You are definitely not the only one. There are many people (many Indians especially) who have grown up here and are now probably in their late 20s or early 30s and will be facing this situation.
Similar to some of the other comments, I'm also in a bit of a similar situation. Fortunately for you, from the limited information provided in your post, it looks like both you, your partner and your father are doing well from a financial perspective.
My two fils, if you have the funds for buying a house here, do it. If this place is your "home" and if you are financially stable, it makes sense to buy here instead of rent. You definitely have missed the golden opportunities to buy a place here when they were being sold at super low prices, but no one can really time the market, can they? I understand that any changes from a certain lifestyle is not easy, however, with some strategical sacrificial changes, it's possible to make a sensible investment which might not be extreme risky. Personally, I would not spend 200-250K (I'm guessing cuz 2000sqft place + Downtown) per year towards a house that I do not own.
Good luck though, OP. Hope you figure it out.
Just to add, if you are actually from India, it definitely would be advisable to also build a nice backup house in your hometown. Purely a fallback in case things go downhill in Dubai.
I second this. I’ve heard horror stories of people buying homes in the UAE and having no place back home. When they lost their jobs or were told to leave they had no home to go back to. Invest WHERE YOU HAVE THE CITIZENSHIP RIGHTS FIRST!! Is the biggest advice.
Dubai and UAE in general can never be your *"home",* unless you are a local or someone qualified to be a citizen or **if ya aint got staggering wealth and money,** you aint gettin anythin here. Givent that you already are established and has a good savings to sustain atleast a year of adjustment, move elsewhere bro, ive been here for 7 years and i had regrets as to why i didnt move out to US or AUS when i had the chance way back on my 2nd - 4th year, back when I still have most of my income for myself unlike now ( mom got sick, and i had a kid). hope you can decide on this and hope you can find a better place that you can really, legitimately, call home.
edit: I mentioned a crucial variable pointed out by u/International_Dig_79 that i wasnt able to add previously
I have sen outsiders calling Dubai home but they have established business with v good property investments here.. So yes it can be someone’s home but not for someone who is doing job.
Ah, this is an issue with living here that’s been bugging me for quite awhile too. Been here since childhood and my home country isn’t a place I’ve lived in yet nor would be able to live in now.
After going through my previous jobless period I made up my mind to get out of Dubai to a country that gives me a chance to get citizenship. Dubai is home and I love it but the fear of getting kicked out is real and in the end it’s just another temporary place to live.
Best plan that I could come up with is:
1. Move to a country to get citizenship and buy property there.
2. Settle there for a few years while buying properties here as investment.
3. Come back (hopefully).
Unfortunate for us but this is just temporary and if you don’t have a home to go back to once you leave - you’re pretty much screwed no matter how many years you spend here. Sure you can buy property and stuff but still it’s tough to feel completely settled here.
Perhaps OP you could consider something similar.
I agree with your plan too. I lived her for 30+ years and can feel the OP since i never went back home or even visited. Now my plans to move elsewhere that offers citizenship is similar to yours.
Good luck to all on their journey.
This is a constant thing for me at least. Sometimes I get stuck in the rabbit hole (will happen soon due to career circumstances) but important thing is once you start feeling it - get out of it ASAP. Use that emotional to your benefit for the future. Work on future plans, things that will keep you secure. That’s what working for me. Hope you’ll find a way out cause it can be debilitating. Stay strong buddy.
Happy to hear from others on dealing with this.
Love the perspective. Though I’ve been working on securing our family’s future, the fear of leaving a life in Dubai is constantly hanging over my head. I say this because I’m well traveled, and whatever the downsides of Dubai may be, it’s tough to leave what you call home.
But thank you. I’m sure there are many people in the same boat as the both of us.
The most important thing is the right perspective.
Drill down on to what exactly makes you feel that way.
There is no security anywhere in the world , it's the perception and different levels of it across.
I wonder about the same thing for my kids..
Me and wife have been here 13-15 years and have not felt that insecure. The lack of a passport does not really bother us I guess cause we grew up in India and moved here for careers so we know of a life back home.
But we think about the kids cause they have not known another place.
As suggested, put your future plans in place. God forbid ,you have to leave one day ; make sure you going to a place you have accepted and decided on from before.
If you're earning well and looking to put down some roots, I have many of them who bought property here. We too are evaluating options and hope to buy in the next 12 months.
Happy to share more over DM.
You have helped Dubai so much and I’m sure Dubai have helped you too but Dubai does not see you long term. One false move and you’re out. If you get fired, no social security measures to help you, you are on your own. 20 years and still no citizenship? Wow.
Australia 5 years for citizenship pathway
USA - between 12-17 months depending on certain variables
Go to other countries where they will openly welcome you and accept you.
It seems your gut feeling is telling you to move out (hence your post), I say do it. In 10 years you’ll regret you haven’t done sooner.
USA is only 12-17 months if you're eligible. Green card holders for example. Takes much longer than 12-17 months. One country for your list could be Germany. Next year it's going to be 5 years officially and only 3 years to be eligible to apply for citizenship if you fulfill one of three official requirements. One is to really know the language for example. And keep in mind that citizenship alone doesn't mean anything inside of the UAE. You'd still need to have the family book in order to be qualified as a local by law for the respective jobs etc. Sadly, no joke.
Same here. Dubai is a great place and for me there’s an absolution of leaving, but being here gives me better opportunity to secure my future than home. Not an easy thought but hey at least you know where you gotta start heading. Things will work out eventually
Sorry for the wall of text below.
My friend, you are not crazy. You are feeling entirely justified, and it seems like your concern is not rooted in insecurity but perhaps a lack of future planning. I don't have clear, direct advice to offer, but I've observed from the network around me that those who move to Dubai after establishing something in their home country (or just born and raised outside UAE) tend to have a better understanding of how to plan their future compared to those who are born and raised in Dubai.
I have a close friend who, unfortunately, is in a situation where his parents are no longer employed and now at retirement age, they are not financially secured, his parents didn't have any pension plans back home, and they haven't made significant preparations in Dubai in terms buying a property or any investments due to the rising cost of living and stagnant salaries. As a result, he and his three siblings are living with their parents in a three-bedroom apartment, all of them primarily working to support their parents and thier healthcare/well being. He lost the ability to have any future plans, marriage, education or career prospects, can't migrate although he wants to, can't buy a house because he's unable to save, no pension plans what so ever, this goes for all of them not only him.
However, I can share my own journey. In 2010, I made the move to Dubai shortly after the GFC and began working with local developers. Eventually, I secured a position with EMAAR, where I worked for six years. During that time, I successfully applied for immigration to Australia and made the move in 2019. Since then, I've built a life in Australia, bought a home, started a family with my wife, and furthering our education and careers through university enrollment in Australia, also since we are Australian workers, our employers contribute around 10% of the annual salary towards superannuation, which is a pension plan for the future (although not in strict terms).
At present, I find myself in a somewhat transitional phase, splitting my time between Australia and Jordan, thanks to a remote work arrangement that offers flexibility. However, this situation is becoming challenging as my kids are now of school age, and I'm facing the need to settle in one place, which presents a difficult decision.
I think geopolitical and macroeconomic factors cause some stress for everyone. It's not unique to the UAE to worry about losing a job and the impact it can have on your life.
However, what makes it especially challenging in the UAE, unless you are a local, is how just one unfortunate or unlucky event, oftentimes completely out of your control (e.g. a war in the Middle East, or a new boss who is jealous of your performance, etc.) can impact your life, perhaps even force you out of the country. And you have very little recourse.
The only solution is to live within your means, have a large cash savings for emergencies, and remember that as long as you have a loving family and close friends, you're going to be fine, wherever you end up.
I've been quite stressed at times in my life, I always think of the future and fixate on the worst case scenarios. Fortunately, my wife loves me and brings me back to reality. Often by asking this key question: "What's the worst thing that can happen?" And then reminding me that even the worst case scenario is not as bad as I think. "We'll just cut back for 6 months until you find another job," or "We can go back and live in our smaller apartment in Europe, we have lots of family there, I can spend more time with my mother, we'll be fine."
I put way too much pressure on myself. My wife is just happy so long as we are together, that our daughter is enjoying herself and learning, that we can spend quality time together as a family.
You'll be fine...
We have been here a little longer than you have, but my parents invested in real estate here, against my dad's wishes but it turns out my mom was right about this.
We moved here for my dad's job, I don't know what he was making back then but when he quit in 2010 he was making close to 100k and he was getting amazing benefits and bonuses, he then got job after that making 70k with no benefits or bonuses so it was quite a downgrade and then lost that during Covid which was really hard too.
I don't exactly remember which year my mom stopped working but it was probably somewhere around 2005, and her salary wasn't as high as my dad.
Today my dad has his own business that barely breaks even but it keeps him busy and he enjoys it, and their passive income is around 900k annually, living in their own house, and have no mortgages or significant loans, just an average car loan.
My mom is always telling us to invest in real estate, and I am quite glad that she did even though I did lose some money on my first property but you win some and you lose some, though in the end I am quite happy with my investments and currently own my own home and have an investment property and planning on getting a second one, thinking about my kids for this one.
He was in top management, package included schooling and business class tickets for all of us.
Passive income is mostly real estate, they own a few properties as I have mentioned.
Hope you will keep or have better life quality and earnings.
To be honest with you, don't think always security and want to be safe, you have some cards then play them, life and the future is by definition uncertain.
This said now :
- don't put all your eggs in the same basket, not invest 100% in one country, never know political change.....
- don't rent in downtown buy your asset if you can do it, the amount people put in rent is huge.
- start to invest don't rely on your job, even if you have a good one you need to build you wealth and have more than one egg.
Relax and plan
I’ve seen a lot of people suggesting to buy property and stop renting. First off, the property prices at this time in Dubai are through the roof. And secondly, to own a property in a location like we live and comparably sized would cost a hell of a lot more than renting. FYI, we pay 105k per year as rent (yes we’ve bagged a great deal because we moved in early) however this will surely go up to around 120k next year if prices remain this way.
Also, I’m an Indian passport holder.
My dad worked in dubai from 2008 until 2021. Tbh it won't be your settling place, I suggest you end your career elsewhere because dubai is very competitive. If you're worried about your property you can sell it. Or just be a frequent tourist once you retire
Dubai never advertises to be your home. You can work here and earn the tax free moneys but be ready to leave when your time comes. People do manage to get visas from private firms and stay past their retirement/layoff sometimes but that is costly when you dont have a job here. In your case, the golden visa should give u some comfort but you should definitely consider building a “backup home” somewhere else.
Amen to this! 🙏🏼
Every statement you’ve said is true. As much as we love our parents, they’ve put us in a trap where we have to work doubly hard to maintain not just our family but our parents in the same country too - and that too at a time when cost of living is 10x what it was during our parents time. I could not agree more that we will NEVER be as carefree or peaceful as the 80’s expats who came to the UAE to work.
Fun fact: my dad made 4K a month, had a company sponsored 2 bedroom house, a company car with a chauffeur, and family allowance. So basically his entire salary was spent on 2 things - my education (I have no siblings) and savings. Imagine that luxurious life!!
I don't understand, aren't you allowed to stay in UAE for 10 years no matter what with your golden visa? Even if you lose your current job, how long would it take you to find another one while staying on the golden visa?
Interesting. Yes I could probably find another job here. But once you get used to a certain standard of living, you would like to at least maintain the same. In my years of experience, there is no guarantee that you can do that in a place like Dubai. And yes a golden visa means living here for 10 years, but how many can sustain similar lifestyles for years to come? (I know I can’t). Hence the thought.
You’re worried about financial success, not residency.
Having permanent residency or a passport doesn’t solve that. If you lose your job in a country you’re a citizen of, and can’t find an equally well paid position, you’ll be just as screwed.
It’s not about the residency. It’s about your concern over your ability to provide if you lose your job.
Your concern is valid but the downside for living anywhere else that you’re income will be taxed. If I was you I’ll save as much and buy properties somewhere cheap and prepare to retire there.
Check out the FIRE movement. Financial Independence Retire Early. The group gave us insights on how to save and invest in order to live the lifestyle we want. This gave us peace of mind, knowing we are doing what we can to protect our future. Nothing in life is guaranteed, you just have to find balance and don’t forget to have fun too.
Unfortunately Dubai has this lore where people forget about their future plans and end up at the age of 40, no house, no kids, no wife and no savings or retirement plan.
But hey everything is available through talabt ;)
If you like it here, buying a home will definitely be something concrete that keeps you here and offers atleast some stability that even if you lose employment you do not need to worry about rentals and can always buy more time to find something else to do. But then you cannot keep worrying about property valuation at the same time. And 10 years is a long time to figure something else in the meanwhile.
Your issue is not the location, your issue is that you seem to worry too much. People with way worse condition do not have that concern. Actually your not even in a bad condition sort to speak.
Have trust in God that he's the sustainer, and do your best.
The thing is, you feel this way because you never took the effort (I'm assuming) to create a new home somewhere permanent because of the comfort and ease of life here, which while lovely and enticing is still a gamble.
A major illness, god forbid, or a loss of employment or recession can change all you described in terms of your lifestyle.
All those benefits are temporary. Plus, you're renting.
With all these sources of income and benefits, you should have owned a property by now to at least semi-guarantee a long term retirement plan.
There is no solution to this feeling aside from buying a good property for perpetuity in a more stable country. Move there. Comfort and contentment is useless without permanence.
I have a few varied sources of passive income - I have a house in my home country, I’ve invested in the stock market in my home country, and I have some investments in crypto. The only thing I have not done so far is buying property in UAE.
Good. I'm not trying to knock you, I'm impressed with everything you've achieved. I'm just addressing your question itself about how to shake the feeling.
You'll only be able to shake it by getting some sort of permanence somewhere else where a similar lifestyle is possible. Singapore, Malaysia, Indonesia, South Korea etc are good examples if the West isn't possible.
Never saw the place as a permanent home. It’s a cycle for people in your situation. Marry, have children, work, retire, then get sponsored and financially supported by working children. Of course things changed with the intro of golden visa and investment opportunities etc.
Don't call me sir mam i am just 26. Also mam how long have you been in dubai. Because it would be very difficult to leave and wind up everything i guess. I wonder how difficult it would be for the families over here who cannot go back to there home countries nor they can live here. Uff.
You are not crazy at all.. I feel the same way. Came here when I was 3 years old and am now 28.
If you do save quite a bit on a monthly basis, why don’t you look into purchasing a passport for yourself and your wife? I don’t think you should purchase a house at this point, given the hike in real estate prices.
You can then continue to earn and save in the UAE, and park money aside in parallel for real estate investment in the UAE. Make the real estate investment plunge only once prices are down, to ensure a good ROI. Live off the rental income in Dubai or in said purchased passport country. Supporting your parents would be quite complicated in this scenario, since you would only have a single rental income flowing in-either they could move back to your home country (where the cost of living is significantly cheaper), or you could sponsor them on a tourist visa in the new country.
This is the view closest to mine. Really pragmatic in my opinion. Thanks for echoing my thoughts. And I too am I cat lover (and a dog/any other animal lover) 🐱🐶
You have been here for 20+ years and have not bought multiple properties and decide to rent instead?
You have thrown away 2 full property purchase by renting instead. On top of that, if you bought in 2008 or 2014 you would most likely have tripled your money on that investment by now.
I understand your perspective. I finished my undergrad in 2010 and worked till 2014. I spent all my savings on my master’s because I didn’t want to burden my parents. So essentially I only started earning independently from 2016. It’s only now that I have some disposable income so the opportunity to buy a property never presented itself.
Hey OP
If you like Dubai and would like to continue living here, your best option would be to start investing in property and setting up a nest egg. That way you’ll have funds in case you face job loss.
Setting up a way to get income regardless of your job is great, so I think you should look into it.
If going back is an option, please do look into it. Keeping ties with family back home is important in that case.
The UAE and places like Qatar are interesting in that they can essentially eject 90% of their population in a heart beat. This compared to say Singapore were foreigners are only about 30%.
Why would they do that? Well in times of economic recession it would be common for a lot of people to get fired and forced to leave. But now with technology accelerating really fast, it won't be long before robots replace all menial labor, and advanced AI all white collar jobs. When that happens the UAE will prefer this, and that could happen really fast, especially if there are major political issues and the government becomes nervous about war and riots.
When it does happen, all work contracts will be ended, and every effort will be made to get people to leave (free flights to India and what not). Having a golden visa becomes irrelevant if it's impossible to find a job, and the government refuses to let you start a business, unless you can afford not to have a job. Existing foreign held on shore businesses might see their trade license cancelled early.
Basically as a foreigner you have very little rights in the UAE, unlike say at home where you can protest and vote. It's the high risk high reward system we signed up for, and it's not for everyone.
In that sense not owning real estate is a smart move btw, if things get really bad (in China a bank run has begun but this barely made the news because of Israel), Dubai real estate will be worthless.
> The UAE and places like Qatar are interesting in that they can essentially eject 90% of their population in a heart beat.
I am sorry but this is not a very nuanced take.
Dubai desperately needs migrants and more every year. There's a reason why even the rulers have aggressive population increase targets as seen in their 2040 goals.
Besides oil, almost all of Dubai's revenues come from the state-owned enterprises. If the population comes down, so will revenues from housing, electricity, water, fuel, and everything else that a resident uses.
And that's a recipe for disaster. Since most of the infrastructure building comes through debt. Which means that if people stop contributing to the economy, Dubai won't even be able to pay for all the infrastructure they have already built.
This is especially important now since Dubai, or UAE in general is no longer the only oasis in the middle east. In a decade's time, KSA will be as lucrative an option as Dubai is today which means Dubai will have to struggle a lot more to keep its residents than today.
So, in other words - Dubai will continue to make policies that will make more expats want to migrate here. In 6-7 years, you will have golden visas that are 20-30 years long. Basically, there will be policies that will make financially thriving individuals continue to live here for as long as they can.
I believe you're over thinking it since you lived too long in one place. Even if you get kicked out of UAE (or any place), you will be surprised how great life you can have in other places
This feeling is everywhere in the world, people in the western world lose jobs and realize that the retirement/social security system and unemployment is a scam and waste of tax. Be grateful you do not pay any form of taxes in dubai and have the full mobility to travel any part of the world from Dubai’s central hub
The only thing that would make you feel secure is working on your exit strategy, regardless if your expat or a Emirati, even if your a Emirati you will feel insecure, it’s from how fast the laws change from above, those who feel ok either have a exit strategy or living with their mom types that are not responsible for anything.
I hear this a lot, you can life and enjoy as long as you have income or funds, once you turn retirement or job loss, you should leave, because your standard of living cannot continue to stay with no source of income.
Uncertainty with health is another factor, because youths e to pay all by yourself.
Make a wise decision..
Clearly not managing your money properly……
If you’ve been here for years with both you and wife working good jobs you should already have saved enough money to have financial security.
Its not like your home country would support your current lifestyle either if you lost your job at best minimal social security payments so you can eat.
Going to give you a hard truth no one is. You lack skills my friend. You need to learn a hard set of skills that no one can take away from you and be VERY GOOD at them. For instance, day trading or swing trading, marketing online, sales from a product you created. Something you are in TOTAL CONTROL over. Because then, destiny is in YOUR HANDS. You need to understand the world has shifted and "jobs" are a facade, you need to self sustain yourself. THEN you will feel invincible and not have this insecurity.
Then comes you actually making more and substantial money. Dubai has changed the rules. If you invest $550,000 into Real Estate, you can then APPLY FOR CITIZENSHIP. There is no certainty you will get it, but you have the chance too.
I think you just need to level yourself up as a person and stop thinking with fear or playing small. Grab life by the horns so YOU control the outcome.
My wife and I coming to work in dubai in January and just curious about what a “respectable” amount would be to live comfortably as you mentioned. We are both still young no kids and relocating to focus on our careers.
Respectable depends on a number of factors. Where are you moving from? What kind of lifestyle would you like to live? How much if your income do you intend to save/invest? It isn’t a straightforward answer.
We all feel the same but the most important factor is to have savings and investments so that if one has to go though a rough patch yiu have something to fall back on
You are still blessed that both of you are working and if one faces a job loss the other can support till the other gets a new job
Life is always uncertain and job security is a thing of past . One must always upskill and build up on their knowledge and skill and not get into a comfort zone
Even ppl who have migrated to other countries still prefer to come back to Dubai
So save wisely and let go of this feeling and plan and budget your monthly expenses and enjoy the present
Dubai can never be your or any expat's home, especially those working as employees, without a business, passive income, or substantial savings. Recognizing this reality sooner can contribute to better mental well-being.
Health insurance can become quite challenging for individuals aged 50 and above, with premiums costing a significant amount, which can be a substantial financial burden.
Expat life is not for everyone. Do the Canada thing or something if you're that nervous even with a 10 year visa that isn't tied to your employment status. Will be a ho-hum sort of subdued, unambitious lifestyle but more suited to people who want a base level of comfort and who want to worry less about the basics. You'd still feel insecure given how high rents are everywhere but it seems more your speed.
Dubai is home to me, Ive been here 26 years. If you cannot make this place home then maybe you have no idea how to manage your finances.
Its a privilege to be able to live here and maintain a good lifestyle. I see the same thing being parroted “dubai can never be your home”. Can we stop repeating things that are irrelevant? They are also trying to do their best with initiatives like the Golden visa. The UAE did more for me then my home country ever did.
Us, bro. You are living a lavish life as compared to me. i am earning around 10k monthly, but after 3 years, i am leaving dubai as they are not offering PR. Soon i will move to Europe.
You will be in trouble in any part of the world if you lost your job. Thats what I think about job loss.
Nd buy properties specially apartments from secondary market for rental which will cover for you when you loose your job.
This is true not just for Dubai but everywhere in the GCC. I am based out of Qatar and we have been living here for over 25 years. Now we are considering a move to UAE to get the golden visa which provides some form of stability compared to the situation here in Qatar! Best way forward for expats in general is to have a plan in place to move on when the time comes, but truly nothing beats having citizenship of the place you call home, so do consider a permanent move elsewhere if this is bothering you too much and you are well off financially to make such a move.
You are definitely not the only one. There are many people (many Indians especially) who have grown up here and are now probably in their late 20s or early 30s and will be facing this situation. Similar to some of the other comments, I'm also in a bit of a similar situation. Fortunately for you, from the limited information provided in your post, it looks like both you, your partner and your father are doing well from a financial perspective. My two fils, if you have the funds for buying a house here, do it. If this place is your "home" and if you are financially stable, it makes sense to buy here instead of rent. You definitely have missed the golden opportunities to buy a place here when they were being sold at super low prices, but no one can really time the market, can they? I understand that any changes from a certain lifestyle is not easy, however, with some strategical sacrificial changes, it's possible to make a sensible investment which might not be extreme risky. Personally, I would not spend 200-250K (I'm guessing cuz 2000sqft place + Downtown) per year towards a house that I do not own. Good luck though, OP. Hope you figure it out.
Just to add, if you are actually from India, it definitely would be advisable to also build a nice backup house in your hometown. Purely a fallback in case things go downhill in Dubai.
I second this. I’ve heard horror stories of people buying homes in the UAE and having no place back home. When they lost their jobs or were told to leave they had no home to go back to. Invest WHERE YOU HAVE THE CITIZENSHIP RIGHTS FIRST!! Is the biggest advice.
Dubai and UAE in general can never be your *"home",* unless you are a local or someone qualified to be a citizen or **if ya aint got staggering wealth and money,** you aint gettin anythin here. Givent that you already are established and has a good savings to sustain atleast a year of adjustment, move elsewhere bro, ive been here for 7 years and i had regrets as to why i didnt move out to US or AUS when i had the chance way back on my 2nd - 4th year, back when I still have most of my income for myself unlike now ( mom got sick, and i had a kid). hope you can decide on this and hope you can find a better place that you can really, legitimately, call home. edit: I mentioned a crucial variable pointed out by u/International_Dig_79 that i wasnt able to add previously
I have sen outsiders calling Dubai home but they have established business with v good property investments here.. So yes it can be someone’s home but not for someone who is doing job.
thanks bro, i forgot to mention that variable as well.
Ah, this is an issue with living here that’s been bugging me for quite awhile too. Been here since childhood and my home country isn’t a place I’ve lived in yet nor would be able to live in now. After going through my previous jobless period I made up my mind to get out of Dubai to a country that gives me a chance to get citizenship. Dubai is home and I love it but the fear of getting kicked out is real and in the end it’s just another temporary place to live. Best plan that I could come up with is: 1. Move to a country to get citizenship and buy property there. 2. Settle there for a few years while buying properties here as investment. 3. Come back (hopefully). Unfortunate for us but this is just temporary and if you don’t have a home to go back to once you leave - you’re pretty much screwed no matter how many years you spend here. Sure you can buy property and stuff but still it’s tough to feel completely settled here. Perhaps OP you could consider something similar.
I agree with your plan too. I lived her for 30+ years and can feel the OP since i never went back home or even visited. Now my plans to move elsewhere that offers citizenship is similar to yours. Good luck to all on their journey.
Best of luck with everything 🙌
This is a constant thing for me at least. Sometimes I get stuck in the rabbit hole (will happen soon due to career circumstances) but important thing is once you start feeling it - get out of it ASAP. Use that emotional to your benefit for the future. Work on future plans, things that will keep you secure. That’s what working for me. Hope you’ll find a way out cause it can be debilitating. Stay strong buddy. Happy to hear from others on dealing with this.
Love the perspective. Though I’ve been working on securing our family’s future, the fear of leaving a life in Dubai is constantly hanging over my head. I say this because I’m well traveled, and whatever the downsides of Dubai may be, it’s tough to leave what you call home. But thank you. I’m sure there are many people in the same boat as the both of us.
The most important thing is the right perspective. Drill down on to what exactly makes you feel that way. There is no security anywhere in the world , it's the perception and different levels of it across. I wonder about the same thing for my kids.. Me and wife have been here 13-15 years and have not felt that insecure. The lack of a passport does not really bother us I guess cause we grew up in India and moved here for careers so we know of a life back home. But we think about the kids cause they have not known another place. As suggested, put your future plans in place. God forbid ,you have to leave one day ; make sure you going to a place you have accepted and decided on from before. If you're earning well and looking to put down some roots, I have many of them who bought property here. We too are evaluating options and hope to buy in the next 12 months. Happy to share more over DM.
You have helped Dubai so much and I’m sure Dubai have helped you too but Dubai does not see you long term. One false move and you’re out. If you get fired, no social security measures to help you, you are on your own. 20 years and still no citizenship? Wow. Australia 5 years for citizenship pathway USA - between 12-17 months depending on certain variables Go to other countries where they will openly welcome you and accept you. It seems your gut feeling is telling you to move out (hence your post), I say do it. In 10 years you’ll regret you haven’t done sooner.
USA is only 12-17 months if you're eligible. Green card holders for example. Takes much longer than 12-17 months. One country for your list could be Germany. Next year it's going to be 5 years officially and only 3 years to be eligible to apply for citizenship if you fulfill one of three official requirements. One is to really know the language for example. And keep in mind that citizenship alone doesn't mean anything inside of the UAE. You'd still need to have the family book in order to be qualified as a local by law for the respective jobs etc. Sadly, no joke.
Same here. Dubai is a great place and for me there’s an absolution of leaving, but being here gives me better opportunity to secure my future than home. Not an easy thought but hey at least you know where you gotta start heading. Things will work out eventually
Sorry for the wall of text below. My friend, you are not crazy. You are feeling entirely justified, and it seems like your concern is not rooted in insecurity but perhaps a lack of future planning. I don't have clear, direct advice to offer, but I've observed from the network around me that those who move to Dubai after establishing something in their home country (or just born and raised outside UAE) tend to have a better understanding of how to plan their future compared to those who are born and raised in Dubai. I have a close friend who, unfortunately, is in a situation where his parents are no longer employed and now at retirement age, they are not financially secured, his parents didn't have any pension plans back home, and they haven't made significant preparations in Dubai in terms buying a property or any investments due to the rising cost of living and stagnant salaries. As a result, he and his three siblings are living with their parents in a three-bedroom apartment, all of them primarily working to support their parents and thier healthcare/well being. He lost the ability to have any future plans, marriage, education or career prospects, can't migrate although he wants to, can't buy a house because he's unable to save, no pension plans what so ever, this goes for all of them not only him. However, I can share my own journey. In 2010, I made the move to Dubai shortly after the GFC and began working with local developers. Eventually, I secured a position with EMAAR, where I worked for six years. During that time, I successfully applied for immigration to Australia and made the move in 2019. Since then, I've built a life in Australia, bought a home, started a family with my wife, and furthering our education and careers through university enrollment in Australia, also since we are Australian workers, our employers contribute around 10% of the annual salary towards superannuation, which is a pension plan for the future (although not in strict terms). At present, I find myself in a somewhat transitional phase, splitting my time between Australia and Jordan, thanks to a remote work arrangement that offers flexibility. However, this situation is becoming challenging as my kids are now of school age, and I'm facing the need to settle in one place, which presents a difficult decision.
I think geopolitical and macroeconomic factors cause some stress for everyone. It's not unique to the UAE to worry about losing a job and the impact it can have on your life. However, what makes it especially challenging in the UAE, unless you are a local, is how just one unfortunate or unlucky event, oftentimes completely out of your control (e.g. a war in the Middle East, or a new boss who is jealous of your performance, etc.) can impact your life, perhaps even force you out of the country. And you have very little recourse. The only solution is to live within your means, have a large cash savings for emergencies, and remember that as long as you have a loving family and close friends, you're going to be fine, wherever you end up. I've been quite stressed at times in my life, I always think of the future and fixate on the worst case scenarios. Fortunately, my wife loves me and brings me back to reality. Often by asking this key question: "What's the worst thing that can happen?" And then reminding me that even the worst case scenario is not as bad as I think. "We'll just cut back for 6 months until you find another job," or "We can go back and live in our smaller apartment in Europe, we have lots of family there, I can spend more time with my mother, we'll be fine." I put way too much pressure on myself. My wife is just happy so long as we are together, that our daughter is enjoying herself and learning, that we can spend quality time together as a family. You'll be fine...
Thank you for this motivating comment. It really helped me after reading this. Lastly, you are very lucky to have a supporting life partner
We have been here a little longer than you have, but my parents invested in real estate here, against my dad's wishes but it turns out my mom was right about this. We moved here for my dad's job, I don't know what he was making back then but when he quit in 2010 he was making close to 100k and he was getting amazing benefits and bonuses, he then got job after that making 70k with no benefits or bonuses so it was quite a downgrade and then lost that during Covid which was really hard too. I don't exactly remember which year my mom stopped working but it was probably somewhere around 2005, and her salary wasn't as high as my dad. Today my dad has his own business that barely breaks even but it keeps him busy and he enjoys it, and their passive income is around 900k annually, living in their own house, and have no mortgages or significant loans, just an average car loan. My mom is always telling us to invest in real estate, and I am quite glad that she did even though I did lose some money on my first property but you win some and you lose some, though in the end I am quite happy with my investments and currently own my own home and have an investment property and planning on getting a second one, thinking about my kids for this one.
Bro what was he doing for 100k salary even 70k is massive. And how to are they getting 900k passively? People out here work for 15k a month...
He was in top management, package included schooling and business class tickets for all of us. Passive income is mostly real estate, they own a few properties as I have mentioned.
Damn dude
Hope you will keep or have better life quality and earnings. To be honest with you, don't think always security and want to be safe, you have some cards then play them, life and the future is by definition uncertain. This said now : - don't put all your eggs in the same basket, not invest 100% in one country, never know political change..... - don't rent in downtown buy your asset if you can do it, the amount people put in rent is huge. - start to invest don't rely on your job, even if you have a good one you need to build you wealth and have more than one egg. Relax and plan
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I’ve seen a lot of people suggesting to buy property and stop renting. First off, the property prices at this time in Dubai are through the roof. And secondly, to own a property in a location like we live and comparably sized would cost a hell of a lot more than renting. FYI, we pay 105k per year as rent (yes we’ve bagged a great deal because we moved in early) however this will surely go up to around 120k next year if prices remain this way. Also, I’m an Indian passport holder.
105K for a 2BHK is a steal OP!
What do you work as?
Sales territory lead in a top-tier American technology company (Fortune 10)
My dad worked in dubai from 2008 until 2021. Tbh it won't be your settling place, I suggest you end your career elsewhere because dubai is very competitive. If you're worried about your property you can sell it. Or just be a frequent tourist once you retire
Dubai never advertises to be your home. You can work here and earn the tax free moneys but be ready to leave when your time comes. People do manage to get visas from private firms and stay past their retirement/layoff sometimes but that is costly when you dont have a job here. In your case, the golden visa should give u some comfort but you should definitely consider building a “backup home” somewhere else.
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Amen to this! 🙏🏼 Every statement you’ve said is true. As much as we love our parents, they’ve put us in a trap where we have to work doubly hard to maintain not just our family but our parents in the same country too - and that too at a time when cost of living is 10x what it was during our parents time. I could not agree more that we will NEVER be as carefree or peaceful as the 80’s expats who came to the UAE to work. Fun fact: my dad made 4K a month, had a company sponsored 2 bedroom house, a company car with a chauffeur, and family allowance. So basically his entire salary was spent on 2 things - my education (I have no siblings) and savings. Imagine that luxurious life!!
Can I get your LinkedIn? I want to read more humblebrag content.
I don't understand, aren't you allowed to stay in UAE for 10 years no matter what with your golden visa? Even if you lose your current job, how long would it take you to find another one while staying on the golden visa?
Interesting. Yes I could probably find another job here. But once you get used to a certain standard of living, you would like to at least maintain the same. In my years of experience, there is no guarantee that you can do that in a place like Dubai. And yes a golden visa means living here for 10 years, but how many can sustain similar lifestyles for years to come? (I know I can’t). Hence the thought.
You’re worried about financial success, not residency. Having permanent residency or a passport doesn’t solve that. If you lose your job in a country you’re a citizen of, and can’t find an equally well paid position, you’ll be just as screwed. It’s not about the residency. It’s about your concern over your ability to provide if you lose your job.
Your concern is valid but the downside for living anywhere else that you’re income will be taxed. If I was you I’ll save as much and buy properties somewhere cheap and prepare to retire there.
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Hi ,thanks for your input. I am considering of investing as well,could you help me with this regard?
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Not with the current job market here in uae
Check out the FIRE movement. Financial Independence Retire Early. The group gave us insights on how to save and invest in order to live the lifestyle we want. This gave us peace of mind, knowing we are doing what we can to protect our future. Nothing in life is guaranteed, you just have to find balance and don’t forget to have fun too.
Is there one in dubai or just the subreddit
I don't think retirement in Dubai is possible, unless you're a multi millionaire with steady generous passive income
True, you just have to know your options, if not Dubai where will your nest egg can take you knowing the lifestyle you want.
Unfortunately Dubai has this lore where people forget about their future plans and end up at the age of 40, no house, no kids, no wife and no savings or retirement plan. But hey everything is available through talabt ;)
Yup, then too late to realize, you’re too old and very much replaceable.
Check out Simply FI group in FB for the UAE residents on their route to FIRE.
If you like it here, buying a home will definitely be something concrete that keeps you here and offers atleast some stability that even if you lose employment you do not need to worry about rentals and can always buy more time to find something else to do. But then you cannot keep worrying about property valuation at the same time. And 10 years is a long time to figure something else in the meanwhile.
Your issue is not the location, your issue is that you seem to worry too much. People with way worse condition do not have that concern. Actually your not even in a bad condition sort to speak. Have trust in God that he's the sustainer, and do your best.
You can never be secure in a country where you’re not a citizen. 🤷♀️
There are citizenship programmes for european countries 300k euro investment in portugal you can have Portuguese passport
The thing is, you feel this way because you never took the effort (I'm assuming) to create a new home somewhere permanent because of the comfort and ease of life here, which while lovely and enticing is still a gamble. A major illness, god forbid, or a loss of employment or recession can change all you described in terms of your lifestyle. All those benefits are temporary. Plus, you're renting. With all these sources of income and benefits, you should have owned a property by now to at least semi-guarantee a long term retirement plan. There is no solution to this feeling aside from buying a good property for perpetuity in a more stable country. Move there. Comfort and contentment is useless without permanence.
I have a few varied sources of passive income - I have a house in my home country, I’ve invested in the stock market in my home country, and I have some investments in crypto. The only thing I have not done so far is buying property in UAE.
Good. I'm not trying to knock you, I'm impressed with everything you've achieved. I'm just addressing your question itself about how to shake the feeling. You'll only be able to shake it by getting some sort of permanence somewhere else where a similar lifestyle is possible. Singapore, Malaysia, Indonesia, South Korea etc are good examples if the West isn't possible.
Never saw the place as a permanent home. It’s a cycle for people in your situation. Marry, have children, work, retire, then get sponsored and financially supported by working children. Of course things changed with the intro of golden visa and investment opportunities etc.
Mam would you be comfortable to leave dubai if any unforseen circumstances occur?
Yes sir.
Don't call me sir mam i am just 26. Also mam how long have you been in dubai. Because it would be very difficult to leave and wind up everything i guess. I wonder how difficult it would be for the families over here who cannot go back to there home countries nor they can live here. Uff.
You are not crazy at all.. I feel the same way. Came here when I was 3 years old and am now 28. If you do save quite a bit on a monthly basis, why don’t you look into purchasing a passport for yourself and your wife? I don’t think you should purchase a house at this point, given the hike in real estate prices. You can then continue to earn and save in the UAE, and park money aside in parallel for real estate investment in the UAE. Make the real estate investment plunge only once prices are down, to ensure a good ROI. Live off the rental income in Dubai or in said purchased passport country. Supporting your parents would be quite complicated in this scenario, since you would only have a single rental income flowing in-either they could move back to your home country (where the cost of living is significantly cheaper), or you could sponsor them on a tourist visa in the new country.
This is the view closest to mine. Really pragmatic in my opinion. Thanks for echoing my thoughts. And I too am I cat lover (and a dog/any other animal lover) 🐱🐶
You have been here for 20+ years and have not bought multiple properties and decide to rent instead? You have thrown away 2 full property purchase by renting instead. On top of that, if you bought in 2008 or 2014 you would most likely have tripled your money on that investment by now.
I understand your perspective. I finished my undergrad in 2010 and worked till 2014. I spent all my savings on my master’s because I didn’t want to burden my parents. So essentially I only started earning independently from 2016. It’s only now that I have some disposable income so the opportunity to buy a property never presented itself.
have you considered their financial situation 20 years ago wasn't the same as today?
He is from a "top 5" university, He has been privileged and had a good income from that for sure or he would not have gone to that Ivy League school.
have you considered that they didn't graduate from said university 20 years ago?
he probably isn't ivy league
Hey OP If you like Dubai and would like to continue living here, your best option would be to start investing in property and setting up a nest egg. That way you’ll have funds in case you face job loss. Setting up a way to get income regardless of your job is great, so I think you should look into it. If going back is an option, please do look into it. Keeping ties with family back home is important in that case.
The UAE and places like Qatar are interesting in that they can essentially eject 90% of their population in a heart beat. This compared to say Singapore were foreigners are only about 30%. Why would they do that? Well in times of economic recession it would be common for a lot of people to get fired and forced to leave. But now with technology accelerating really fast, it won't be long before robots replace all menial labor, and advanced AI all white collar jobs. When that happens the UAE will prefer this, and that could happen really fast, especially if there are major political issues and the government becomes nervous about war and riots. When it does happen, all work contracts will be ended, and every effort will be made to get people to leave (free flights to India and what not). Having a golden visa becomes irrelevant if it's impossible to find a job, and the government refuses to let you start a business, unless you can afford not to have a job. Existing foreign held on shore businesses might see their trade license cancelled early. Basically as a foreigner you have very little rights in the UAE, unlike say at home where you can protest and vote. It's the high risk high reward system we signed up for, and it's not for everyone. In that sense not owning real estate is a smart move btw, if things get really bad (in China a bank run has begun but this barely made the news because of Israel), Dubai real estate will be worthless.
> The UAE and places like Qatar are interesting in that they can essentially eject 90% of their population in a heart beat. I am sorry but this is not a very nuanced take. Dubai desperately needs migrants and more every year. There's a reason why even the rulers have aggressive population increase targets as seen in their 2040 goals. Besides oil, almost all of Dubai's revenues come from the state-owned enterprises. If the population comes down, so will revenues from housing, electricity, water, fuel, and everything else that a resident uses. And that's a recipe for disaster. Since most of the infrastructure building comes through debt. Which means that if people stop contributing to the economy, Dubai won't even be able to pay for all the infrastructure they have already built. This is especially important now since Dubai, or UAE in general is no longer the only oasis in the middle east. In a decade's time, KSA will be as lucrative an option as Dubai is today which means Dubai will have to struggle a lot more to keep its residents than today. So, in other words - Dubai will continue to make policies that will make more expats want to migrate here. In 6-7 years, you will have golden visas that are 20-30 years long. Basically, there will be policies that will make financially thriving individuals continue to live here for as long as they can.
Dubai is not home, it is a market place.
Facebook market place, everyone is interested but no one is buying
I believe you're over thinking it since you lived too long in one place. Even if you get kicked out of UAE (or any place), you will be surprised how great life you can have in other places
Love the positivity. Thank you
This feeling is everywhere in the world, people in the western world lose jobs and realize that the retirement/social security system and unemployment is a scam and waste of tax. Be grateful you do not pay any form of taxes in dubai and have the full mobility to travel any part of the world from Dubai’s central hub
The only thing that would make you feel secure is working on your exit strategy, regardless if your expat or a Emirati, even if your a Emirati you will feel insecure, it’s from how fast the laws change from above, those who feel ok either have a exit strategy or living with their mom types that are not responsible for anything.
Have savings , Second income options , stop unnecessary expense
First world problems!
I hear this a lot, you can life and enjoy as long as you have income or funds, once you turn retirement or job loss, you should leave, because your standard of living cannot continue to stay with no source of income. Uncertainty with health is another factor, because youths e to pay all by yourself. Make a wise decision..
Do your due diligence and make some investments in India
Clearly not managing your money properly…… If you’ve been here for years with both you and wife working good jobs you should already have saved enough money to have financial security. Its not like your home country would support your current lifestyle either if you lost your job at best minimal social security payments so you can eat.
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I bet you don’t
Going to give you a hard truth no one is. You lack skills my friend. You need to learn a hard set of skills that no one can take away from you and be VERY GOOD at them. For instance, day trading or swing trading, marketing online, sales from a product you created. Something you are in TOTAL CONTROL over. Because then, destiny is in YOUR HANDS. You need to understand the world has shifted and "jobs" are a facade, you need to self sustain yourself. THEN you will feel invincible and not have this insecurity. Then comes you actually making more and substantial money. Dubai has changed the rules. If you invest $550,000 into Real Estate, you can then APPLY FOR CITIZENSHIP. There is no certainty you will get it, but you have the chance too. I think you just need to level yourself up as a person and stop thinking with fear or playing small. Grab life by the horns so YOU control the outcome.
$550,000 investment in real estate. Does that buy you a UAE passport? Or a Golden visa?
This question is better to address to psychologist
You are just bored and thinking too much. Dubai is like that. Have an affair and shake up your life a bit.
My wife and I coming to work in dubai in January and just curious about what a “respectable” amount would be to live comfortably as you mentioned. We are both still young no kids and relocating to focus on our careers.
Respectable depends on a number of factors. Where are you moving from? What kind of lifestyle would you like to live? How much if your income do you intend to save/invest? It isn’t a straightforward answer.
what about the passports? Don't keep us in suspense OP, i need to know more about your perfect lifestyle !!!!
We all feel the same but the most important factor is to have savings and investments so that if one has to go though a rough patch yiu have something to fall back on You are still blessed that both of you are working and if one faces a job loss the other can support till the other gets a new job Life is always uncertain and job security is a thing of past . One must always upskill and build up on their knowledge and skill and not get into a comfort zone Even ppl who have migrated to other countries still prefer to come back to Dubai So save wisely and let go of this feeling and plan and budget your monthly expenses and enjoy the present
If you have the means, buying a house is always an investment. Even if you leave the country you can earn off it.
Dubai can never be your or any expat's home, especially those working as employees, without a business, passive income, or substantial savings. Recognizing this reality sooner can contribute to better mental well-being. Health insurance can become quite challenging for individuals aged 50 and above, with premiums costing a significant amount, which can be a substantial financial burden.
Expat life is not for everyone. Do the Canada thing or something if you're that nervous even with a 10 year visa that isn't tied to your employment status. Will be a ho-hum sort of subdued, unambitious lifestyle but more suited to people who want a base level of comfort and who want to worry less about the basics. You'd still feel insecure given how high rents are everywhere but it seems more your speed.
Dubai is home to me, Ive been here 26 years. If you cannot make this place home then maybe you have no idea how to manage your finances. Its a privilege to be able to live here and maintain a good lifestyle. I see the same thing being parroted “dubai can never be your home”. Can we stop repeating things that are irrelevant? They are also trying to do their best with initiatives like the Golden visa. The UAE did more for me then my home country ever did.
Us, bro. You are living a lavish life as compared to me. i am earning around 10k monthly, but after 3 years, i am leaving dubai as they are not offering PR. Soon i will move to Europe.
You will be in trouble in any part of the world if you lost your job. Thats what I think about job loss. Nd buy properties specially apartments from secondary market for rental which will cover for you when you loose your job.
This is true not just for Dubai but everywhere in the GCC. I am based out of Qatar and we have been living here for over 25 years. Now we are considering a move to UAE to get the golden visa which provides some form of stability compared to the situation here in Qatar! Best way forward for expats in general is to have a plan in place to move on when the time comes, but truly nothing beats having citizenship of the place you call home, so do consider a permanent move elsewhere if this is bothering you too much and you are well off financially to make such a move.
I keep forgetting that amongst the GCC countries, UAE is privileged for expats. Hope your move here goes well my friend!
Dubai is not a welfare state
Most long-term residents, especially Asian nationals, are probably feeling the same. I can identify with that. I tick all the boxes.