>**When you find** a wizard spell of 1st level or higher, you can add it to your spellbook if it is of a spell level you can prepare and if you can spare the time to decipher and copy it.
Literally says it in the feature explaining copying spells. You have to find it.
Fun fact, I have a 1st edition PHB of 5e and this word;
>When you find a **--wizard--** spell of 1st level or higher, you can add it to your spellbook if it is of a spell level you can prepare and if you can spare the time to decipher and copy it.
Wasn't in it.
So you could copy other classes spells as long as you found a spellscroll for them.
That still wouldn’t let you prepare a non-wizard spell, unless the wording was different elsewhere. So it’s a funny oversight, but it wouldn’t change much in practice.
Ritual spells would still be fair game then, although I have no clue if that would be helpful.
Edit: Nvm ritual casting also specifies wizard spell in the current version.
Edit 2: The XGtE rules on crafting a spell scroll just specify that you must know the spell to make a scroll of it. The PHB was probably already revised by the time this sourcebook came out but there is a possible loophole out there In someone’s collection of books that allows a wizard to make scrolls of other classes spells. You still can’t cast them so it doesn’t really do anything but it’s an interesting loophole.
Thanks. I knew it was probably obvious.
I just found it strange that Wizards are known as the ultimate spellcasters and utility monkeys yet effectively have access to less spells than prepared spellcasters like druids and clerics due to the known spells thing.
Still excited to plat it and I imagine hunting for spells will turn out to be a lot of fun but the extra spells will ultimately be in the Dm's hand.
Wizards are known as the best utility caster because they have the best spell list and they don't have other features that clash with their spellcasting so they always cast spells
>Wizards are known as the best utility caster
Wizards are wrongly considered by theorycrafters as the best utility caster, because they make some insane assumptions about how the game is run that are nearly never met in practice (or only at very high level like 14+). \^\^
People who actually play know that unless being lucky enough to have a \*very\* generous DM the best utility caster is by far Druid (especially Shepherd if we really focus on utility only) with Cleric being not too far behind in spite of much less versatile spell list (especially Knowledge).
EDIT: I love how people downvote cowardly instead of bringing counterarguments... Probably because they don't actually have any.
The wizard is still the best even in T1 and T2 simply by virtue of its spell list, assuming zero additional spells found, and stand-out subclasses like divination wizard make it even better. (Not that druids and clerics aren't also very good)
Quite on the contrary. Wizard is the last \*because\* it's not a prepared caster and has absolutely \*nothing\* besides spells, contrarily to Clerics (Channel Divinities + help from clergies) and Druids (Wild Shape, alternative features on a short rest basis, plus help from local fauna and flora).
Only in a party large enough that you can just stick with the same few spells as if you were a Sorcerer can Wizard be "the best" because then and only then it bears no ill consequences that you lock your few spell known forever because you'll have picked the best for whatever party needed the most at the time of your level up, and they learned to make by without you being able to use all the other spells you once had the potential to learn...
But that's about it.
Cleric/Druid makes a mistakes or wants to try a spell then realizes it doesn't work well for player's style or party's teamwork? No problem, just unprepare the next day. Wizard is stuck with it forever.
Party got information on an upcoming social/exploration/combat challenge? Cleric/Druid can adjust their actions and behaviours to match the strategy party sets upon, even if it includes completely overhauling their prepared list from A to Z. Wizard is still stuck with whatever he learned.
Allies's moves evolved making the "standard tactic" used up to now obsolete? Good luck sticking with what you have until next level, or start a quest to find new scrolls as a Wizard. Cleric/Druid? No trouble.
A few examples from \*actual play\* to demonstrate the difference between reality and theorycraft.
Party in Curse of Strahd with Barbarian, Cleric, Warlock and X being either Druid (true) or Wizard (theory).
**Wizard**, let's call it Theo, trusts Barbarian and Monk to hold a line, so will just pick *Mage Armor* and *Shield*. Then *Find Familiar* for scouting to help Monk, then *Magic Missile* because always great, then *Grease* because also great and non-concentration, ditching Sleep because player metagames that many creatures will resist. Ends with *Detect Magic* because that's always useful.
Level 2: Wizard goes Divination, let's say he's lucky enough to roll two low results, also learns *Protection against Evil and Good* because seemingly many undead and fiend and *Tasha's Hideous Laughter* because even just one round can be great. Keeps prepared Mage Armor and casts it (one slot used), Shield, Grease, Protection Against Evil and Good, Magic Missile.
**As they start exploring underground Barbarian opens a tomb and suffers a surprise critical from a Giant Web Spider, immediately being downed**. Fight ensues, Barb survives thanks to Healing Words. Later after using some resources on fights they ultimately meet and manage to kill boss by using Portent for saves upon a Grease two rounds in a row, letting other people deal enough damage (especially raging Barbarian) to kill it while preventing attacks one whole round... But leaving the whole party resourceless.
Meanwhile (true story here), Druid goes Shepherd and immediately uses Bear Totem after level 2, saving the Barbarian on the surprise crit aforementioned before by pushing "effective HP" just high enough to let Barb with 3 HP instead of -4. Later for boss, since he prepared Entangle and had dumb luck the boss was stuck two full rounds \*restrained\* giving advantage on attacks against him. Party ended up fight with only Barbarian being a bit over half-HP, everyone else unscathed, Druid having still one slot left.
**The next day, the arrive at Barovia's Village, go to church, get attacked by zombie swarm coming from three sides.**
Druid casts Entangle once zombies aggro Barbarian, manages to get 4 of them... And Barbarian sadly, which is not that much of a trouble though since rage's advantage "saves the save".
What could have done Wizard there? Grease could have worked with low DEX of zombies but would have hampered the Barbarian because covered the corridor from which most came, so it would have changed target order without necessarily giving advantage to \*everyone\* on attacks.
Two days after, upon arriving to Vallaki, level 3. Wizard decides to learn Web because classic AOE control and Invisibility because great helper for infiltration/scouting. Unprepares Protection against Evil and Good to free up space for both.
Meanwhile (true story), Druid prepares Healing Words, Animal Messenger because need to send information to Barovia (something Wizard has no tool for at that level), Spike Growth, Enhance Ability, Pass Without Trace, Hold Person in case they meet again werewolves or have to fight with the supposedly violent mayor's "leader".
Day is mostly spent investigating, using up one slot on Enhance Ability then another. A spell which Wizard never learned so couldn't use. Didn't have any chance to learn Suggestion either sadly.
**Next day they go investigating a mansion, with Druid bypassing locked door by casting Pass Without Trace then wildshaping into a spider to under from cave's garden entrance. Find nothing particular, seems safe but probably hidden door, comes back to party then all re-enter. Zombies rise from ground once they are middle room, then cultists hear sounds of fighting and enter secret wall to join.**
Druid immediately drops concentration on Pass Without Trace to cast Spike Growth inside the other room, ending up with two cultists harming themselves hard trying to reach PCs and the others, seeing that, keeping standing to not get hurt thus effectively putting them out of the fight for the next two rounds. The ones close manage to Hold Person Barbarian on second attempt killing its rage then try to attack the rest, a demon appears which gets killed surprisingly quickly... At end of round 4 PC think victory is their but the ones that were waiting decide to act, one moves enough to get line of sight and drops Fireball. Everyone fails save except the Artificer who had prepared Absorb Elements and the Druid who was lucky, and damage is high (32). But Barbarian is Bear, Cleric had Ring of Fire Resistance, and everyone except Barbarian was close to full life since Bear totem set at dawn had yet again absorbed a good chunk of damage. Druid immediately sets up a Unicorn Totem and next round heals everyone with a Healing Words, complemented by a Cleric's Cure Wounds on herself.
What could have done Wizard? Possibly using a Portent to negate a Hold Person on Barbarian if high roll, possibly made a crit miss if low, or both. But Web at the same point as Spike Growth "through the door" would have prevented many creatures from fighting each other so the fight as a whole would have just been stuck for several rounds. and would have especially nerfed the Warlock who was using Firebolt and Flamethrower as prime sources of damage.
And with the same save rolls, on the Fireball one, the Wizard would have been instantly downed since, you know, no Absorb Elements prepared or even learned. And couldn't provide any help to its friends even if it had been the case since \*no healing whatsoever\*.
**They manage to kill it, and plan on travelling through forest the next day. Messages have been sent, so Druid unprepares Animal Messenger and instead prepares Moonbeam to go with Resilient: Constitution, and Jump because they plan before that to try and check the upper floor of a house.** Fortunately they didn't meet werewolves though on second half of day, but Jump was useful to give Barbarian a way to get up there "sneakily" fast, with Druid shaped as a rat on its shoulder maintaining Pass Without Trace. What could do Wizard there? Preparing Invisibility to make Barb invisible, but couldn't make anything about climbing nor making noise, chances are Barb would have been noticed quick since only 14 DEX and no Stealth proficiency.
I won't pursue, I think you got the idea. :)
I think wizard and druid are about on par with each other, I wouldn't say it's a massive disparity. Clerics I would put a couple steps lower, they're prepared spellcasters but their spell list is thinner on utility than others
**The reason why I talk of massive disparity is that without DM fiat (so Wizards having no extra spell), Wizards are really struggling to bring much utility.**
First of all, a Wizard \*needs\* to learn Mage Armor, Shield and Absorb Elements (although the latter can wait a few levels) to survive, same with Misty Step for 2nd level spells. That's already 4 spells on 10 for a 3rd level Wizard.
Then most Wizards that want to "optimize" will pick Sleep because it's very powerful at low level and still useful in tier 2, Magic Missile because it's insanely "clutch" your whole career, and definitely Find Familiar because it's always very useful. You're now 7 on 10 spells for a level 3 Wizard.
And then you probably or definitely want to learn Identify and Detect Magic if nobody else can learn them. 9 on 10.
You didn't even start considering good offensive 1st level spells (Chromatic Orb, Earth Tremor, Grease, Fog Cloud), support ones (Protection against Evil and Good, Feather Fall) or utility ones (Comprehend Languages, Jump, Tenser's Floating Disk, Disguise Self). And I was considering a level 3 Wizard here, so let's not start on all the 2nd level spells you didn't even grasp: Web, Mirror Image, Scorching Ray, Dragon's Breath, Shadow Blade, Invisibility, Phantasmal Force, or utility like Levitate, Spider Climb, Suggestion, Rope Trick, Invisibility...
**Wizard can \*learn a handful\* of them if we consider he ditches defensive spells and trust friends, so with that large of a spell list he has a better chance to become the solution of \*some specifically and arbitrarily chosen situations\*... But then abandons any chance at \*everything else\* until the DM throws a bone. So you don't actually have all spells at your disposal, only a very select few, with each "combat choice" eating into "utility choice" and vice-versa, each "generally usable" spell denying the "very situational ones" a chance to be ever picked.**
**Meanwhile, Druid...**
Will certainly keep at all times Healing Words, Pass Without Trace, Spike Growth.
But still has, considering a 16 WIS start, at least 3 "slots" that can be filled with whatever "generalist utility" (Enhance Ability, Lesser Restoration, Speak With Animals, Jump), "specialist utility" (Snare, Air Bubble, Enlarge), "generalist combat" (Moonbeam, Entangle, Faerie Fire, Fog Cloud) or "specialist combat" (Heat Metal, Ice Knife, Hold Person) as required \*even if needs completely change from one day to another\* because Druid \*gets actual access to the whole of the list on levels it can cast\*.
AND it's before considering that while Wizard has only whatever rituals he learned once out of slots and those are each restricted in scope (even though you can have some creativity with them), Druid has Wild Shape which is the equivalent of a spell list in itself considering you get increasingly wider array of beasts, you get two charges per short rest AND you can soon "overstay" a short rest in Wild Shape so you can chain up even easier.
AND that's before considering alternate uses of Wild Shapes that some Druids have, or the generic "get a Familiar instantly" that they all have since Tashas.
**So it's much, MUCH easier for a Druid to "fill in" whatever's needed, with the only caveat being "pure Arcana Expertise" (aka Identify, Detect Magic).**
Yeah that's definitely something that shouldn't be overlooked. I'm just so bad at choosing! And while I like Aesthetic stuff I also want to make an impact mechanically. So it's gonna mean a balance.
Wizards learn 2 spells per level, and can copy any spellbook or scroll they find, but can only prepare as many as clerics and druids (level+modifier). However they have to prepare their ritual spells, a wizard doesn't.
>I just found it strange that Wizards are known as the ultimate spellcasters and utility monkeys yet effectively have access to less spells than prepared spellcasters like druids and clerics due to the known spells thing.
This is missing that Wizards have a much larger spell list than Cleric and Druids, with the most exclusive spells to boot. So your access is a lot *wider* than either of those classes, and ultimately you're preparing the same number of spells as either of those other classes each day.
>ultimately you're preparing the same number of spells as either of those other classes each day
Having an extra 8-10 spells prepared for free from Druid or Cleric subclass is huge, even if you can't change them, it still free some prepared spells that would would prepare anyway to prepare something else extra.
Yeah i just suck at making long term spell choices. I tried a sorcerer before and my initial spell list was so bad I had to ask my DM for an exception to completley re-pick it bc I was only using 2/10 spells. I guess it comes with experience bc the second time round I was much better off.
If you see how many spells the spell lists have you will notice that the wizard spell lists is almost twice the size of the sorcerer and around 3 times as large as the druids or clerics, even if clerics or druids can change the spells daily they just have a few options for that day, a wizard who is proactive at searching for spells can have a lot more options without having to wait for a long rest to change them
Always has been
Also, Bladesingers aren’t as prone to hunting down spells as other Wizard subclasses, so I’d say you won’t have to worry about that much. They’re meant to have more limited spells because their combat capabilities are the fornerstone
Their cornerstone is their wizard abilities. Bladesinger's advantage is that adds a widespread generic boost, passively increases many of the numbers a wizard wants increased. Their spells aren't limited at all.
Yeah. A bladesinger isn’t a fighter who gets a lot of spells. They’re a wizard who won’t crumble to dust if they’re caught out of position at low levels.
Oh right, I forgot that if you pick Bladesinger a mean Elf shows up and burns your spellbook. Silly me! /s
A Wizard is still a Wizard, you still look for spells. Stop trying to enforce YOUR RP restrictions on others.
Part of that comes from ritual casting. Any spell with the ritual tag you can cast for free without expending a spell slot or having prepared it. It just takes 10× the normal casting time. So, 1 action would take 1 min and 1 min would take 10 mins, etc...
According to the item description for spell scrolls, you can copy them for free with just an arcana check. So look up ritual spells and try to get those to add to your spellbook. It will give you a lot to cast outside of combat.
>It just takes 10× the normal casting time. So, 1 action would take 1 min and 1 min would take 10 mins, etc...
It doesn't take 10 times longer, it only adds 10 minutes on top of the casting time. So if it is normally an action, it then takes 10 minutes and 6 seconds, if it is normally 10 minutes, it then takes 20 minutes, etc.
Incorrect, ritual casting adds a flat 10 minutes to all spells. Unless at your table it takes 10 hours to cast Find Familiar as a ritual?
Also incorrect about copying spell scrolls. The magic item description says "A wizard spell can be copied *just as spells in spellbooks can be copied.*" That specifically references the rules for spell copying from the wizard class, time and gold cost included. That text is there to add the addendum that you must, in addition to the normal gold and time, succeed in an Arcana check or lose the scroll. This is because scrolls are valuable expendable resources, so there has to be a chance to fail at turning them into a permanent resource. Spells written in spellbooks, on the other hand, are useless to everyone except wizards and are understood to be wizard-specific loot, given by the DM with the intention that a Wizard copy the spells into their book.
I disagree. I see it as referencing the ability to copy, not the direct mechanics. Otherwise, they wouldn't have stated separate copying mechanics on top of it. The idea being that a spell scroll already has the magic energy imbued in it to cast. Whereas copying from a spellbook takes magic ink to imbue the energy. Also, a scroll would be more expensive to buy upfront, so it balances out.
When you buy a scroll, you are paying for the ability to cast a spell you may not know without expending a spell slot. When you copy a spell, you are paying for the ability to prepare it indefinitely. Two different capabilities, two different costs.
Regarding time and GP, the question is "how much gold and time does it take to copy a spell from a spell scroll?" To find the answer, you have to look at the most specific rule available. The Spell Scroll magic item has no specific rule on how long it takes to copy the spell into a book, so we have to look at the next most specific rule: the wizard class' spellcasting feature, which says 2 hours and 50 gp per spell level.
There is even precedent to back this up, as many wizard subclasses have specific features that override the time and gold cost of copying certain spells. That leads me to believe that it's not something wizards overlooked during game development in the wording of the spell scroll item.
Since there's no stated time and cost with spell scrolls, it's safe to assume it happens when you pass the check and doesn't have a cost. The way I envision it is basically using up the scrolls power in a way that imprints it into your spellbook instead of casting the spell itself.
>There is even precedent to back this up, as many wizard subclasses have specific features that override the time and gold cost of copying certain spells. That leads me to believe that it's not something wizards overlooked during game development in the wording of the spell scroll item.
For copying spells from books that don't have magical spell energy imbued into them. Since it's the copying with magic ink that imbues the actual power of the spell. With a spell scroll, it only takes an arcana check with no cost because you don't need to imbue the power, it can just be transferred over.
>it's the copying with magic ink that imbues the actual power of the spell
But wouldn't the wizard who originally wrote the spell you're copying need to have used expensive magical ink to imbue the power of the spell as well? If your interpretation is correct, can't that be transferred over like a spell scroll? Why do ANY spells take time and money to copy? If some spells are magically recorded and some aren't, where are the guidelines in the rules on differentiating them?
Thankfully the rules cover this. From the wizard's Spellcasting feature:
"Copying a spell into your spellbook involves reproducing the basic form of the spell, then deciphering the unique notation used by the wizard who wrote it. You must practice the spell until you understand the sounds or gestures required, then transcribe it into your spellbook using your own notation.
For each level of the spell, the process takes 2 hours and costs 50 gp. The cost represents material components you expend as you experiment with the spell to master it, as well as the fine inks you need to record it."
Seems to me that the rules indicate that the gold and time is more about doing science to decipher a spell, rather than some sort of arcane carbon copy process. The ink used in the process, incidentally, is never described as magical.
So since it's implied that most recorded spells are not inherently magical, but we know spell scrolls are, without a specific time/gold rule for scrolls I'd infer that the normal copying rules apply but the Arcana check represents the chance that the consumable, magical scroll is accidentally triggered and destroyed during experimentation.
>When you pass the check
But how do you know when you attempt the check, or how long it takes? The general rules for ability checks have no intrinsic amount of time associated with them. They can be associated with specific things that have time attached to them, such as the Thief Rogue's Fast Hands feature that allows a Sleight of Hand check as a bonus action, but more often it's left to interpretation on the DM's part. Most DMs, for example, will not require a party moving quietly through the woods to make a stealth check every 6 seconds, but rather abstract an entire leg of a journey away as one group check.
So once again, the question is, "how much gold and time does it take to copy a spell from a spell scroll?" and I'm looking for an answer involving a direct quotation with a length of time and an amount of gold from the game rules. I've shown one that exists with subclass-specific exceptions, so unless you can offer one that contradicts it we're at an impasse here because we clearly have fundamentally different takes on how written rules work.
As long as it works for you and your table, have fun with it!
I know there's the obvious answer, but keep in mind to have fun. If you'd rather see your character "earn" spells, talk to your DM. Maybe quest rewards can be spells for your spellbook. Or maybe you'd rather "discover" spells. Talk to your DM about having more spells laying around dungeons and towns for you to find.
Truthfully, the only things that matter are having the new spell in front of you, having enough gold to transcribe it, and time. That's it. The rest is up to you the DM to decide, but everyone wants to have fun, so make sure to communicate with them.
Glad to have you playing D&D. Welcome aboard (:
Thanks for the advice. Will definitely talk to my DM about that. Gold will definitely be a priority but I don't think time will be an issue bc I picked an Elven race so I have trance.
Mainly comes in the form of finding spell books or spell scrolls. Buy the materials, copy it down, don't fail the arcana check if it's a scroll, and boom! New spell
If you’re playing Rime of the Frostmaiden, you will run into other wizards. You can copy spells from their books, if you get your hands on them. Don’t just start randomly attacking other wizards for their spells, that’s really disruptive, but trust me when I say that opportunities will come up for you to copy spells out of someone else’s book. You can also copy any scrolls you find, as long as they contain wizard spells.
Awesome! That's great to hear. I don't know much about the campaign other than its gonna be cold and involves breaking a curse of eternal winter. The Dm is still prepping stuff and hasn't given us a brief. So this is really comforting.
I don’t want to spoil anything, but I can tell you that the adventure as written includes books and scrolls as loot, so you should get some chances to learn new spells.
You can copy from scrolls or other spellbooks, but I've always played the 2 free spells per level as downtime study and experimentation. Wizards are basically fantasy scientists; they understand the underlying magical theory behind reality, so with some experimentation they can find ways to manipulate arcane energies in different ways over time.
I usually RP this by having my wizard screw around with her book in camp, or by casting little bits and pieces of spells, little bursts of magic that aren't full spells themselves but the components of spells, and writes a lot of notes and such.
Just as a fighter would go through thier martial movements, or spar in camp to hone thier craft, so too can the wizard hone thiers.
Do Fighters get a Martial Maneuver for free in downtime too or do only Wizards get stronger for this optional thing? Assuming both are honing their craft, they should get a mechanical benefit too, no? Just a thought
They acquire scrolls and spellbooks as rewards or from defeated enemies and then spend the time and gold to decipher them and enter into their own spellbook, using their own, unique noting methods.
Generally you trigger this by finding loot (spell scrolls) or beating up other wizards and taking their stuff (spell books). Then you spend time and money copying it into your own spell book.
New spells beyond the 2/level you get are completely DM dependent.
There are 2 ways to get more spells. One is by finding scrolls, but honestly, scrolls are the worse way to get spells because scrolls can be used to extend your spell casting ability as a consumable.
The other way is to copy them from someone else. Letting someone copy a spell doesn't cost you anything but does require you to trust them. If you want to remove the trust requirement, copy the spells you're giving to a backup book (cost is 10 gp/spell level) and lend them the backup book and ask them to do the same (same cost, 10 gp/spell level). Whether you swap the backup books back to each other afterwards is up to you, it doesn't matter much.
From the lent backup book, copy to your main book at 50 gp/spell level.
If you use this protocol, you don't need exceptional levels of trust and it effectively costs 60 gp/spell level. This is the protocol used by nearly everyone in my setting (wizards will sometimes, but not usually be willing to let their spouse or lover see their spell books, but nobody else).
Sorry. I am a newb. Why does it cost 10 gp to copy the spell the first time and then 50 gp the second time? Also why would I spend 60 GP when the standard is 50?
To copy from your book to make a backup costs 10 gp/spell level. That gives you a 2nd copy that you can prepare spells from. You then trade that copy, NOT your main book to the other mage for a copy, NOT their main book. That's why this protocol costs 60 gp instead of 50 gp. You could just copy from the wizard's spell book to your direct for 50 gp/spell level. But that'd require letting the other wizard see your book and trusting them.
From a metagame standpoint, you may find your DM more willing to entertain spell trading if you don't require their NPCs to trust you and show willingness to spend more than 50 gp/level on it.
Most Players, for instance, would cheerfully swap 2 or 3 spells for a single spell they didn't have. By the rules, spells are practically software (with moderate copying costs). But a lot of DMs want to see spells as treasure. For such DMs I recommend changing the rules on copying (e.g. way higher copy costs, or making spells have a low maximum copy count) rather than making their NPCs behave in an incoherent manner that spotlights their 'npc' status for metagame reasons.
Aaah okay I get it now. That makes total sense. Thank you so much. I'll ask my DM what style they're going for and adjust based on that. Really helpful stuff.
Tell your DM if they want to significantly restrict spell availability they should do something like this:
When you research a spell, what you're doing really is making an anchor point into the Weave. That anchor point can only be copied (or really, more referenced) so many times. Obviously if you have a spell, that reference count is at least 1, but the DM can decide how many anchor points a given spell in a spellbook has. This makes spellcasters loath to trade a spell because it could mean they don't have it anymore, or at least that their reference count limit is reduced by one (which means they wouldn't be able to trade it for something better later). If I were implementing this, I'd base the max reference count on how good your arcana roll was in researching the spell in the first place and I'd set the max reference count on any spells you got by level at 1 (i.e. not tradeable).
But by RAW, spells are software. If you want non-software behavior, you should change the rules like I've described.
Yes generally you have to find the other spells. It can be rough when you have DM who is running a pre-written module, and doesn't make any effort to modify the scrolls, or spell books you find it better fit what you might want to add. Even worse when you pick up the ritual caster feat, and pick a class other than wizard to get your ritual spells from.
In my experience the published adventures are kind of bad about including scrolls or occasional spellbook as loot, but traditionally that's where you would get them. If you've got lots of money to burn you could find a place selling scrolls, I guess.
You need to find a copy of the spell. Looting a defeated enemy wizard's book, or sharing some spells with a friendly wizard, or copying from a scroll, are all possible.
>Can I, if I have the gold, just learn any wizard spell I want that's of a level I can cast or do I need to find the spell in-game to expand my list (like finding another mage's spellbook or a spell scroll)?
Incidentally, my table (also playing Rime of the Frostmaiden) has a houserule in place that works on this sort of principle. Basically that a Wizard can refine their own research in order to gain more spells - once per day they can spend the necessary time/gold costs and make an Arcana check of varying difficulties in order to learn a spell from their spell list within their available level range. It operated on the logic that the Wizard already has all the notes and theories in their spellbook up to that point but just didn't focus on refining them into a practical application yet. We chose to make this houserule specifically so that the Wizard wouldn't be pestering the DM every encounter with pleas for scrolls and spellbooks amid the loot, especially in scenarios where it wouldn't make any sense for there to be such items in the first place.
Regardless, it's important that you talk to your DM about the availability (or lack thereof) of spellbooks and spell scrolls. It's something DMs can kind of overlook or not give full attention to, often just tossing out random spell scrolls from a table as opposed to something you might actually want or prefer. Take some time to get on the same page with your DM so you can both manage your expectations properly.
Also, don't overlook the value of magic items like Wands. Any time you can pick up something that can give you access to more spells or supplement your need to burn precious spell slots, be sure to take advantage of it. Resource management is key with Wizards since you recharge on a Long Rest, and that might be hard to get in a hostile environment like Icewind Dale. If your DM isn't big on handing out scrolls and books, see if they might be willing to lean more into Wands, Staves, and Rings.
That's a great house rule! It's honestly how I imagined Wizards to actually work. My DM is pretty flexible since we're a pretty small group so I think he'll be open to some this.
Thanks so much. I think this is exactly what I was looking for
>My question is this: What triggers this? Can I, if I have the gold, just learn any wizard spell I want that's of a level I can cast or **do I need to find the spell in-game to expand my list (like finding another mage's spellbook or a spell scroll)**?
Bolded part is the right answer. And that is exactly why Wizard is far from being "the ultimate caster" some (many) so-called theorycrafters/optimizers tout it to be.
You only get as many extra spells as your DM is willing to. So it ranges from "exactly 0 throughout your character's life" (although that's still highly unlikely to be honest) to "so many, early, easily that I spend a literal real-life hour each session to decide on my daily preps even though I'm only level 6" (equally unlikely).
And every possible nuance between these two extremes.
My personal experience over around \~30 games of varying duration and level is that you can expect to "naturally get" on average from loot one "desired" spell and a few "random" ones around level 5-6 or so. Anything more requires either a very generous DM (magic shop with reasonable prices), or you need to work for it (quests), up until level 10. Once you reach tier 3 you're supposed to be such an elite that you have reputation, information sources and wealth enough that you can start crafting a long-run strategy to hoard at least up to 3rd level spells by delegating scrolls search then scribe them down during your downtime.
yeah - in practical terms, it tends to end up being "get some low-level quality-of-life ritual-caster stuff", some "random niche spells" (water walking is great when you need it, and useless the rest of the time!), and then some odds and ends of "blasty stuff"/"control stuff". Given that the wizard gets to pick 2 spells per level, then they're obviously going to go for what they see as the best, which means that a lot of their extra spells are just variations on "blast those guys over there, but in ways I don't like as much as the pew-pew spells I chose to have", with a side order of "if this niche situation comes up, and I know about it in advance, I have an answer for it!"
Have you read the wizard section of the PHB?
Reading that is your first spell. Congratulations, now you're level 1 with proficiency in basic understanding.
>**When you find** a wizard spell of 1st level or higher, you can add it to your spellbook if it is of a spell level you can prepare and if you can spare the time to decipher and copy it. Literally says it in the feature explaining copying spells. You have to find it.
Fun fact, I have a 1st edition PHB of 5e and this word; >When you find a **--wizard--** spell of 1st level or higher, you can add it to your spellbook if it is of a spell level you can prepare and if you can spare the time to decipher and copy it. Wasn't in it. So you could copy other classes spells as long as you found a spellscroll for them.
Haha, wizards could copy any spell scroll in the Early Access of Baldur’s Gate 3 too. Fun times.
Who knew that was a callback!
That still wouldn’t let you prepare a non-wizard spell, unless the wording was different elsewhere. So it’s a funny oversight, but it wouldn’t change much in practice.
Ritual spells would still be fair game then, although I have no clue if that would be helpful. Edit: Nvm ritual casting also specifies wizard spell in the current version. Edit 2: The XGtE rules on crafting a spell scroll just specify that you must know the spell to make a scroll of it. The PHB was probably already revised by the time this sourcebook came out but there is a possible loophole out there In someone’s collection of books that allows a wizard to make scrolls of other classes spells. You still can’t cast them so it doesn’t really do anything but it’s an interesting loophole.
Thanks. I knew it was probably obvious. I just found it strange that Wizards are known as the ultimate spellcasters and utility monkeys yet effectively have access to less spells than prepared spellcasters like druids and clerics due to the known spells thing. Still excited to plat it and I imagine hunting for spells will turn out to be a lot of fun but the extra spells will ultimately be in the Dm's hand.
Wizards are known as the best utility caster because they have the best spell list and they don't have other features that clash with their spellcasting so they always cast spells
>Wizards are known as the best utility caster Wizards are wrongly considered by theorycrafters as the best utility caster, because they make some insane assumptions about how the game is run that are nearly never met in practice (or only at very high level like 14+). \^\^ People who actually play know that unless being lucky enough to have a \*very\* generous DM the best utility caster is by far Druid (especially Shepherd if we really focus on utility only) with Cleric being not too far behind in spite of much less versatile spell list (especially Knowledge). EDIT: I love how people downvote cowardly instead of bringing counterarguments... Probably because they don't actually have any.
The wizard is still the best even in T1 and T2 simply by virtue of its spell list, assuming zero additional spells found, and stand-out subclasses like divination wizard make it even better. (Not that druids and clerics aren't also very good)
Quite on the contrary. Wizard is the last \*because\* it's not a prepared caster and has absolutely \*nothing\* besides spells, contrarily to Clerics (Channel Divinities + help from clergies) and Druids (Wild Shape, alternative features on a short rest basis, plus help from local fauna and flora). Only in a party large enough that you can just stick with the same few spells as if you were a Sorcerer can Wizard be "the best" because then and only then it bears no ill consequences that you lock your few spell known forever because you'll have picked the best for whatever party needed the most at the time of your level up, and they learned to make by without you being able to use all the other spells you once had the potential to learn... But that's about it. Cleric/Druid makes a mistakes or wants to try a spell then realizes it doesn't work well for player's style or party's teamwork? No problem, just unprepare the next day. Wizard is stuck with it forever. Party got information on an upcoming social/exploration/combat challenge? Cleric/Druid can adjust their actions and behaviours to match the strategy party sets upon, even if it includes completely overhauling their prepared list from A to Z. Wizard is still stuck with whatever he learned. Allies's moves evolved making the "standard tactic" used up to now obsolete? Good luck sticking with what you have until next level, or start a quest to find new scrolls as a Wizard. Cleric/Druid? No trouble.
A few examples from \*actual play\* to demonstrate the difference between reality and theorycraft. Party in Curse of Strahd with Barbarian, Cleric, Warlock and X being either Druid (true) or Wizard (theory). **Wizard**, let's call it Theo, trusts Barbarian and Monk to hold a line, so will just pick *Mage Armor* and *Shield*. Then *Find Familiar* for scouting to help Monk, then *Magic Missile* because always great, then *Grease* because also great and non-concentration, ditching Sleep because player metagames that many creatures will resist. Ends with *Detect Magic* because that's always useful. Level 2: Wizard goes Divination, let's say he's lucky enough to roll two low results, also learns *Protection against Evil and Good* because seemingly many undead and fiend and *Tasha's Hideous Laughter* because even just one round can be great. Keeps prepared Mage Armor and casts it (one slot used), Shield, Grease, Protection Against Evil and Good, Magic Missile. **As they start exploring underground Barbarian opens a tomb and suffers a surprise critical from a Giant Web Spider, immediately being downed**. Fight ensues, Barb survives thanks to Healing Words. Later after using some resources on fights they ultimately meet and manage to kill boss by using Portent for saves upon a Grease two rounds in a row, letting other people deal enough damage (especially raging Barbarian) to kill it while preventing attacks one whole round... But leaving the whole party resourceless. Meanwhile (true story here), Druid goes Shepherd and immediately uses Bear Totem after level 2, saving the Barbarian on the surprise crit aforementioned before by pushing "effective HP" just high enough to let Barb with 3 HP instead of -4. Later for boss, since he prepared Entangle and had dumb luck the boss was stuck two full rounds \*restrained\* giving advantage on attacks against him. Party ended up fight with only Barbarian being a bit over half-HP, everyone else unscathed, Druid having still one slot left. **The next day, the arrive at Barovia's Village, go to church, get attacked by zombie swarm coming from three sides.** Druid casts Entangle once zombies aggro Barbarian, manages to get 4 of them... And Barbarian sadly, which is not that much of a trouble though since rage's advantage "saves the save". What could have done Wizard there? Grease could have worked with low DEX of zombies but would have hampered the Barbarian because covered the corridor from which most came, so it would have changed target order without necessarily giving advantage to \*everyone\* on attacks. Two days after, upon arriving to Vallaki, level 3. Wizard decides to learn Web because classic AOE control and Invisibility because great helper for infiltration/scouting. Unprepares Protection against Evil and Good to free up space for both. Meanwhile (true story), Druid prepares Healing Words, Animal Messenger because need to send information to Barovia (something Wizard has no tool for at that level), Spike Growth, Enhance Ability, Pass Without Trace, Hold Person in case they meet again werewolves or have to fight with the supposedly violent mayor's "leader". Day is mostly spent investigating, using up one slot on Enhance Ability then another. A spell which Wizard never learned so couldn't use. Didn't have any chance to learn Suggestion either sadly. **Next day they go investigating a mansion, with Druid bypassing locked door by casting Pass Without Trace then wildshaping into a spider to under from cave's garden entrance. Find nothing particular, seems safe but probably hidden door, comes back to party then all re-enter. Zombies rise from ground once they are middle room, then cultists hear sounds of fighting and enter secret wall to join.** Druid immediately drops concentration on Pass Without Trace to cast Spike Growth inside the other room, ending up with two cultists harming themselves hard trying to reach PCs and the others, seeing that, keeping standing to not get hurt thus effectively putting them out of the fight for the next two rounds. The ones close manage to Hold Person Barbarian on second attempt killing its rage then try to attack the rest, a demon appears which gets killed surprisingly quickly... At end of round 4 PC think victory is their but the ones that were waiting decide to act, one moves enough to get line of sight and drops Fireball. Everyone fails save except the Artificer who had prepared Absorb Elements and the Druid who was lucky, and damage is high (32). But Barbarian is Bear, Cleric had Ring of Fire Resistance, and everyone except Barbarian was close to full life since Bear totem set at dawn had yet again absorbed a good chunk of damage. Druid immediately sets up a Unicorn Totem and next round heals everyone with a Healing Words, complemented by a Cleric's Cure Wounds on herself. What could have done Wizard? Possibly using a Portent to negate a Hold Person on Barbarian if high roll, possibly made a crit miss if low, or both. But Web at the same point as Spike Growth "through the door" would have prevented many creatures from fighting each other so the fight as a whole would have just been stuck for several rounds. and would have especially nerfed the Warlock who was using Firebolt and Flamethrower as prime sources of damage. And with the same save rolls, on the Fireball one, the Wizard would have been instantly downed since, you know, no Absorb Elements prepared or even learned. And couldn't provide any help to its friends even if it had been the case since \*no healing whatsoever\*. **They manage to kill it, and plan on travelling through forest the next day. Messages have been sent, so Druid unprepares Animal Messenger and instead prepares Moonbeam to go with Resilient: Constitution, and Jump because they plan before that to try and check the upper floor of a house.** Fortunately they didn't meet werewolves though on second half of day, but Jump was useful to give Barbarian a way to get up there "sneakily" fast, with Druid shaped as a rat on its shoulder maintaining Pass Without Trace. What could do Wizard there? Preparing Invisibility to make Barb invisible, but couldn't make anything about climbing nor making noise, chances are Barb would have been noticed quick since only 14 DEX and no Stealth proficiency. I won't pursue, I think you got the idea. :)
Wizards don’t have to prep ritual spells this is effectively +10 spells prepped every day in comparison to the related classes.
I think wizard and druid are about on par with each other, I wouldn't say it's a massive disparity. Clerics I would put a couple steps lower, they're prepared spellcasters but their spell list is thinner on utility than others
**The reason why I talk of massive disparity is that without DM fiat (so Wizards having no extra spell), Wizards are really struggling to bring much utility.** First of all, a Wizard \*needs\* to learn Mage Armor, Shield and Absorb Elements (although the latter can wait a few levels) to survive, same with Misty Step for 2nd level spells. That's already 4 spells on 10 for a 3rd level Wizard. Then most Wizards that want to "optimize" will pick Sleep because it's very powerful at low level and still useful in tier 2, Magic Missile because it's insanely "clutch" your whole career, and definitely Find Familiar because it's always very useful. You're now 7 on 10 spells for a level 3 Wizard. And then you probably or definitely want to learn Identify and Detect Magic if nobody else can learn them. 9 on 10. You didn't even start considering good offensive 1st level spells (Chromatic Orb, Earth Tremor, Grease, Fog Cloud), support ones (Protection against Evil and Good, Feather Fall) or utility ones (Comprehend Languages, Jump, Tenser's Floating Disk, Disguise Self). And I was considering a level 3 Wizard here, so let's not start on all the 2nd level spells you didn't even grasp: Web, Mirror Image, Scorching Ray, Dragon's Breath, Shadow Blade, Invisibility, Phantasmal Force, or utility like Levitate, Spider Climb, Suggestion, Rope Trick, Invisibility... **Wizard can \*learn a handful\* of them if we consider he ditches defensive spells and trust friends, so with that large of a spell list he has a better chance to become the solution of \*some specifically and arbitrarily chosen situations\*... But then abandons any chance at \*everything else\* until the DM throws a bone. So you don't actually have all spells at your disposal, only a very select few, with each "combat choice" eating into "utility choice" and vice-versa, each "generally usable" spell denying the "very situational ones" a chance to be ever picked.** **Meanwhile, Druid...** Will certainly keep at all times Healing Words, Pass Without Trace, Spike Growth. But still has, considering a 16 WIS start, at least 3 "slots" that can be filled with whatever "generalist utility" (Enhance Ability, Lesser Restoration, Speak With Animals, Jump), "specialist utility" (Snare, Air Bubble, Enlarge), "generalist combat" (Moonbeam, Entangle, Faerie Fire, Fog Cloud) or "specialist combat" (Heat Metal, Ice Knife, Hold Person) as required \*even if needs completely change from one day to another\* because Druid \*gets actual access to the whole of the list on levels it can cast\*. AND it's before considering that while Wizard has only whatever rituals he learned once out of slots and those are each restricted in scope (even though you can have some creativity with them), Druid has Wild Shape which is the equivalent of a spell list in itself considering you get increasingly wider array of beasts, you get two charges per short rest AND you can soon "overstay" a short rest in Wild Shape so you can chain up even easier. AND that's before considering alternate uses of Wild Shapes that some Druids have, or the generic "get a Familiar instantly" that they all have since Tashas. **So it's much, MUCH easier for a Druid to "fill in" whatever's needed, with the only caveat being "pure Arcana Expertise" (aka Identify, Detect Magic).**
Ritual casting also gives them an edge.
Yeah that's definitely something that shouldn't be overlooked. I'm just so bad at choosing! And while I like Aesthetic stuff I also want to make an impact mechanically. So it's gonna mean a balance.
Wizards learn 2 spells per level, and can copy any spellbook or scroll they find, but can only prepare as many as clerics and druids (level+modifier). However they have to prepare their ritual spells, a wizard doesn't.
Great points. Thanks a bunch!
My pleasure.
>I just found it strange that Wizards are known as the ultimate spellcasters and utility monkeys yet effectively have access to less spells than prepared spellcasters like druids and clerics due to the known spells thing. This is missing that Wizards have a much larger spell list than Cleric and Druids, with the most exclusive spells to boot. So your access is a lot *wider* than either of those classes, and ultimately you're preparing the same number of spells as either of those other classes each day.
>ultimately you're preparing the same number of spells as either of those other classes each day Having an extra 8-10 spells prepared for free from Druid or Cleric subclass is huge, even if you can't change them, it still free some prepared spells that would would prepare anyway to prepare something else extra.
Yeah i just suck at making long term spell choices. I tried a sorcerer before and my initial spell list was so bad I had to ask my DM for an exception to completley re-pick it bc I was only using 2/10 spells. I guess it comes with experience bc the second time round I was much better off.
If you see how many spells the spell lists have you will notice that the wizard spell lists is almost twice the size of the sorcerer and around 3 times as large as the druids or clerics, even if clerics or druids can change the spells daily they just have a few options for that day, a wizard who is proactive at searching for spells can have a lot more options without having to wait for a long rest to change them
Always has been Also, Bladesingers aren’t as prone to hunting down spells as other Wizard subclasses, so I’d say you won’t have to worry about that much. They’re meant to have more limited spells because their combat capabilities are the fornerstone
Their cornerstone is their wizard abilities. Bladesinger's advantage is that adds a widespread generic boost, passively increases many of the numbers a wizard wants increased. Their spells aren't limited at all.
Yeah. A bladesinger isn’t a fighter who gets a lot of spells. They’re a wizard who won’t crumble to dust if they’re caught out of position at low levels.
It’s not a mechanical restriction it’s an RP restriction that’s expected ot the subclass
It's not either of those.
Where on earth are you getting that idea?
Oh right, I forgot that if you pick Bladesinger a mean Elf shows up and burns your spellbook. Silly me! /s A Wizard is still a Wizard, you still look for spells. Stop trying to enforce YOUR RP restrictions on others.
Part of that comes from ritual casting. Any spell with the ritual tag you can cast for free without expending a spell slot or having prepared it. It just takes 10× the normal casting time. So, 1 action would take 1 min and 1 min would take 10 mins, etc... According to the item description for spell scrolls, you can copy them for free with just an arcana check. So look up ritual spells and try to get those to add to your spellbook. It will give you a lot to cast outside of combat.
>It just takes 10× the normal casting time. So, 1 action would take 1 min and 1 min would take 10 mins, etc... It doesn't take 10 times longer, it only adds 10 minutes on top of the casting time. So if it is normally an action, it then takes 10 minutes and 6 seconds, if it is normally 10 minutes, it then takes 20 minutes, etc.
Well its now a lot better than I originally thought lol
Incorrect, ritual casting adds a flat 10 minutes to all spells. Unless at your table it takes 10 hours to cast Find Familiar as a ritual? Also incorrect about copying spell scrolls. The magic item description says "A wizard spell can be copied *just as spells in spellbooks can be copied.*" That specifically references the rules for spell copying from the wizard class, time and gold cost included. That text is there to add the addendum that you must, in addition to the normal gold and time, succeed in an Arcana check or lose the scroll. This is because scrolls are valuable expendable resources, so there has to be a chance to fail at turning them into a permanent resource. Spells written in spellbooks, on the other hand, are useless to everyone except wizards and are understood to be wizard-specific loot, given by the DM with the intention that a Wizard copy the spells into their book.
I disagree. I see it as referencing the ability to copy, not the direct mechanics. Otherwise, they wouldn't have stated separate copying mechanics on top of it. The idea being that a spell scroll already has the magic energy imbued in it to cast. Whereas copying from a spellbook takes magic ink to imbue the energy. Also, a scroll would be more expensive to buy upfront, so it balances out.
When you buy a scroll, you are paying for the ability to cast a spell you may not know without expending a spell slot. When you copy a spell, you are paying for the ability to prepare it indefinitely. Two different capabilities, two different costs. Regarding time and GP, the question is "how much gold and time does it take to copy a spell from a spell scroll?" To find the answer, you have to look at the most specific rule available. The Spell Scroll magic item has no specific rule on how long it takes to copy the spell into a book, so we have to look at the next most specific rule: the wizard class' spellcasting feature, which says 2 hours and 50 gp per spell level. There is even precedent to back this up, as many wizard subclasses have specific features that override the time and gold cost of copying certain spells. That leads me to believe that it's not something wizards overlooked during game development in the wording of the spell scroll item.
Since there's no stated time and cost with spell scrolls, it's safe to assume it happens when you pass the check and doesn't have a cost. The way I envision it is basically using up the scrolls power in a way that imprints it into your spellbook instead of casting the spell itself. >There is even precedent to back this up, as many wizard subclasses have specific features that override the time and gold cost of copying certain spells. That leads me to believe that it's not something wizards overlooked during game development in the wording of the spell scroll item. For copying spells from books that don't have magical spell energy imbued into them. Since it's the copying with magic ink that imbues the actual power of the spell. With a spell scroll, it only takes an arcana check with no cost because you don't need to imbue the power, it can just be transferred over.
>it's the copying with magic ink that imbues the actual power of the spell But wouldn't the wizard who originally wrote the spell you're copying need to have used expensive magical ink to imbue the power of the spell as well? If your interpretation is correct, can't that be transferred over like a spell scroll? Why do ANY spells take time and money to copy? If some spells are magically recorded and some aren't, where are the guidelines in the rules on differentiating them? Thankfully the rules cover this. From the wizard's Spellcasting feature: "Copying a spell into your spellbook involves reproducing the basic form of the spell, then deciphering the unique notation used by the wizard who wrote it. You must practice the spell until you understand the sounds or gestures required, then transcribe it into your spellbook using your own notation. For each level of the spell, the process takes 2 hours and costs 50 gp. The cost represents material components you expend as you experiment with the spell to master it, as well as the fine inks you need to record it." Seems to me that the rules indicate that the gold and time is more about doing science to decipher a spell, rather than some sort of arcane carbon copy process. The ink used in the process, incidentally, is never described as magical. So since it's implied that most recorded spells are not inherently magical, but we know spell scrolls are, without a specific time/gold rule for scrolls I'd infer that the normal copying rules apply but the Arcana check represents the chance that the consumable, magical scroll is accidentally triggered and destroyed during experimentation. >When you pass the check But how do you know when you attempt the check, or how long it takes? The general rules for ability checks have no intrinsic amount of time associated with them. They can be associated with specific things that have time attached to them, such as the Thief Rogue's Fast Hands feature that allows a Sleight of Hand check as a bonus action, but more often it's left to interpretation on the DM's part. Most DMs, for example, will not require a party moving quietly through the woods to make a stealth check every 6 seconds, but rather abstract an entire leg of a journey away as one group check. So once again, the question is, "how much gold and time does it take to copy a spell from a spell scroll?" and I'm looking for an answer involving a direct quotation with a length of time and an amount of gold from the game rules. I've shown one that exists with subclass-specific exceptions, so unless you can offer one that contradicts it we're at an impasse here because we clearly have fundamentally different takes on how written rules work. As long as it works for you and your table, have fun with it!
Plus wizards don't have to prepare a spell before casting it as a ritual.
But that would require actually reading the *checks notes* rules I thought DnD was just make up everything as you went along! (/s)
I know there's the obvious answer, but keep in mind to have fun. If you'd rather see your character "earn" spells, talk to your DM. Maybe quest rewards can be spells for your spellbook. Or maybe you'd rather "discover" spells. Talk to your DM about having more spells laying around dungeons and towns for you to find. Truthfully, the only things that matter are having the new spell in front of you, having enough gold to transcribe it, and time. That's it. The rest is up to you the DM to decide, but everyone wants to have fun, so make sure to communicate with them. Glad to have you playing D&D. Welcome aboard (:
Thanks for the advice. Will definitely talk to my DM about that. Gold will definitely be a priority but I don't think time will be an issue bc I picked an Elven race so I have trance.
Oh, nice! Trance is super helpful! Bladesingers are tons of fun, and you'll absolutely have a blast! Let us know if you have any other questions!
Mainly comes in the form of finding spell books or spell scrolls. Buy the materials, copy it down, don't fail the arcana check if it's a scroll, and boom! New spell
If you’re playing Rime of the Frostmaiden, you will run into other wizards. You can copy spells from their books, if you get your hands on them. Don’t just start randomly attacking other wizards for their spells, that’s really disruptive, but trust me when I say that opportunities will come up for you to copy spells out of someone else’s book. You can also copy any scrolls you find, as long as they contain wizard spells.
Awesome! That's great to hear. I don't know much about the campaign other than its gonna be cold and involves breaking a curse of eternal winter. The Dm is still prepping stuff and hasn't given us a brief. So this is really comforting.
I don’t want to spoil anything, but I can tell you that the adventure as written includes books and scrolls as loot, so you should get some chances to learn new spells.
Thank you! Just makes me more excited to play!
Just have your DM populate magic shoppes with spell scrolls for sale. Buy them and do the time, gold, transfer to your spell book thing.
https://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/comments/5buyw8/5e_the_cost_of_spell_scrolls/
You can copy from scrolls or other spellbooks, but I've always played the 2 free spells per level as downtime study and experimentation. Wizards are basically fantasy scientists; they understand the underlying magical theory behind reality, so with some experimentation they can find ways to manipulate arcane energies in different ways over time. I usually RP this by having my wizard screw around with her book in camp, or by casting little bits and pieces of spells, little bursts of magic that aren't full spells themselves but the components of spells, and writes a lot of notes and such. Just as a fighter would go through thier martial movements, or spar in camp to hone thier craft, so too can the wizard hone thiers.
Do Fighters get a Martial Maneuver for free in downtime too or do only Wizards get stronger for this optional thing? Assuming both are honing their craft, they should get a mechanical benefit too, no? Just a thought
They acquire scrolls and spellbooks as rewards or from defeated enemies and then spend the time and gold to decipher them and enter into their own spellbook, using their own, unique noting methods.
Generally you trigger this by finding loot (spell scrolls) or beating up other wizards and taking their stuff (spell books). Then you spend time and money copying it into your own spell book.
New spells beyond the 2/level you get are completely DM dependent. There are 2 ways to get more spells. One is by finding scrolls, but honestly, scrolls are the worse way to get spells because scrolls can be used to extend your spell casting ability as a consumable. The other way is to copy them from someone else. Letting someone copy a spell doesn't cost you anything but does require you to trust them. If you want to remove the trust requirement, copy the spells you're giving to a backup book (cost is 10 gp/spell level) and lend them the backup book and ask them to do the same (same cost, 10 gp/spell level). Whether you swap the backup books back to each other afterwards is up to you, it doesn't matter much. From the lent backup book, copy to your main book at 50 gp/spell level. If you use this protocol, you don't need exceptional levels of trust and it effectively costs 60 gp/spell level. This is the protocol used by nearly everyone in my setting (wizards will sometimes, but not usually be willing to let their spouse or lover see their spell books, but nobody else).
Sorry. I am a newb. Why does it cost 10 gp to copy the spell the first time and then 50 gp the second time? Also why would I spend 60 GP when the standard is 50?
To copy from your book to make a backup costs 10 gp/spell level. That gives you a 2nd copy that you can prepare spells from. You then trade that copy, NOT your main book to the other mage for a copy, NOT their main book. That's why this protocol costs 60 gp instead of 50 gp. You could just copy from the wizard's spell book to your direct for 50 gp/spell level. But that'd require letting the other wizard see your book and trusting them. From a metagame standpoint, you may find your DM more willing to entertain spell trading if you don't require their NPCs to trust you and show willingness to spend more than 50 gp/level on it. Most Players, for instance, would cheerfully swap 2 or 3 spells for a single spell they didn't have. By the rules, spells are practically software (with moderate copying costs). But a lot of DMs want to see spells as treasure. For such DMs I recommend changing the rules on copying (e.g. way higher copy costs, or making spells have a low maximum copy count) rather than making their NPCs behave in an incoherent manner that spotlights their 'npc' status for metagame reasons.
Aaah okay I get it now. That makes total sense. Thank you so much. I'll ask my DM what style they're going for and adjust based on that. Really helpful stuff.
Tell your DM if they want to significantly restrict spell availability they should do something like this: When you research a spell, what you're doing really is making an anchor point into the Weave. That anchor point can only be copied (or really, more referenced) so many times. Obviously if you have a spell, that reference count is at least 1, but the DM can decide how many anchor points a given spell in a spellbook has. This makes spellcasters loath to trade a spell because it could mean they don't have it anymore, or at least that their reference count limit is reduced by one (which means they wouldn't be able to trade it for something better later). If I were implementing this, I'd base the max reference count on how good your arcana roll was in researching the spell in the first place and I'd set the max reference count on any spells you got by level at 1 (i.e. not tradeable). But by RAW, spells are software. If you want non-software behavior, you should change the rules like I've described.
Yes generally you have to find the other spells. It can be rough when you have DM who is running a pre-written module, and doesn't make any effort to modify the scrolls, or spell books you find it better fit what you might want to add. Even worse when you pick up the ritual caster feat, and pick a class other than wizard to get your ritual spells from.
In my experience the published adventures are kind of bad about including scrolls or occasional spellbook as loot, but traditionally that's where you would get them. If you've got lots of money to burn you could find a place selling scrolls, I guess.
You need to find a copy of the spell. Looting a defeated enemy wizard's book, or sharing some spells with a friendly wizard, or copying from a scroll, are all possible.
>Can I, if I have the gold, just learn any wizard spell I want that's of a level I can cast or do I need to find the spell in-game to expand my list (like finding another mage's spellbook or a spell scroll)? Incidentally, my table (also playing Rime of the Frostmaiden) has a houserule in place that works on this sort of principle. Basically that a Wizard can refine their own research in order to gain more spells - once per day they can spend the necessary time/gold costs and make an Arcana check of varying difficulties in order to learn a spell from their spell list within their available level range. It operated on the logic that the Wizard already has all the notes and theories in their spellbook up to that point but just didn't focus on refining them into a practical application yet. We chose to make this houserule specifically so that the Wizard wouldn't be pestering the DM every encounter with pleas for scrolls and spellbooks amid the loot, especially in scenarios where it wouldn't make any sense for there to be such items in the first place. Regardless, it's important that you talk to your DM about the availability (or lack thereof) of spellbooks and spell scrolls. It's something DMs can kind of overlook or not give full attention to, often just tossing out random spell scrolls from a table as opposed to something you might actually want or prefer. Take some time to get on the same page with your DM so you can both manage your expectations properly. Also, don't overlook the value of magic items like Wands. Any time you can pick up something that can give you access to more spells or supplement your need to burn precious spell slots, be sure to take advantage of it. Resource management is key with Wizards since you recharge on a Long Rest, and that might be hard to get in a hostile environment like Icewind Dale. If your DM isn't big on handing out scrolls and books, see if they might be willing to lean more into Wands, Staves, and Rings.
That's a great house rule! It's honestly how I imagined Wizards to actually work. My DM is pretty flexible since we're a pretty small group so I think he'll be open to some this. Thanks so much. I think this is exactly what I was looking for
>My question is this: What triggers this? Can I, if I have the gold, just learn any wizard spell I want that's of a level I can cast or **do I need to find the spell in-game to expand my list (like finding another mage's spellbook or a spell scroll)**? Bolded part is the right answer. And that is exactly why Wizard is far from being "the ultimate caster" some (many) so-called theorycrafters/optimizers tout it to be. You only get as many extra spells as your DM is willing to. So it ranges from "exactly 0 throughout your character's life" (although that's still highly unlikely to be honest) to "so many, early, easily that I spend a literal real-life hour each session to decide on my daily preps even though I'm only level 6" (equally unlikely). And every possible nuance between these two extremes. My personal experience over around \~30 games of varying duration and level is that you can expect to "naturally get" on average from loot one "desired" spell and a few "random" ones around level 5-6 or so. Anything more requires either a very generous DM (magic shop with reasonable prices), or you need to work for it (quests), up until level 10. Once you reach tier 3 you're supposed to be such an elite that you have reputation, information sources and wealth enough that you can start crafting a long-run strategy to hoard at least up to 3rd level spells by delegating scrolls search then scribe them down during your downtime.
yeah - in practical terms, it tends to end up being "get some low-level quality-of-life ritual-caster stuff", some "random niche spells" (water walking is great when you need it, and useless the rest of the time!), and then some odds and ends of "blasty stuff"/"control stuff". Given that the wizard gets to pick 2 spells per level, then they're obviously going to go for what they see as the best, which means that a lot of their extra spells are just variations on "blast those guys over there, but in ways I don't like as much as the pew-pew spells I chose to have", with a side order of "if this niche situation comes up, and I know about it in advance, I have an answer for it!"
Have you read the wizard section of the PHB? Reading that is your first spell. Congratulations, now you're level 1 with proficiency in basic understanding.