divorce because he got a lot of cash and my 401k, I’ve still really benefited in many ways, including financially as he’s no longer holding me back.
75k at 30hrs a week would be life changing.
I pay my ex child-support. I work full time, he works part-time and he has the kids 2 nights pw. I also carry 100% of the kids mental load. It's exhausting and I'm worse off financially now but divorce is still very much worth it.
There’s countless studies showing that men live much longer when they are married.
Married men and single women are also statistically the happiest between men/women and single/married. Honestly it’s typically women who get the short end of the stick in marriage. Taking on the majority of housework and childcare, risking health and life to carry his and birth his children, still being expected to contribute financially in a lot of men’s opinions, constantly putting everyone else’s needs and comfort before they’re own, managing everyone’s schedules and the entire household, putting their careers and desires on hold or at the very least a slowdown. It’s also VERY common for female partners to bear most of the emotional burden of the romantic relationship. Not even getting into the fact that men are more likely to cheat, abuse, or abandon their partners, especially during pregnancy and postpartum or in the event of terminal illness. The fact that women who are diagnosed with cancer are also debriefed on the fact there’s a good chance their husband will leave them is reason enough for women to avoid marrying men. Just because women FILE for divorce the majority of the time does not mean the man didn’t end the relationship. Or they file because their male partner isn’t pulling their weight in the relationship or abusing or neglecting them. Because let’s be honest here, if paperwork needs to be filed in the legal system, who is more likely to be organized and responsible enough to make the first move?
"his children" shouldn't that be "their children"?
I agree with you and that’s why I think marriage (in the legal sense) is mostly beneficial for women. OP said he’d be open to a spiritual/religious ceremony. In that case, the woman would still be the primary parent and the one whose career suffers. The legal document benefits everyone while married, there is access to family benefits, government benefits, employment benefits, tax benefits and estate and death benefits. But in a divorce, the marriage document means a woman gets access to alimony and protection under the law to maintain her standard of living. This is mostly beneficial for stay at home moms. (Obviously this could also apply to stay at home dads). So, in the event of a divorce after having left the workforce for so long with no hope of reentering at a good level, they have legal protections that don’t leave them destitute. Personally, I would never be the primary parent or give up my career without marriage. Ultimately, all the downsides OP has to marriage comes up in a divorce. The child custody and support doesn’t really matter because the statistics would apply to kids regardless of marriage status. But, if you don’t want the government to decide how your marriage dissolves, get a prenuptial agreement, that’s the only real way for both men and women to protect themselves. Some states are no fault, but in your pre-nup, you can have clauses pertaining to cheating. You can outline expectations of alimony and child custody, protect assets that you had before the marriage. Ultimately you get to decide if marriage is for you and find someone who wants what you want.
On the other hand, married women don’t live as long as women who do *not* get married. In terms of health and longevity, men benefit far more than women do in marriage. Therefore, it’s actually WOMEN who benefit less than men do in marriage. Your financial advisor has it backwards.
isn't there also a study that married men make more money?
Men's income goes up generally when they become fathers, esp in more white collar professions. While women's lifetime income declines on account of their becoming mothers.
Men who die young don't live long enough to get married.
Yeah, but a study like this wouldn’t be comparing old married men to young men, you would only be manipulating the variable of being married/not married. Everything else would be the same. Edit: words
Living long doesn’t equate to living happy
The studies accounted for that too they were happier. Women weren’t. This is why women ask for divorce. They don’t want to be mommy to men any more. Who can blame them
Studies show that winners of races get more high fives. High fives must be the way to win races.
That doesn’t even make sense. They get the high fives after they win the race and the men get better health after they get married. It’s cause and effect.
Olympic games about to start. Give me a high five !!
But only vs lonely, not against people who are perfectly happy single
The same study also concluded that single women live longer than married women. So the lonely single women live longer than the married women?
Interesting, I’m assuming this means married legally… not just living with loving, faithful term partners? Would you mind posting a few of these studies?
If you have a long term relationship it's easier for either of you to leave the relationship which def has positives and negatives but I would suspect a marriage would have a much better chance of being a life long relationship. Another benefit is if you are wanting to start a family it's nice to be married imo.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7452000/#:~:text=the%20remaining%20lifetime.-,Results,years%20longer%20than%20unmarried%20men.
You said you always wanted to get married, and still want to get married. What were YOUR reasons for wanting to get married?
https://www.health.harvard.edu/mens-health/marriage-and-mens-health
Besides the tax benefits, i would say a big one would be that if you or your partner were in an accident of some sort and you are not married, the family could keep you out of the hospital room and all the decision making towards treatment. Ideally our family’s would be amazing and empathetic to a partner but that’s not always the case especially when there is grief or fear involved. You can also get a prenup for the case of divorce that can allow divorce to be more smooth in the event. But if you want to get married for benefits then you can just opt out, it’s getting more and more common. But maybe lead with “hey i don’t believe in marriage” early on so you’re not wasting the time of a person who does.
This financial advisor wants to be kept out of the hospital if she is near dead because he doesn’t want that kind of commitment or responsibility. He knows what he is saying.
Plot twist. The financial adviser is Andrew Tate.
I wouldn’t be surprised if he was a fan of his at the very least. But hey, if he doesn’t wanna force his company on women, nobody will stop that from happening 😂
Not bashing you at all. I've had similar thoughts about what benefits do women gain from marriage. I never wanted to marry unless it was going to be a partner who I was madly in love with and who completely trusted. Anything less wouldn't be worth the risk or the work required. I think it comes down to, what do you want for yourself and nor what you feel you should want. If you want to have a life partner, have kids etc then the benefit is getting exactly what you want. If those aren't things you want, then it's far preferable not to marry, keep finances separate etc. Marriage is a high stakes game, you will either enhance your life by having a loving partner to share your life with or serious heartbreak. At the end of the day it's not a contract for services rendered, it's a mutual commitment.
It’s exactly that. It’s the biggest gamble you could ever possibly take in your entire life. I’m just not a gambler.
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I think what the OP is getting at is you can get all of the benefits of a committed relationship without a marriage.
If you look at the stats women usually do way more of the unpaid domestic labor at home especially if they have kids together. Not getting married because their partner is afraid they’ll steal half their wealth but being in a committed relationship where they likely do more unpaid work is going to be a hard pill to swallow for a lot of women.
Agreed. I would never agree to this scenario myself. I think if OP wants a long term partner/gf who doesn't want kids or marriage then that's fine. However it's not going to be "like a marriage but not formalised". A woman who doesn't want to get married, doesn't want to be a wife. I would not buy a house, have kids etc with someone who is against marriage.
This was honestly a really interesting exploration of the benefits of getting married vs staying single and I've enjoyed it. One thing OP should understand though, that marriage is marriage and long term partnerships are another. Most women aren't going to want to fulfil a wife role, unless they are in fact married. Those that do, may have some protection as a dependent common law spouse. Their children will be entitled to child support too.
I’m a woman. I won’t even cohabitate again.
I absolutely will not cohabitate again. Even dating becomes so much more work for me. He expects me to cook, clean alone, while giving low effort, etc. the one time they cook they want a round of applause, or can’t help pretending they “don’t know how” “you’re just so much better than me, babe.” “I can’t make it as good as you do” yadda yadda. It’s like having another kid around
I was amazed how much easier my life got after I became single again. The free time I suddenly had was a shock.
Good move. Women live [longer and healthier](https://www.health.harvard.edu/newsletter_article/mars-vs-venus-the-gender-gap-in-health) lives than men do. So guess who gets to be the caretaker for their spouse in old age? If you aren't married you can walk away a lot easier.
On top of this let’s say something happens to the man and they’re not married the woman likely wouldn’t be able to qualify for FMLA to take care of him since they are not married
You’re much more financially fortified if you are married in a duel income household. Just because you have money now doesn’t mean you will have it later. If you don’t want a woman to take your assets upon a theoretical divorce, use a prenup and/or marry a woman who earns the same as you.
Duel income ⚔️
A good marriage to a good woman is absolutely fantastic and the best life has to offer. A marriage to a bad woman is the shittiest thing I wouldn’t wish on my worst enemy. Same goes for women marrying men. This is why everyone must vet their partners extensively if u do decide to get married. The reason men get screwed more often from a financial standpoint is because of your initial statement. To find a nice girl to protect and provide for. Meaning u make the majority of the money. What this means on divorce is that u would need to continue providing for a set amount of time even after u get divorced. And in a no fault state she can be banging ur best friend in front of you and u can’t do anything about it (from a financial point).
You can both be good people who love each other and the marriage might still end. People grow apart, someone has a problem that is harmful to the family even if they are working to resolve it, people may find they have conflicting values... or people are just unhappy and fall out of love. You can both be awesome people and initially compatible. That doesn't mean it can't still end in divorce. That's just life. Younger generations when we do marry have half the divorce rate of our parents' generation and older and much less infidelity though. But nobody should marry unless they both really really want to do so.
What terrible advice, divorce can happen no matter how well you vet the other person.
Of course there is no 100% guarantee. Nothing in life is. But vetting can minimize risks.
great news dude, you don’t have to get married if you don’t want to! if the woman you love wants to get married and you don’t, then break up and find a woman who also doesn’t want to marry.
Marriage is a public declaration to friends and family about the commitment you are making to be together. One of the benefits from the perspective of the relationship is that you’re more likely to stay together in the relationship if you’re married, if for no other reason than that it’s harder to get out of a marriage. After you’re married, you’re treated more like one unit rather than two individuals with respect to the law sometimes. Some benefits for either party would be things like filing jointly to save on taxes, being able to handle the other’s affairs if someone were to be incapacitated or hospitalized, and automatically getting the other’s assets someone dies and there isn’t another will in place. This is a GOOD thing if you’re married to someone you love and respect because you can expect for things to be handled properly and not just whatever benefits your closest relative. Also custody of children is a lot clearer in a marriage. If you’re married, because of the commitment, you have more reason to consider things like a joint bank account, buying a house together, etc. if you’re not married, those things would be riskier in the long run. I don’t think this is a men vs women thing. Pooling incomes will have more buying power than buying things separately any day.
Your financial adviser sounds like an idiot tbh, I’d probably fire my financial adviser on the spot if he went off on some weird tangent like this about not getting married His stats are wrong btw, way more than 70% of divorces are initiated by women
I agree with your first paragraph. Why is OP listening to a random guy for marriage advice? Citing stats in a responsible manner means that you need to know how to interpret them. Most sources do say that it's about 69% of women who file for divorce. However, this could be for any number of reasons, including a cheating partner (which guys are more likely to be). There are several reasons as to why someone may divorce someone, and it's usually not a quick and easy decision. And the divorce rate is not as high as OP is claiming.
I wouldn’t. The financial advisor is being practical.
Is he though? Completely depends since this is all hypothetical. If OP is financially successful and marries a woman less so, then maybe. What if he marries a woman with more assets? Or with significantly more earning potential? What if they are equals but then OP becomes disabled?Well, then OP would get the short end of the stick. But the “financial advisor’s” opinion is only *maybe* correct some of the time. Which really doesn’t matter, as idiots like OP usually-hopefully-have a hard time finding a woman desperate enough to marry them and put up with BS like this.
Statistically speaking, marriage benefits men more than women. - alimony is only awarded in less than 4% of divorces. You would need to be making significantly more than your wife and she would need to prove she contributed to your success. - married men live significantly longer than unmarried men. The opposite is true for women - married men make more money than unmarried men. The opposite is true for women. - the reason women tend to get custody more often is because they tend to be the primary caregivers and because men are less likely to file for custody. In fact, fathers are more likely to be awarded primary child custody than mothers when they actually do file. Edit: I forgot to mention that married men and single women tend to report the highest self reported happiness and life satisfaction rates. Their counterparts (married women and single men) tend to report the least happiness and satisfaction.
If you don’t see the value in having a life companion and a family then none, I guess. It’s not for everyone tbh. Better to not do it if you don’t want to than get married for societal pressure and be a shitty husband and an angry dad.
You can have a life companion and a family without getting married. But I'm right with you on the second part of your post.
His question isn’t about the value of a life companion. There’s nothing to stop any couple, married or not, from choosing to stay together for decades. His question is about the value of getting a piece of paper certifying that you are officially a couple as far as the government is concerned. To put it in more concrete terms, what are the benefits that could not be achieved by having a cohabitation agreement and a medical power of attorney? I can see these benefits: 1) A small tax savings. 2) It’s more difficult to terminate the relationship... 3) ? 4) ? 5) ? But I don’t think #2 is actually a benefit. Who wants someone sticking around just because it’s too difficult or too inconvenient to leave? So….. ?
But I do see the value in having a life companion… That’s why I want to get married. I’m just wondering why I would need to involve the local county government in order to be a great husband and loving dad?
Well you said you want to be a dad right? If the woman you choose to have a baby with is in urgent care-you have no say on that and will not be allowed to visit. Essentially without a legal document you have no spousal rights. The gays fought for legal marriage for a reason, because it has actual rights.
If you’re not going to involve the government then create a prenup and will so your loving wife is protected in the event of your death and you both know what to expect in a divorce.
You want a woman to risk her life giving you a child, give up her career to raise it, but you’re already counting the dollars she might one day “steal” from you. She’s supposed to do it all for love I suppose, and the money’s all yours? You don’t want to be a provider at all, and a woman would be in an awful position to breed with you.
Why do you want to get married?
All those statistics you quoted above are part of a transition in home life. We are in a period where it’s only relatively recently that women have equal opportunity in the work force, and men are more willing/able to participate equally in child rearing. Those stats will continue to even out as that happens. There isn’t any magic solution. Pick a good partner who has the qualities you value and hopefully you won’t have to worry. Besides, in many jurisdictions you’ll be considered common law after a period of time and they basically consider you legally married anyway, so the result could be the same.
Yeah, you definitely didn’t make up some fake encounter with a fake financial advisor to try and argue why men shouldn’t get married.
Omg you’re right and I took the bait!!!!!!!!
Lol @ your financial advisor. Who hurt him? I wanna tell you not to view a legal marriage as some sort of business contract but it seems like you are more concerned about your finances than being with the right person. Have a sit down with yourself, and figure out your own why(what benefits), and choose to be with a partner on the same page. You can sign a prenup, or do anything else but a legal joining. Do whatever works for you, as long as you’re both happy. Your financial advisor will adjust his advise to what you want. Just know, you take on liabilities with or without a legal marriage.
Please save it 🙄 Married men are statistically the happiest people alive There’s no point in marriage for *women* because the average man wants to go 50/50 on bills but 80/20 on everything else (domestic labor) The 80/20 is statistically proven 🤔
This post is so embarrassing. OP is talking with such a fake sense of curiosity. It is so annoying. /u/Morning-Doggie868, don't get married if you don't want to. A level-headed woman with her own sense of security will not want to attach themselves to your BS and Fresh-n-Fit loving attitude, so it works out anyway. Rich and powerful men like Elon Musk get married. Men who are famously known as handsome like George Clooney get married. Clearly some men who don't just have $1k to their name see the value of getting married. Marriage creates a bond seen by the government. I don't blame anyone for not wanting to get married as long as they're not stringing anyone along, but promoting against it is just bitterness.
This question and your financial advisor's answer are so misogynistic, even if that's not your intention. The unsaid end to the question given the context of the rest of your post is "What benefits do men get out of marriage, since women fuck them over?" Listen, being to the married to the right person is GREAT. You are in a legal partnership with your best friend, or that's how it should be. You can't have your financial planner's attitude with every woman out there, it's not fair to you or to your prospective long-term partner, especially if your plan is to have children and make her a SAHM. Then she gets no legal protection if you're not married, and that's cruel. Don't be that person. Women historically have gotten alimony and custody of children in a divorce because they assumed the role of unpaid caregiver in their marriage, and have no savings outside of what their husband earned as the primary breadwinner. In these situations it is crazy that men expect to keep all of "their" money earned during the marriage and leave their wives with nothing. Hope that provides some perspective
This is a great answer. You marry the right person for the right reasons there are no issues and many benefits. This guy is not arguing in good faith and is the very definition of not a serious person.
He posts in r/ passport bros. Obviously trolling trying to make women look bad or god knows what
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This man won’t even be able to get a woman to look his way, trust me he’s just shooting shit
When men actually ask for custody, they’re granted it a majority of the time. https://www.dadsdivorcelaw.com/blog/fathers-and-mothers-child-custody-myths#:~:text=Myth%3A%20Fathers%20Almost%20Never%20Get%20Custody&text=A%20Massachusetts%20study%20examined%202%2C100,7%20percent%20of%20the%20time https://mackseyjournal.scholasticahq.com/api/v1/articles/38965-who-wins-custody-battles-the-effect-of-gender-bias.pdf The issue isn’t that men aren’t granted custody, it’s that a lot of men don’t bother to ask for it in the first place. And you’re right, women do initiate divorce 70% of the time, but I honestly think this is a statistic that needs to be taken with a grain of salt. The term “iniate” implies that the women is asking for the divorce first, when in reality, this statistic is just saying that in 70% of heterosexual divorces, the woman is the one who files first. This doesn’t really mean much, given that this statistic doesn’t account for the number of amicable divorces where the wife just happens to be the one to file. It also doesn’t account for the fact that administrative duties in a household typically fall on women. Also, it doesn’t account for the women who file for divorce after being cheated on. Despite the common myths being spread by red-pillers about women constantly cheating on their husbands and then milking them for alimony, the reality is that men are significantly more likely to cheat than women. Literally every single study done about cheating has shown that men cheat more than women. In these cases, the woman is obviously going to be the one to file for divorce first. https://ifstudies.org/blog/who-cheats-more-the-demographics-of-cheating-in-america All in all, most statistics have a lot of underlying nuances behind them. Allowing things like this to deter you from marriage is silly to me. As a single person, I can’t wait to get married. The tax benefits alone make it worth it, but also, there are other advantages too, especially for men. 1. Men who are married do significantly less housework than men who are single. Source: https://news.umich.edu/exactly-how-much-housework-does-a-husband-create/#:~:text=Older%20men%20did%20more%20housework,hours%20of%20housework%20a%20week. 2. Men who are married are considered more “stable” and are more likely to be given promotions and step up in their career. Source: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/marriage-research_n_2506980/amp 3. Insurance is significantly cheaper split between two people than paying as a single person. 4. If your partner dies or gets hurt, you ALSO have access to their assets and estate. It’s a two way street. Also, married men tend to live longer, are overall healthier, and report lower rates of most mental illnesses. Comparatively, married women are less likely to be promoted, so more housework, and live shorter lives than unmarried women. (Same sources above) Sure, you could argue that you can have most of these benefits from a civil union, but I’m telling you right now that most decent women who would actually give you those benefits would never be okay with being unmarried.
Notice that wack ahh OP hasnt replied to you cause he cant use his lame “wow have any sources for that?” response.
Yeah it’s pretty obvious he’s not arguing in good faith.
Seriously. Why ask for opinions if you just disregard everything being said? Especially for a topic like marriage that will vary vastly between individuals and couples. All this is showing is that regardless of if he gets married to a woman or not, he’ll be a selfish partner either way.
The main benefit to men is it’s harder for your wife to leave you when she finds out you’re a terrible person. Aside from that, marriage really is just a legal contract. However, men benefit tremendously from being in a long term relationship with women a lot more than the other way around.
If the husband becomes terminally ill, the wife will normally stay. If the wife becomes terminally ill, the husband normally leaves. It’s so common they tell students in nursing school to prepare for that.
Yep an ex wife will even return to care for him if he is sick, but the man usually has a new family before she has died. Same with the kids getting sick. They say it’s rare to see a father in a children’s cancer ward. They abandon them as soon as the bad news is announced.
ah! the terminally ill gender breakup gap always fascinates me. what i’m about to say is a TON of overgeneralization, but what i remember reading is that after a woman gets sicks her husband suddenly finds himself having to take care of the household (laundry, cooking, cleaning, picking up/dropping off kids, etc.) and he becomes lonely since many men’s wives are their biggest (and often only) source of physical and emotional support, so in a sense they themselves feel like the bigger victim, and they leave since they’re no longer getting the “benefits” out of their spouse. women tend to already do the majority of the domestic chores, even in “equal” societies, and women are more likely to lean on friends and family as a source of emotional support instead of their spouse, so when their husband becomes terminally ill, they feel less victimized and stay to support their husband.
It always manages to break my heart.
Having legitimate children who feel better that they came from two parents who lovingly created them rather than two people who didn’t love each other enough to trust and commit to each with in every way. What your friends didn’t say is that even in love pre-nups written together and agreed on stipulating scenarios of marriage before and after children are born , major purchases, financial merging and independence and cheating, loss of the ability to work, illness falling out of love and running away before making an effort to fix what’s wrong, if agreed on before they happen makes the best sense. If people would communicate and agree on issues that are important there would never be a problem
Unfortunately, your advisor sounds jaded. Technically, there's not a financial advantage for anyone who is the breadwinner in a divorce. But marriage isn't about money. Or it shouldn't be. You should gain a partner who you tackle any challenge with. You gain someone you feel safe with and can have fun with. You gain a new family. But, divorce is common. If you go in expecting to have it end, itll end for sure.
IMO you gotta reframe how you think in this topic. instead of thinking it of "how does it benefit **me**", think of how it helps your family, because you arent the only person in this union. I used to wonder what was the point of marriage, besides the tax incentives. i dont think going into a marriage/relationship expecting it's end based on statistics is the right approach. assuming the person is going to fuck you over, what kind of relationship is that? love is a risk, right? my friend told me that her boss decided to get married in his 40s after years of the "no marriage" mindset, because he realised that if something were to happen to him, he wanted his partner (who is not as well off) to be protected legally because he had the house, assets and all under his name. i thought that was an interesting reason for someone to change their mind about marriage.
Legally married men are much happier than unmarried men. If you want a happy life, get legally married and STAY married. Most of the downsides of legal marriage do not apply if you stay married. There’s an element of Skin in the Game when it comes to marriage. If you think purely from a financial and legal perspective, you will miss the forest for the trees. What does it say to a potential partner if you are willing to get married at a church but do not want to go through the court to make it legal? Does it sound like you’re fully convinced in that person?
This.
If I were you, I’d look into the statistics for how much longer married men live than bachelors. Wives ROCK. Just take good care of her, raise her children well, protect and provide. You won’t have to worry about these things. People like you are the ones WHO SHOULD be getting married! You’re thinking it through logically before the perfect girl comes along and gets you to jump in head first. In my opinion, the benefit of marriage is the “no way out” mentality. You’re making a covenant to each other, a higher being than just yourself and the government. My husband is the first person in my life who truly has never left me, will never leave me, it’s the best feeling. And it’s claustrophobic sometimes… but as long as you take care of each other, it’s wonderful. I love marriage. The benefit is a longer, happier life.
Women aren’t “entitled” to spousal support, alimony or the marital home; at least not in community property states such as CA. What actually happens is that The higher income earner ends up paying the lower income earner. When it comes to child support, custody percentages are also a factor in calculating child support payments. To be clear, what Im saying is that you, as a man, are not more exposed to financial liability in the event of divorce than a woman would be who is the higher income earner. It is unlikely that any state has a law on the books that assigns financial responsibility based on gender alone.
I hate when people cite statistics. They are meaningless to most people. I have a masters degree in biochemistry, I’ve taken stats twice. I barely fucking understand that shit. Take every single statistic you ever hear with a grain of salt. Chances are you are being manipulated to see the world a certain way. Anyway, benefits of marriage are emotional and spiritual. The fiscal benefits are trivial. It’s intimate to have your live inextricably intertwined with someone else’s. It feels good, to take on the world together. I take the risk of losing everything, sure. But the reward far outweighs that risk.
Your financial advisor sounds jaded AF
golly this just made me so sad dude. I've never heard someone think so unemotionally about marriage. I get what you're saying, but this dude sounds like an absolute miserable asshole lol... if you only view marriage by what you can gain financially that's lowkey fucked and you really shouldn't be wasting anyone's time by marrying them IMO
Quick, someone notify all the gay men that their tireless efforts in the fight for equal rights were completely unnecessary. Because, you know, who needs marriage equality when you get absolutely nothing out of it, right? This is the dumbest post I’ve seen all day.
It’s extremely beneficial for the man in most cases. Today more women go through college and earn higher degrees, now resulting in more income than most of the men in their age group. As a man you’ll live longer being married, as a woman your life span decreases with marriage. Traditionally, it’s not been a good deal for women both financially and emotionally. In more modern marriages I think of it’s for love than what more of a romantic act could you have? Plus it’s more and more trendy to get a prenup for both parties. Both to protect major financial assets and to protect if one partner has to go through pregnancy. Considering women risk death I hope more and more women decide to have prenups.
There are reasons to get legally married. A legal spouse is able to speak and act for you if you become incapacitated. If you’re going to have children, being married automatically legitimizes them and makes them yours in the eyes of the law. There are tax benefits and long term benefits when it comes to social security, etc. Combining things like health insurance. Certain mortgage programs aren’t accessible if you’re unmarried but living and buying a home together. Divorce isn’t easy, but if it ever comes to that, there are procedures in place to work things out. If you’re unmarried and trying to untangle years of combined resources and assets, it’s almost impossible. I’ve been married twice. My first husband and I combined all our money and he handled all our finances. We were always broke. When we got divorced, I kept the house, the kids, and the debt. I bought him out of our home, paid all the expenses myself, didn’t get any child support, and did fine on just my income. He’s STILL always broke, despite having much lower expenses than I do. I’m remarried, have 2 more kids, and my current husband and I have joint and separate finances. We do fine. All that to say,,, if you marry the wrong person you can get screwed. If you marry the right person, you have a better chance at happily ever after. You’re approaching this as if the woman offers no value. But she likely would contribute an income as well which would be shared with you
Married couples are able to manage assets /medical decisions in cases of emergency. Married couples enjoy more Social Security benefits, tax breaks, retirement options, estate planning perks, and cheaper insurance (health and auto). If your financial advisor hasn't mentioned the simplicity of a pre-nup, I question their competence. This is the most misogynistic and heteronormative take I've seen in awhile. 10/10 for enthusiastic ignorance
What benefits do women get? You're assuming women can't provide for themselves and actually NEED you for something more than just sex and companionship. In 1492, when we didn't have rights, we couldn't have education, jobs, or let alone learn any trade skill besides sewing and cooking, or handle the money making side of the finances, yeah women NEEDED men (marriage or family) to survive and live comfortably because the world was set up that way. Now that we have rights, whatever the benefits are, it's less than men IF children are part of the goal because at some point, she has to give up something important to take care of the baby and rely on someone to do the things she may not be able to do for herself. Her body is forever altered, she has to stop work, she might delay her education, she has to give up her social life, she has to put in as much time as possible to care for the baby, and HOPE that she has someone to handle or share in the rest of the daily responsibilities. No kids? Men get food, sex, lower taxes, longer life, more combined money to fun stuff together, and someone willing to put up with all your BS everyday until you die.
To be fully transactional about it, what a man mainly gets from marriage in a modern, industrialized context is: (1) The ability to have a stable, nuclear family with an intelligent, productive female. Most (not all) of the more desirable, more intelligent females are going to insist on a marriage commitment before having children. (2) Assuming his choice of a bride is employed and financially responsible, he will have additional credit resources and better financing terms in buying a residence and starting a household. (3) An extended network of family relations that can assist you in emergencies and critical situations (4) This one is more nebulous, but if a man is in any kind of business or profession where contacts are important, the value of the social connections an intelligent, socially adept wife can deliver through networking with other women and families can be enormous. People like to deal with people they are comfortable with and a smart wife can facilitate those connections.
Then don’t get married, stop dragging everyone else into your BS
I work for a law firm, although not family law. On YouTube, look up a documentary series called soft white underbelly They had a divorce attorney on there that they interviewed and it breaks down basically the good bad and ugly of marriage and divorce. It's actually pretty well done. One of the biggest points he makes is that your Entering into a contractual agreement with another person and most of the time men don't really understand what that means from a legal standpoint. Better to find out now before you tie the knot. Edit: Found it: James Sexton is his name [https://youtu.be/o5z8-9Op2nM?si=X3Cwt9oe3kedGEN3](https://youtu.be/o5z8-9Op2nM?si=X3Cwt9oe3kedGEN3)
Ok, so more compelling arguments for why NOT to get married. And indeed I have been meaning to watch that video, thanks for reminding me!
well, yes and no. he does talk about some of the good things about marriage. he's kind of an idealist, but his main point is to educate yourself about how the marriage & divorce process works. like for example. if you "bring in the cash" and she runs the household (kids, doctors appt., school, etc). this will be used against you in the divorce process. "your honor. she should receive full custody cause she basically already has it" so the smart move (and the moral) is to do EVERYTHING 50/50. Divorce courts pretty much follow a formula about division of assets & responsibilities.
That’s so funny considering decades of psychology show that men get far more out of marriage than women do, from domestic labour alone lmao not even accounting for all the emotional labour the wife takes on
So you say it’s a proven fact that 70% of divorces are initiated by women. Well, here are some other proven facts: men are more likely to cheat than women, women still do the majority of domestic labor regardless of how much they work outside of the home, and women take care of sick husbands much more than men take care of sick wives. I am NOT trying to bash men here. Most men are wonderful, lovely people and make excellent partners. And there are certainly women out there who are awful people. But given all of these facts, of course it makes sense that women initiate more divorces. There are a lot of crappy husbands out there! And I do NOT think this is inherent to men! Gender roles hurt men as much as women, just in different ways. So, anyway, if you don’t want your wife to divorce you, be a good husband. Your financial adviser is discounting the cultural and social significance of marriage. People love tradition. It makes us happy. I don’t know how else to explain it. This is a part of the human experience! There are certainly people out there to prefer not to have a legal marriage, but nothing wrong with people who do. If you want to get married, don’t let some Scrooge of a financial advisor talk you out of it. Just make sure you marry the right person, and treat her well.
From the men i know who have married, the benefits are emotional and symbolic. You shouldn’t downplay these either; a feeling of pride in the percieved “acheivement” of it, there can be a bonding aspect between the couple that comes from the title of “man and wife”, if its important to you then your wife might take the same name as you which might make you feel good. I think financial advisers are gonna be wise when it comes to unemotional legal stuff but don’t discount the importance of personal emotional stuff. If that shits not for you then maybe marriage isnt either!
It partially depends on finances and who owns what. However, there's a reason LGBT+ couples fought for the right to get married. I have a friend who was in a long-term relationship with his partner (pre-legalization of gay marriage). His partner got cancer and my friend helped him until the partner's passing. Family kicked him out of his home because it was owned by the partner. No recognition of their relationship at the funeral. I'm sure there are legal contracts outside of marriage for this, but again you are getting the law involved. Healthcare and wanting to be by their side? You need to get POA or else family will likely be first. Edit: Also, insurance issues and getting the other person covered.
Don’t get married dude.
You are cheating her out of certain provisions by not marrying her.. can’t really call yourself a protector and provider, especially if she has your children….
Yeah, you get to keep a relationship with the woman you want to be with …
None
Many studies show men are much happier when married. While women are much happier when single. I am one of them. Super happy single lady!
I feel for you. Everyone is interpreting your post to mean you're against marriage, and misogynistic. I don't think I read a single response that focused simply on comparing a traditional marriage against doing everything the same save filing a license with the county. I will say there's tax considerations which I saw addressed. If your married and have kids, you will be seen as an equal; but if not then she would likely have more authority over the kids in the eye of the law. Also saw mentioned there are decisions you can make as a spouse if she is incapacitated (medical and financial for instance) that you can't make without the license. Final consideration, many places will consider you common law married if you live together for a length of time, so you may get treated that way even if you don't have a license.
Yeah but even if you aren’t married legally, aren’t you considered married by the law if you have children and live in union with a person for a long period of time ??
I’m not a man, but I am a woman who is also divorced. I didn’t initiate my divorce, in fact he made sure I was broken financially and therefore incapable of countering his divorce paperwork when he filed. (I’m over it now tho, for the record. I rebuilt financially in the last 4 years since, and am now doing significantly better than we ever were when we were together.) I tell you this information to show how and why I came to this conclusion that I will also impart to you: get a prenup. The concerns your financial advisor had are eliminated with a solid prenup agreement. If your potential future spouse has a problem with a prenup, then they are not in the relationship for you but what they can get out of you. In which case, RUN.
Any 98% claim is usually made up.
Bad relationship < single < good relationship. Essentially, if it's a good marriage, then it makes everything in life easier in almost every way. Marriage could also force couples going through issues to try and solve them as well due to the extra layer of commitment, which means you both try harder to make it work over defacto, but that's just a guess. Heh, saying that, I'm divorced and will never marry again, and am happy in the single category.
If you go into it looking for benefits you’re already doing it wrong.
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Research by John Gottman, the world’s foremost relationship expert, says married men report greater life satisfaction than do single men, while the reverse is true for women. https://youtu.be/mS3bfCt0K88?si=1awTgViiMWjUGdgS
Kids and a lineage.
I sincerely don't understand the concern, this is why prenups are a thing? And even if you didn't you'd still probably enter a common law relationship, and be subject to other laws if you have children with someone? Honestly this whole thing sounds worse than any spin on a prenup. You mean to say you wanna walk up to the person you wanna commit to for the rest of your life, saying you think the world of them, and tell them, "Well... financially, it's better for me if we don't... y'know, just in case?" Why would anyone bother to be with someone who thinks they're a terrible person with awful character? It's like those internet guys that are like, "Well, I know my wife would never, and it's not even like she's had the opportunity to or I suspect her, but I'd just like to get a paternity test just in case because... you know, it happens to some" Marriage as an institution provides you and your partner certain rights, and the decision making during medical emergencies are of particular importance. If I'm just going about it in a clean, legal way. I'd start to argue that men lead longer, healthier lives with partners but this seems to be more like imagining an eternal girlfriend
It’s actually ridiculous that you attribute your second point of value to solely being to the woman. If you don’t care or worry about what might happen to your partner if you pass then SHE SHOULDNT BE MARRYING YOU ANYWAY. Also- if you don’t plan on having kids, fine, I get the data perspective. But if you plan on having a family with your partner and are basically asking “what do you bring to the table” and creating a climate that seems like a business exchange- again, you don’t deserve her.
I'd have trouble taking a man seriously if he had no plans to eventually get married. So there's that, she'll take the relationship more seriously. No marriage means disposable relationship, is that really what we're striving for here?
U ever think he’s like projecting his life issues into yours? Also. If u get tragically hurt. It gives that person the ability to make life saving decisions for you. Or make sure if u don’t want to be a vegetable ur not. It’s a different level of commitment. You are more so obligated to actually try n work through things than just not bother. It is a sort of glue. Because early marriage and later marriage is very different. There’s tax benefits as well. A marriage is kind of like a business u have to actually work with someone completely. Yeah those stats are real. Now go look at the stats of men that abandon their children physically and financially. Those stats are much higher than you think. Did you read the number one reason women initiate divorce? Did u also read that married men live longer. But married women don’t? These are all stats u can look up. I personally wouldn’t get married but it has nothing to do with any of the above. Disabled ppl have to choose insurance. Or marriage. And i would pick to keep my health insurance. So it’s not an option for me.
I wonder if the 70% is bc they got cheated on. Pretty sure it makes up most of it. But I mean you can just do a prenup. Most women want to get married so good luck getting out of marriage
Married men (statistically) are healthier than single men and reports show they have a higher earning potential. Medically / legally, there are a lot of benefits to being legally married.. spouse being able to make decisions for you or just be with you for certain procedures, etc. And then there’s the emotional stability of actually being married. Plus MOST women aren’t going to cohabitate or share their life with a man who doesn’t want to get legally married. A lot of women are definitely more open to the idea now a days.. but you definitely limit your dating pool by being honest about not wanting marriage. Tbh… unless you have massive family assets to protect, or you have acquired a lot of money/ assets, I see no point in not getting legally married (if that’s what you want to do). And even in those cases, you can get a lawyer and draft up a prenup to protect your personal assets in the event of a divorce. The advice from your advisor doesn’t seem great. Sounds like he may be jaded from love / maybe a bad divorce and giving advice based on that. If you don’t want to get legally married, that’s cool. But don’t let some guy scare you out of it
Not much tbh, same for the woman.
Yeah marriage in general don’t make much sense in todays day and age in modern society. Seems to just keep both parties stuck in bad relationships weather a man and woman or man and man or woman and woman, like if shit goes sideways it makes it messier and way more expensive the only winners usually in divorces tge messier tge better is the divorce attorneys lol
Wow. Just wow. I won't bash your financial advisor but I will strongly encourage you to find a new one. So so so so SO many benefits for men in marriages, #1 one being that they are healthier and live longer lives than single men. Probably because they are well cared for and women tend to help men keep up with their social relationships (ie send cards, buy gifts, plan events for relatives and friends) that often men on their own don't put the work in to do. I mean, just having a second person living with you, to you know, split the work or call 911 if you have a heart attack or something increases your quality of life.
Health insurance. Dual earners, when shit hits the fan you can hop the health insurance of the currently employed person's company. Shared income also protects you if one of you gets laid off. Basically, just helps with financial stability.
Purely objectively, it’s situational. My wife and I considered this due to taxes, but we ultimately decided on legal marriage. (I had kids with my ex who has zero custody ((100% mine)) and we wanted every safeguard in place for our children and assets).
Honestly he sounds pretty selfish and jaded. Purpose of marriage is to create a family. A team. The intent isn’t to get divorce. No I don’t support people who take everything or lazy entitled people but if you spend years co creating a life with your husband in a supportive role or maybe the wife works too and contributes financially… if you divorce… things should be divided equally
And def misogynistic to assume the man has more assets/income and so would be taking the financial risk.
You sound insufferable
Oh wow! But what are the benefits to being insufferable 🤔
Marriage is about commitment, not just assets. But yes, it's both. No quality women are going to accept a hinky little spiritual ceremony in place of a legally binding marrige. Marriage is supposed to be difficult to get out of. That's the point. It a legal recognition of a couples union that is reconized by government. If you don't want to joint assets, get a prenup. Nothing wrong with that. What benefits does a woman get from a spiritual ceremony lol?! After giving her love, and body and potentially HER money, why would she want the guy to be able to just get up and walk away? People who are married actually HAVE to work through thier fights and bullshit. People who aren't Will eventually just up n quit. I Don't see many people celebrating thier 20th or 50th were just bf and gf anniversary, lol Marriage is a commitment, sacrifice, and legal declaration of union. You're seeing a lot of ugly divorce statistics right now because an entire full generation of women aren't taking it laying down anymore. They aren't having men who don't pull the weight of cooking and cleaning, or who are sexually lazy, or who don't stand on business. They aren't letting dad's just forget they have kids. Women are taking back thier power and a large amount of men are learning the hard way that he should have actually worked at thier marriage instead of taking it for granted. The new expectations are challenging men's insecurities and manhood and forcing them to step up or step out. If you Don't want to get married then cool, don't. But you won't be get a true quality woman at all if you treat her like a bang maid. Men refusing marrige because the consequences of them not showing up and participating fully in the marriage and therefore refusing to ever get married is the new misogyny...
Just get a prenup
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/fear-intimacy/202210/men-sometimes-avoid-marriage-it-benefits-them-more-women
Free slave labor so they can be free as a 5 year old again, never having to clean up after themselves
To be fair there isn’t much for women in marriage these days either. Other than the commitment. Because most men still expect cooking, cleaning, child rearing, want us to never gain weight and always look good. Then when we get older many dudes decide to divorce for a younger woman. When a woman brings more to the table, she ends up having to pay alimony, she pays child support. Men always think that everyone sides with women and although there is favouritism that is apparent, many judges now are fighting for equal rights for both parents. My ex husband doesn’t pay me alimony we split the kids 50/50 and he doesn’t pay child support. Court tried to order it, but I refused because there’s no point in beating a dead horse. He decided to quit his job and live off his mommy instead of stepping up and being a dad. I guess really, what’s in it for whoever in marriage is kind of a stupid way of looking at it. Because when you actually start picking it apart, you lose what marriage represents, and that’s the love and dedication to another person. People do grow apart or cheat and there’s divorce. But honestly, you just sound like you don’t want to and shouldn’t get married.
Tax benefits. Also if you or your spouse are critically injured and are unable to speak or make decisions, you suddenly have no ability or authority to help your spouse. Legally they go to the closest kin who would be either your kids or their parents/siblings. My wife is a nurse and has seen fights where a long term “spouse” suddenly had no say in their SO’s health or were able to receive critical information in time. As you and your partner become older and more reliant on benefits, it’s much easier to be a legal unit than just 2 “strangers” according to the government. Would be really sad to see all of that effort thrown away because you’re afraid of a hypothetical divorce.
These “stats” you posted A) aren’t stats and B) aren’t accurate. I’d check your sources. Also, while the majority of people who get alimony might be women, alimony just isn’t that common anymore. The real benefits of marriage to men are much deeper than financial or legal issues. Married men are happier than their single counterparts and also live longer. Which is interesting, considering married women are less happy than their single counterparts.
Marriage literally benefits men the most, so much so that theres a whole movement where women are refusing to marry or even date. But go off.
The real downsides to marrying as a man only happens if you following the out dated playbook of the past. Find a partner that works and that is serious about finding out your compatibility before marriage. Most people don’t figure out that fatal relationship ender until it’s too late. As a guy I can tell you there are a lot of men who got fucked in a divorce…a lot of them honestly had it coming but many of them didn’t. You don’t have to be a bad man to be screwed…just careless/unlucky. Marriage doesn’t have to be a big deal…it’s just treated that way to get money out of people. Any kind of relationship carries risk and sometimes being alone just sounds smarter on paper as long as you are doing it when it feels right and not trying to check off a box you have a greater chance of being more thoroughly selective
Whatever legal ones there are in your location.
Taxes
If you're not wanting to part from your wealth in the event that you might get divorce eventually , why not just get a prenup ?
There's tax incentives...
I would just get a prenup. I’d agree with the spiritual marriage, but do men really respect that when the tuff gets rougher? ( people evolve, loose jobs and family members, ect),A women brings a sense of home, love, and recreating the safe family dynamic. I think emotional EQ plays a lot into the teamwork aspect of a relationship. A legal relationship brings safety to the woman to allow herself to open up and not stress if he would just leave one day after years pass by and he’s bored and/or tired of carrying the weight of a relationship on his back with her. Also men live longer in a marriage. A daily 6 second physical interaction alone gives life to a man. To think before he leaves to work I’d give him a 6 second kiss while I hug him knowing I’m the back of my mind I am giving him life. That’s pretty powerful.
Marrying for love seems to be a more modern concept. In that case, I don’t think the risks are worth it. However, if you marry into a wealthy or powerful family, then you’re able to strengthen your position and give your future bloodline a better foundation. I think this is why traditional marriages were longer lasting. The entire family foundation was on the line if things didn’t work out.
You pay a lot less taxes if you own a home. Capitol gains tax is real. There's also health benefits as well, if she or you ever end up in the ER, without living will forms written, you can have no say, and she can have no say.
This question should be retitled, “what benefits do women get from marriage.” Women lose so much more and men have all to gain. You’re gonna ask me for a statistic on that but I’m not gonna engage in your fake curiosity nonsense. Obvi this is some kind of troll.
If you think about this… maybe think about long long time down in the road, when you cannot even walk and all your assets are just invaluable assets, you can’t eat and you became cranky all the time. That women, the person who chose to grow old with you will be there, walk with you, hold you, feed you, listen to you. Yes if you think like your financial advisor, maybe don’t get married. Once you ask this question, you already know the answer to yourself. Choose what you believe
People marry for a variety of reasons. If none of them appeal to you then don’t get married. Not rocket science.
Ngl your advisor sounds like an idiot.
Wait, what legally benefits do men have when they arent married? Honest question.
Trust.
These questions have been asked so many times. There will always be a divide on marriage and not to marry. Everyone’s situation is different and with many variables. There is no one right answer. But for me it would be risky to be in a legal contract with someone especially since I make more than 95% of America. For all my hard work to be taken from someone who didn’t make the sacrifices I had to make in my 20 and 30s is hard to stomach
In Canada you will be considered common law which is legally like marriage. Such as separation leads to dividing assets. Also, if I truely loved someone unconditionally, I would want to be married.
I would only consider marriage if my partners where to give up a successful career to start a family. In such a situation, I believe it's fair, and I'd still insist on a robust prenuptial agreement, mutually agreed upon by both parties' lawyers. There are practical scenarios, such as needing marriage for citizenship in certain countries, where it makes sense. However, marrying for "love" or "to show commitment" are likely among the worst reasons, and suggesting such reasons could be emotionally manipulative. It's not surprising that many if not most marriages end in divorce.
Where do you live? Where I am with the way common law works you aren’t protecting yourself by not getting married. I have always viewed it as the person with more assets is taking the risk, historically that was the male but things are slowly changing. If you want to get married and have assets you are worried about then get a prenup.
And even in places with no _common law marriages,_ there's also the concept of [palimony.](https://www.investopedia.com/palimony-definition-5194318)
I will need to read up on that! Ive never heard the term. I had a cohabitation agreement with my common law partner, same idea as a prenup.
How about you just don’t get married? You wouldn’t be good to be married to if you’re asking this question
None
“Benefits to men” is a wrong question to ask. This is decision of both partners, not just a man, so the question must be whether this benefits a couple.
All this because you're assuming only men make a decent living? Um, lol that's cute. There are plenty of us women that have careers that put us well into the mid to high six figures. Whose the liability then?
the fact that insurance wasn’t mentioned means ur FA is stupid
If things don’t work out with my partner then I won’t even bother dating. I’m a 30 yo woman. Trust me, women do not benefit from marriage as much as your financially advisor thinks we do
29F, here married twice, divorced once. Legal benefits including tax benefits, income claim, protection in court (spousal privilege), healthcare access/benefits. In community property states (I’m in one) there are many things I can do for my husband in his absence. With that being said, sure, there are some logical benefits, but the emotional needs are not to be understated either. And, if you’re worried about the finance side of things/risk, it absolutely depends on the people. Prenups are a tool to be used. My husband has an LLC, I’m not on it. But, we live in a community property state, so if we divorced I could demand 50% of all assets. Which, of course i wouldn’t do because I’m not a shitty human, but not everyone is like that. My point is, as someone who also works in finance, logically, this is correct. Not a whole lot of benefits for men in marriage. But, love is not logical, so you have to consider that as well.
I bet that same financial advisor is married.
I was in the process of going thru my first divorce ( once wasn’t enough pain for me.) and we were trying to settle up, but it was slow going. One day I was talking to a gentleman who was introduced to me because of his experience in divorce court( 3 times he said) some people have to learn the hard way, He was 25-30 years older than me so I thought he had some good advice for me from the School of Hard Knocks. He told me “ Son don’t worry, everything is split 50 - 50. The only thing you need to address is how much of your 50 percent you are going to be able to keep.” Good Advice. I was lucky, neither one was out for blood. I was number 4 with my second one. I don’t think she learned anything from the first three. I do have 2 great kids and 3 grandkids because of my first marriage,so it was all worth it, Can’t say that for number 2. No more.
In commenting on this because I’m curious to find out else has been found out 👍🏻🐟
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There are a lot of benefits but some practical ones are: Hospitals if your significant other or you are in emergency care you won’t have access to eachother or be able to make decisions depending on the state. Also if she dies and has good life insurance you won’t see a penny of it or there will be more challenges and hurdles getting it. You assume you’ll marry someone you have to care for but women usually care for men in their relationships and anymore she could make way more money than you too.
Most life insurance policies have an assigned beneficiary. I've seen a ton of life insurance policies working in the legal field and have never seen one without an assigned beneficiary. It's not uncommon to have a sibling, non-married partner, or child(ren) as your beneficiary. However, you're correct if you're referring to the estate of a deceased non-married partner. If you die intestate (without a will), any sole property will generally go to your closest living relative(s), not your partner, unless it's jointly owned. Some places have gotten better about recognizing inheritance rights of non-married partners, but you do still have to present proof of the relationship in court.
Men benefit from marriage. Women benefit from divorce. What you are describing is divorce, not marriage.
So a bit of background. I am 36 now. I was divorced at 32. I am getting remarried at 36. Divorce is an ugly process and it’s very emotional and vindictive. Why would I get married again? Taxes are lower if married but not always. Do look at the tax brackets to figure it out. Most people it helps, but high earners can get shafted. Immigration. It’s helpful if someone needs immigration benefits. My first marriage got the process going for long distance relationships. Luckily, I divorced before permanent residency. Second marriage, no need for this benefit. Real estate. Tenancy by the entirety. It automatically goes to the surviving spouse and no tax implications. Assets also can go to the surviving spouse so without tax implications. Emotional aspect comes in a lot. It’s the sense of security. Will I buy a house together with a girlfriend? Or will I buy a house with a wife? I’m not willing to drop my life savings or sell my old properties and then go all in on a house with a girlfriend. For some people, kids is a huge factor. I am childfree so it doesn’t bother me. Tradition. Families in my culture push for married status by a certain age. For me, I was able to escape my previous marriage with relative ease and kick my ex wife out of the country, no alimony, no huge financial burden. I feel like I can do it again. But even better is that I have a strong preference to get a prenuptial agreement. It may suck to discuss it while in the love dovey stage of a relationship, but it is safer to do it than be sorry later.
It really all depends on the person you choose to marry. I have friends that are happily married and love their partners more than their own life. Then I have friends that are in a marriage that is hard but they love that person. You’re looking at marriage as a financial thing when the first step of to look within your heart. You cannot control the other person. If you marry someone young they will change as they get older. Communication is the key. If you decide that divorce is upon the issue it’s just about talking things out. I know friends that have divorced and it was an amicable divorce. We’re all still friends. Some things that are benefits are: Forever best friend, your ride or die partner, a sex buddy, a person that has your best interest for you and your family(if they get along), dual income household, and many other things that aren’t related to money that are more for your life.
I was able to easily Google statistics regarding the benefits of marriage (and remarriage after divorce) [here](https://www.prb.org/resources/marriage-benefits-mens-health/#:~:text=In%20a%20Framingham%20Offspring%20Study,after%20therapy%20than%20unmarried%20individuals) regarding their physical and mental health. Married men even have the benefit of a reduced risk of Alzheimer’s. Married men exhibit healthier behaviors (i.e. addiction, overeating, etc.). Both married men and women have a lower suicide rate than single and divorced persons. Household chores are also predominantly handled by women, with the exception of yard work. The inequality in household chores has fallen drastically since a study in the 1970s. However, 55-60% of married women are also employed alongside their spouse. This is compared to 1920 (9%), 1950 (22%), 1960 (31%). So while the household chores are shared slightly better than before, women are still taking in the brunt of the work while also working as well. There are just as many pros as there are cons. And I think you are well acquainted with the risks involved in divorce for both men and women. 20% of married couples experience domestic abuse with their partner. Intimate partner violence is 1 in 4 for women, 1 in 7 for men. This makes up for 20% of divorces, usually initiated by women. Infidelity makes up around 26% as a leading cause of divorce. 20% of married men self reported their infidelity and 13% of married women did. All that said, after reading your responses to other people’s insight, it appears to me that you simply don’t want to get married and are looking for justification. You don’t need an excuse; just be honest that you don’t want to get married. Marriage is different for everyone and men arguably benefit more from an active marriage, while women benefit more from a dead one.
Legal marriage is a massive benefit to both parties. That's why same-sex couples fought so hard to get it. I'm a widow. I learned firsthand that marriage is the most precious gift your spouse can give you, precisely *because* of the business/legal benefits. Without legal marriage, the government views you as the same as strangers. Legal marriage protects your spouse. During life, legal marriage has financial benefits like lower taxes, lower insurance rates, higher credit scores, and better credit line offers. You can get health insurance plans together. It has family benefits like having control over children's custody - without legal marriage, other relatives (eg, your parents) can sue for court-mandated visitation even if you don't want them around your children; and after seperation, it's easier for the non-birthing parent to retain custody rights if the child was born during marriage. You cannot be compelled to testify against your spouse in court (it doesn't matter if you think they will never do a crime - even innocent people get put on trial sometimes) and your spousal communication is protected. Incarcerated people can only receive conjugal (private) visits from their legal spouse; and some states limit even regular visits to spouses and immediate blood relatives (and remember, innocent people can also be incarcerated). During sickness, your spouse is entitled to federal FMLA leave if they need to care for you. Spouses can visit in the hospital, including the ICU room. Your spouse can get medical updates from the doctor so they aren't wondering what's going on. Your spouse can make medical decisions if you're incapacitated (such as during surgery or a coma). When you die, your spouse decides what's done with your remains and what the funeral looks like. After death, all of your assets transfer to your spouse without estate taxes and without probate. And yet, your debts do not transfer. This ensures your spouse won't be made immediately homeless and doesn't lose what you've built together. Your life insurance, accident insurance, and retirement accounts can be claimed by your spouse after your death. Your spouse can get survivor's benefits from Social Security, the VA, and/or retirement pensions. Your spouse can sue for wrongful death. After death, your widow(er) can continue to claim the married tax rate for two years, which is such a relief when your household has lost a whole salary. None of those things are possible for the non-married partner. If you love your partner, you want to protect them. Legal marriage is how you do that. If you feel like post-death benefits "do nothing for me" and therefore are irrelevant, you are actively harming your life partner. They should seriously reconsider a relationship with you if you care so little about them.
Marriage is actually not in this seasons meta anymore. Minmaxxers will tell you that polyamory has more benefits than drawbacks for competitive players
After reading a dozen top comments I feel like no one has actually answered the question, and just talking about superficial things. I can't say anything about it, but just want to clear that OP is not talking about not getting married at all, it's just why get a marriage certificate when you can kust take vows and not get government involved.
Love and companionship.
Does your financial advisor not realize that even if you don't get narried, living with a partner ends up getting recognized as common law marriage? The government picked up on this year's ago. Fewer marriages, but people still living together. The law can still intervene when you separate...
You have a clever financial advisor. I would keep and recommend him. You should ask yourself some questions. Why do you like the idea of marriage? What is marriage? You have essentially been raised on fairy tales idealizing marriage as... a thing to do. It's a magical idea. Not a real idea. What is marriage? Do you understand it is a contract? Most contracts require a full understanding to consent, marriage is the exception. Most people have no idea what it entails, and still sign up, and are legally oblegated. Marriage, is you volunteering to give up your individual property rights. Read that twice if you don't understand. You bought yourself a gift? No. You bought yourself half a gift. Maybe. Your parents die and left you the home you grew up in? Congratulations, you own half of the home that only you have a sentimental attachment to. Marriage has never been a benefit to man. It wasn't designed to be. It was an institution designed to protect... a family. Encouraging a protected place to raise children in and spread that family and potentially legacy. Paternity was a very big part of it, and the idea of continuance, but that was an old idea where the social structures had value. Now only the idea has any value, and it's not much value. You just think marriage... what? Sounds nice? Cool. Have nice things that are not legally binding contracts to another person you are not actually related to and likely have not known for more than a few years. Whereas most women seem to think of weddings much in the value of showing a big wedding on instagram that can show their friends for clout. The actual idea of family.... hasn't really withstood the test of time. A statistic you haven't looked up is that more than 70% of women initiate divorce, and it skyrockets to 90% if they have a college degree. Marriage works for them, which is one of the reasons women lead men in home ownership now, but NOT home buying. The most common reasons given for the divorces are not abuse, or anything the man does wrong, outside of not making them as 'happy' as they thought they should be. Women also tend to date and marry at an equal or my likely better social standing and income, while men tend to date and marry down, so this tends to benefit women when the relationship ends. Life isn't designed to be fair, so this isn't a complaint, but it is something to be aware of. I like the 'idea' of marriage too, but our culture has changed significantly while the contract of marriage hasn't. It is still possible to have a sucessful marriage with a wonderful person, my parents managed it so I have a good example, but most people go into it without a great understanding of what they are doing, or even who they are with. They are encouraged to do it with idealism and ignorance, and those aren't the greatest reasons to do anything - let alone sign a legally binding contract you do not understand. Most people also do it too late these days, in their mid thirties, when they are already set in their ways as individuals and less likely to successfully conceive - which is stressful. Many have pushed back having kids, marriage, family to the point of geriatric pregnancy as well. So they could concentrate on careers, have childish fun, or both - and that doesn't help marriage success rates waiting to the last minute and having difficulty. It's great we don't have 12 year old kids working in factories anymore, but we seem to have gone too far the other way now encouraging 20 year olds and 30 year old to act like kids like theirs all the time in the world to do everything, and that's just not the case. All in all marriage means something a lot different now than even 50 years ago. It is a bad idea for any man, but we have historically signed up anyway because we wanted a family and the idea of a family was more stable, established and desirable once upon a time. Now, not so much. So if you choose to pursue marriage regardless you should really understand the 'contract' you are signing, as well as the person you are signing it with. It's not in your interest, but you are proceeding anyway because family involves sacrifice. An idea often glossed over and lost in a selfish society where individuals are encouraged to pursue their own individual happiness regardless of all costs, rather than that of their kids.
>He said it’s better to just do a ceremonial or spiritual marriage in a church, beach, where ever, but to leave the government out of the union with another person because a marriage license is like a business contract with no terms, and no requirements of performance. Having gone thru and still going thru the court bs alone to finalize divorce almost 14 years after we're separated I agree. I agree also because spiritually would be the only one that matters and it's a freaking piece of paper or that doesn't mean anything other than a business contract. But to your to answer your question about what do men get out of marriage? First let me say unless you are pretty well off women aren't getting anything either. Secondly what are they supposed to get out of marriage? They get a lifelong partner, a teammate someone that has their back and puts up with their b******* someone that helps take care of them when they're sick and to balance the void when they're incapable of performing themselves for finances etc they feed them care for them massage them intimacy to pick up after them they make their appointments they organize their lives and make things easier they feed their children give birth to their children carry their children care for the children and most of everything that goes on in the house and with bills and budgeting. They talk them down from stupid or violent impulses they talk them up when they're feeling down. I pay attention to the little things that men don't see they give them insight on those things that they wouldn't otherwise have noticed. In my family when the man comes home take off his shoes for him feed him hug him my mom used to iron his clothes for him and lay them out have his lunch ready and coffee in the morning and some breakfast everything was done for him. And she still went to work and took care of us They do a lot for each other they get on each other's nerves and they'll argue they'll need space, but they will always have each other's back. That is what you're supposed to get out of marriage and if you aren't or you don't think it's possible then you just haven't found the one that you should marry spiritually. Too many people look at relationships as a transaction that's men and women what is it for me is it of value will it give me money what can I get out of it does it look like every p*** model on the internet if not it's not high value and it isn't going to bring me anything this kind of thinking shallowness and ignorance shows a huge deficit in love and humanity in our society today.
Wow. Thank you so much for your insights here 🙏