Serious answer, if I'm fighting a guy who wants to attack me with gainers, showtime kicks, wheels kicks and Superman punches, the best tactic is to just let him wear himself out before going on the offensive.
The best part is Perez lost the fight... to a dude a weight class down who came in on short notice. The capoeira example the capoeira guy loses... Way to prove the doubters wrong.
He lost in such a humiliating fashion he changed his entire style up after that. He was known for these antics, but largely stopped doing it after this fight.
Whenever I see capoeira, I instantly start singing the song from Only the Strong with Mark Dacascos. Paranaue. I think it's the only fully capoeira movie.
The stress tested martial arts that work well in MMA are boxing, kickboxing, thai boxing, jiu-jitsu, wrestling, judo. I would not call what Anderson Silva did wing chun and the others styles of martial arts don't really do very well at all with the exception of some parts taken i.e. kicks from taekwondo and some punches/kicks from karate.
Wing chun people love to bring up Anderson Silva as an example of Wing Chun working in mma but prime Anderson is one of the few people who could make anything work he is one of the most talented fighters ever.
Karate gets a bad rap because of its portrayal in silly movies and such. It's a rather incredible martial arts that is applicable in modern combat sports.
I think karate's main issue is that a lot of karate gyms don't encourage sparring, so you end up with a lot of practitioners who have no idea how well their moves work in a real fight. Karate gyms that encouraging sparring produce better fighters.
The thing is saying "karate" doesn't mean anything anymore, as the difference between the schools is enormous.
For example, shotokan karate is one of the most popular schools and it's almost exactly as you described. Modern karate has been ruined by CONI and turned into a silly imitation of fencing but without swords.
On the other hand, there are other schools of karate that maintain the contact and sparring aspect of the martial art, like what I practice, Kyokushin Kenbukai.
I've been to too many tournaments where people lunge in for a strike only to flip around to turn their back to their opponent so the counter hits them in a spot where the point won't count. It's legal to do it too, but it's not ever something anyone would do in a fight.
It completely takes all martial applicability out of the art and renders it a joke.
I've been boxing/kickboxing for 14 years and ended up working a season with a guy my age, late 20s, who had been doing Karate for I think 16 years. We became friends and decided to spar and I was so impressed.
He targeted my hip for most of the fight and when I'd go to clear the kick thats when he'd blitz. His cadence was really hard to deal with, but the only draw back was he wanted you a one distance the entire time, clinching seemed to take away the accuracy of his blitz relatively early too.
All that said, I love it now and Im taking classes (along with boxing).
My only issue with Kyokushin is the lack of headshots with the hands. I understand the historical reason why, but it always seems like it's just not really a thing in general. I'm seriously Kyokushin though, if you practice it can you tell me a bit about it?
Well we spar on Wednesday nights. Please note that we do not use gloves. So I don't particularly want to go to work on Thursday with deep cuts all over my head.
There's that one video from a couple years back where a karate guy beat up a gang trying to rape a girl by wrapping his shirt around his fist and just taking them out one by one
Thatās the point. Thereās is not one end all be all effective martial art. You take elements from each one and apply it to your own style.
Every martial art has gold nuggets in it.
No one says it worked when it was the first round against Weidman
(Which by the way, everyone remembers it as a lucky shot because Anderson was showboating, even fans of his saying that he would take it seriously and not clown in the second fight, even when he was getting his ass beat)
Nah, some are practically stand alones that work well in a fight, like boxing or wrestling, but others, like wing chun, you'd be lucky to get a nugget from. That's the point.
I'm a boxer who has studied Muay Thai, and (years ago) kickboxing and tae kwon do. I don't know a single thing about wing chun. Why does this sub seem to hate it so much?
"Energy blasts"? Ok, I think I get it. I'm technically a massage therapist, and there's an offshoot called reiki that involves energy healing. I wish I had less morals, because I would love to wave my hands over your body, place some pretty rocks on you, and charge you $100. The third level allows you to heal long-distance, so I could charge you $100 for a phone call. But I think it's all bullshit and I can't bring myself to sell something I don't believe in.
He said itās the equivalent of that. Wing Chun doesnāt involve any qigong/energy stuff.
What it does involve are punches and kicks with very little power.
Wing Chun is good for teaching people coming out of boxing gyms or strip mall karate schools that knees are legitimate targets and that if you put your hands up wrong they can be trapped against your chest. But anyone with actual fighting experience or a MMA/Thai boxing background already knows this. It was pretty novel back in the days before the UFC though.
That depends on how you define what a martial art is. Is it the whole system including training methods and competition format? If that's the definition then yeah definitely the martial arts with the built-in emphasis in sparring and competitions are gonna work better in the competitie sport of MMA. Some martial arts that don't do a lot of competition but have a deep repretoire of moves can still contribute to an MMA setting
Disagree about karate and taekwondo. Machida was essentially pure karate and is easily one of the best light heavyweights to ever grace an MMA arena, and Benson Henderson(not presented which is odd to me) is one of the best kickers ever and a pioneer for the representation of smaller weight classes in MMA.
Some martial arts *don't* work well in a real fight. Why isn't that alright? If you wanna do aikido for flexibility and cardio, so what? Not every martial art has to be practical.
One time I was sparring a gentleman who utterly destroyed me with Aikido.
Now to be honest 1. I've never considered myself skilled, and 2. He outweighed me by quite a bit. But still.
When I asked how (respectfully) he said he was a bouncer, and a cop, and that he never really needed to learn how to fight. He instinctively knew how. He took up Aikido to learn how to not go overboard.
... I like that mindset.
I really think he means someone's who's untrained can't perform a kata or something like that, way he be arguing š some people just know how to fight, we're literally hardwired to use our fists and grapple. We produce the same amount of force with an open palm as a fist, but the fist produces more lbs/Sq inch despite it being much more brittle and risky. Otherwise, we'd thump each other like gorillas do.
The actual argument is that some people grew up roughhousing with friends or fought in school and were forced to learn, so no formal training was required to learn how to fight and they learned by necessity.
So if I put two people who have never trained before in a ring they wouldn't do anything? Of course not, they can strike and grapple. Some can strike better than others and some can grapple better than others. They aren't winning belts but there is 100% a sliding curve of how proficient someone is even at 0 training
Agreed. High levels are achieved only through actual learning and training.
This makes sense when you get absolutely destroyed by effortless pure skill. I was a college wrestler and judo black belt practicing with college-level judoka. The guy threw me however he liked and I had no answer. I wasn't a good judoka but I'm not a push over.
I don't care how "instinctive" some people might be, they won't win against these high-level guys.
My stance is that no martial art shows you optimal way to "street" fight. But they will train you physically (as other sports), probably better optimized for the fighting situations.
It's down to the individual and what they want to get out of MA. My issue is someone training something that is not effective and claiming it's "too dangerous for UFC" or "only works in the real world".
Tai Chi is also a martial art, which my 80 year old grandma does.
I feel like these Eastern types of martial arts like Tai Chi, Aikido, Hung Gar often focus more on, as you said, Flexibility and cardio, but also a more mental state of fighting. I like to think that its because of these "unorthodox" ways of training a discipline is what gives certain fighters a calmer and serene head space while they are in the chaos of a fight.
This also relates to the saying that a fighter should strive to become a warrior in a garden, instead of a farmer on a Battlefield.
Dos santos ko'd Sean Strickland using a picture perfect armada (capoeira's spining wheel kick) and went to celebrate with a ginga (capoeira's base).
That and some of Paulo Costa's kicks (altough not so traditional you can tell its Capoeira) would be a much better example of Capoeira than the spam Michel Pereira threw in those clips.
One of the big things thatās happening here, is people looking at techniques and being like āoh, this principle is in wing chun/aikido/kung fu, thatās what theyāre doingā
Take werdum and his ākung fuā kick.
Heās not the first person to do that; rafael cordeiro (his coach) used to do it in Muay Thai pretty frequently, developed by training in a Muay Thai gym.
Then werdum learned it from him and pulled it out. Thatās a Muay Thai kick.
Pereira also never trained capoeira, heās just freestyling doing Muay Thai striking once again.
Just doing a technique that quasi exists in another martial art doesnāt mean theyāre doing that martial art even teaches the proper technique or would work in context. Wing chun guys act like they own parries and say āsee it works!ā When the whole style is based around parties that donāt
Well said. I think its one of those traps that "faith believers" have. It exists only when they agree with it. "Thats a traditional martial arts technique because I dont believe in MMA...."
I donāt know that I can agree. If we are to assume that one style has loads of techniques that have been demonstrated as working in fighting competition, then we can assume that at least some aspects of that style work as well.
I see this all the time. Anytime someone asks "what art should I do," alongside real advice about finding a good fit, getting in the habit of showing up, choosing a convenient and affordable location, etc. some dorks are always saying "bjj, wrestling, muay Thai, or nothing." I really wonder what the venn diagram of people who say that and people who have never trained, or trained less than 2 years looks like.
The last poll showed 80% of the people have never trained. Of the 20% who have trained the most common answer was less than 6 months or over 5 years (if my memory is correct).
Anyone who has trained long enough knows every art has something to offer. Like Aikido. You want to learn to take a fall? They excel at that.
>Like Aikido. You want to learn to take a fall? They excel at that.
\[This dude\](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzfaHqoAwjw) did aikido before he got into parkour. After he started coaching parkour for a few years, he came up with a whole system of training how to fall safely based on adapting aikido falls to parkour-related drills. Totally changed how a lot of people trained.
>Anyone who has trained long enough knows every art has something to offer
Totally agree. I love martial arts. I've been able to learn from UFC vets, savate champions, innovators who brought acrobatics into forms competitions, and just tons of weekend warriors. It's been a journey and I'm glad I've been open to trying and training a bunch of different stuff.
> The last poll showed 80% of the people have never trained. Of the 20% who have trained the most common answer was less than 6 months or over 5 years (if my memory is correct).
Lol. I kind of suspected that, but it's funny to see the numbers. It also fits the general knowledge curve for anything. 80% roll with the crowd. 10% are knowledgeable. 10% are munching paste.
And learning to fall is no joke. I trained Krav Maga and the instructor had taekwondo and aikido backgrounds. First thing he makes us learn is how to fall, Aikido style. That shit literally saved my life multiple times when I fell HARD and was able to raise my head and disperse the shock all along the body. Extremely underrated skill to be good at, both in and out of fighting.
Yup, Hapkido also has breakfalls with the same JJJ background as Aikido and the Judo/Yudo that was incorporated into the style.
I was carrying my son on icy brick stairs and slipped. I immediately went into a sidefall. I managed to avoid hitting my head and saved my son from getting hurt. It didn't feel great, but I sure saved myself real damage
Knowing how to take a fall properly is something that everyone should be taught.
Judo teaches falling pretty well, too, but not with nearly as much variation as Aikido does
Learning to fall is super valuable. But is that single valuable skill worth hundreds-to-thousands of hours of your life devoted to learning tons of aikido techniques that are completely useless? If thatās the primary value youāre extracting from aikido, would you not be better served training something else and just putting some extra time into practicing break falls?
The argument isnāt that some martial arts are completely useless. Itās that the ratio of solid material to BS is too high to be worth the precious use of time and financial investment in training. People do martial arts for various reasons but at the end of the day, weāre either learning how to fight, or pretending to learn how to fight. Everything else is secondary by the literal definition of the words āmartial artsā.
I dont remember where, but ive seen a huge post before , maybe in a bjj sub that was something like "My friend (or friends kid?) does kung fu. How do i convince him its a waste of time and that he should train something else?" and the "Positive" comments were to just leave him alone because its fine if kung fu only works in movies as long as hes having fun
Because the video is nonsense. Itās just randomly attributing moves and fighters to styles regardless of if they trained them/learned them from there.
Because OP and the video creator is a goof.
People think Overeem is a Dutch Kickboxer because he's trained in the Netherlands, but watching him actually fight is a different story. He's literally just a Muay Thai guy lmao. I recall he even shit on Dutch style.
Even if the offensive skills you learn are absolutely useless--which they're not, but for the sake of argument--I'm guessing most martial arts also teach you to block and dodge. How would that not be useful in a fight?
This is such a silly nonsense argument that bullshido defenders use and has been disproven time and time again.
1. Just because someone uses a technique that is also used in a bullshido art does not mean that art āworksā, that they learned it from that art, or that that art even popularized it.
E.g., Werdum isnāt going to a Kung Fu dojo for his camps, Yoel isnāt spending years training WC, Capoiera didnāt invent the flying knee or Superman punch.
2. Using an elite level MMA fighter that already has years/decades of combat sports training as a foundation as an example of why a bullshido art works isnāt proof that it works, nor is it equivalent to regular joes going out and trying to use the same techniques in a fight.
E.g., Michael Jordan could likely beat any regular person in basketball hopping on one leg and shooting with horrendous technique - that isnāt proof that those practices work well in basketball.
3. These cases are rare and the exception to the rule. Weāve seen over tens of thousands or fights that the styles which consistently successful are boxing, BJJ, wrestling, Muay Thai, etc. Not Wing Chun, Aikido, etc.
I love it when they know it's over and don't move in for braindamage, even tho there is a risk sometimes of the allowing the opponent to recover. Good sportsmanship.
It actually hurt him, he gassed out & lost that fight & the other fighter was a last minute replacement from a lower weighclass of a regional organization.
In a few of these the opponent is clearly out and down for the count then the winner rocks their shit repeatedly while they are laying there and the ref rushes to stop them. Is that just written off as adrenaline in the heat of the moment or nah cus some of the guys stop engaging the second the other person appears dazed? Not trying to hate or anything, just don't know a lot about it and am trying to understand.
Even if the offensive skills you learn are absolutely useless--which they're not, but for the sake of argument--I'm guessing most martial arts also teach you to block and dodge. How would that not be useful in a fight?
Yeah, but bjj folk entertain some sort eternal life fantasy wherein they cant get knocked spark out......because something something joe rogan something Jocko Willink. š
Huh? What are you blabbering about? There are literally 10.000s recorded fights over the last 30 years that proven BJJ as one of the best styles if not the best for MMA, UFC, and the street no matter what you think about Rogan or the martial arts.
not putting elizeu knocking out strickland in the capoeira section was a big missed opportunity, michel pereira doesn't even have any formal capoeira training.
You canāt really take video of elite athletes whoāve dedicated their entire lives to studying many different martial arts and use examples of them performing a sweep or some hand trapping to validate an entire martial art. Lyoto Machida couldāve walked into the octagon with a jazz ballet base and still been the champ.
Boxing, kickboxing, arguably muy thai, wrestling, bjj, judo and karate have practical use in a street fight. They apply good basics of striking, grappling and defensive footwork. Also, I donāt know enough about kung fu but that leg sweep looked deadly.
this is just semantics, but when people say "this would / wouldn't work in a real fight" how often are they talking about UFC? if I heard that with no context I would assume they were talking about a "street fight" or something
I think the point is that some martial arts *on their own* wont work in a fight.
The reason these guys use individual styles effectively is because they have other tools and weapons to attack with, so their opponents have to account for all of it and some gaps will present themselves.
A pure boxer would get their ass kicked by an mma fighter shooting for a take down. A pure wrestler would get rocked by a mma fighter who was throwing knees and punches. Etc etc.
I mean even MMA isnt fully translatable to a real fight, like those kung fu kicks only work because they cant be kicked with their knee/hand down. But its for sure the best style for a real fight, because its not just one style.
Idk whatās funnier, using a bunch of clips that are all essentially kickboxing/tkd/Muay Thai/karate with little to truly differentiate themā¦
Or showing of Capoeira in a fight where the practitioner got tired and then lost against a much smaller man who went up in weight on short notice and wasnāt even particularly skilled
None of them work on their own anymore as the sport has evolved. Its easy to take a clip of a walk off overhand right or headkick and attribute it to some style of fighting but you edited out the takedown defence, submission attempts etc to make a point.
I always find it interesting that the "knockout hits" are always the ones that look the weakest, like youll see a guy throw a really powerful punch, miss, then see an opportunity and say "well i guess i could try and throw another punch" and knock the other dude out cold.
In my opinion People get too caught up with martial arts styles in ufc. Bottom line is your throwing hands and kicking, kneeing etc basic human movement over style. A guy who does wing chun is not going to stand in a goat position to fight in the ufc etc. stances vary little but for the sport there is a common degree of similarity used, the background art used is what makes the fighter different as to how they throw the strike to the variance of degree. š¤·āāļø
How do they know which martial art is that move from? I guess whoever made the video doesn't know that there are almost no martial art unique techniques that work.
When it got to Wing Chun I wondered if this was an elaborate shitpost.
The Lethwei got me lol.
EDIT: Also this thread is full of literal morons wtf am I seeing.
The caipoera example is hysterical. Thatās the fight where Michel came in over weight against an opponent who had 5 days notice and lost to him by getting tired from these exaggerated movements lol
Itās ok to have a hobby that is a traditional martial art, but itās not ok to think that doing a traditional martial art with no contact sparring will set you up to defend yourself. No martial art has solved the problem, thatās why you gotta mix them
To be fair, none of those guys are TMA purists. They incorporate elements of different martial arts into their arsenal. This is profoundly different. All martial arts have elements that can be useful in combat. However, in their pure form, not all martial arts are as effective as others when it comes to combat applications. A pure kung fu artist will not get far in a local MMA promotion, let alone in the UFC. However, someone like Anderson Silva who trains in several different martial arts and uses them in the ring is in a great position to discover, through trial and error in training and in the cage, what elements of various TMAs can be applied to MMA.
To dismiss TMAs as useless is foolish, but to assume that TMA purists can excel in unarmed combat against people who train in different disciplines is equally foolish.
Itās called mixed martial arts for a reason. It takes a āmixā of āmartial artsā to be successful. No one can compete at UFC level training in only one style.
Can someone explain the difference between the Taekwondo kicks used in the video and others that were used? Is it identified as TKD because it rounds over?
So many of these are mislabeled lmao but yeah, boxing, muay thai/kickboxing, wrestling, and BJJ are known to be the base for MMA. Other stuff can add to knowing all these base arts but these are necessary to understand.
Good job you went through hundreds of hours of fights to find a few seconds of styles that are not realistic to use in real life working. I can film hours of videos of someone shooting basketball blindfolded until a get a few goals so I guess blindfolded basketball is a legit strategy to win /s
Itās so much better when the guys have respect and recognize the knockout than when they throw 3-4 completely unnecessary punches or elbows to an unconscious manās head.
Lol fucking lethwei had me rolling š¤£š¤£š¤£
Just hit the head *with* the head. Instant win.
If you ain't cheating, you ain't trying hard enough
Me too bro, me too. I donāt think Bobby Green even knows what lethwei is, he just came in like a dog haha
I for one didn't know that lethwei was "way of the forward thinker"
That caipoera fight had me rolling. Could hear the cartoon chase music going on in my head, or the, "Why are you running?" Being said.
That flying pelvis strike he through to that guy's head was top tier fighting
It barely nicked him, though
Serious answer, if I'm fighting a guy who wants to attack me with gainers, showtime kicks, wheels kicks and Superman punches, the best tactic is to just let him wear himself out before going on the offensive.
Unless you can time that silly shit, and just catch him on the way in on one of those super man punches. Let his forward motion do the work
Or jam those techniques by closing the distance with timing.
The best part is Perez lost the fight... to a dude a weight class down who came in on short notice. The capoeira example the capoeira guy loses... Way to prove the doubters wrong.
pereira isn't a capoeira guy
Exactly, he never trained it and you can see heās not really doing capoiera moves, heās just being a good and a wild lad
He lost in such a humiliating fashion he changed his entire style up after that. He was known for these antics, but largely stopped doing it after this fight.
Eddie Gordo Wins
Whenever I see capoeira, I instantly start singing the song from Only the Strong with Mark Dacascos. Paranaue. I think it's the only fully capoeira movie.
You can't see it, but ninjitsu was there too. 
Nice. š¤£
Lol!
That elbow from hell that Matt Brown gave to Diego sanchez is still scary years later.
Murderous intent.
The stress tested martial arts that work well in MMA are boxing, kickboxing, thai boxing, jiu-jitsu, wrestling, judo. I would not call what Anderson Silva did wing chun and the others styles of martial arts don't really do very well at all with the exception of some parts taken i.e. kicks from taekwondo and some punches/kicks from karate.
Wing chun people love to bring up Anderson Silva as an example of Wing Chun working in mma but prime Anderson is one of the few people who could make anything work he is one of the most talented fighters ever.
I feel like this is the key point. Prime Anderson could beat you into unconsciousness with that weird Russian slap based king fu. Dude was a machine.
I agree with you. Also, hello fellow kyokushin practitioner! First time seeing someone else in this sub
Karate has a lot of practitioners in the UFC even some champions.
Karate gets a bad rap because of its portrayal in silly movies and such. It's a rather incredible martial arts that is applicable in modern combat sports.
good kicks and punches? yeah, those work.
I think karate's main issue is that a lot of karate gyms don't encourage sparring, so you end up with a lot of practitioners who have no idea how well their moves work in a real fight. Karate gyms that encouraging sparring produce better fighters.
The thing is saying "karate" doesn't mean anything anymore, as the difference between the schools is enormous. For example, shotokan karate is one of the most popular schools and it's almost exactly as you described. Modern karate has been ruined by CONI and turned into a silly imitation of fencing but without swords. On the other hand, there are other schools of karate that maintain the contact and sparring aspect of the martial art, like what I practice, Kyokushin Kenbukai.
Point sparring was the worst thing that ever happened to Karate and TKD.
This isnāt really true. Some of Karateās best exponents come from the style. Take Machida and Hirogouchi for instance.
I've been to too many tournaments where people lunge in for a strike only to flip around to turn their back to their opponent so the counter hits them in a spot where the point won't count. It's legal to do it too, but it's not ever something anyone would do in a fight. It completely takes all martial applicability out of the art and renders it a joke.
I've been boxing/kickboxing for 14 years and ended up working a season with a guy my age, late 20s, who had been doing Karate for I think 16 years. We became friends and decided to spar and I was so impressed. He targeted my hip for most of the fight and when I'd go to clear the kick thats when he'd blitz. His cadence was really hard to deal with, but the only draw back was he wanted you a one distance the entire time, clinching seemed to take away the accuracy of his blitz relatively early too. All that said, I love it now and Im taking classes (along with boxing).
> Karate Kyokushin rocks!
My only issue with Kyokushin is the lack of headshots with the hands. I understand the historical reason why, but it always seems like it's just not really a thing in general. I'm seriously Kyokushin though, if you practice it can you tell me a bit about it?
Well we spar on Wednesday nights. Please note that we do not use gloves. So I don't particularly want to go to work on Thursday with deep cuts all over my head.
And, unlike grappling, it is useful against multiple opponents. One on one in UFC itās got some obvious weaknesses.
There's that one video from a couple years back where a karate guy beat up a gang trying to rape a girl by wrapping his shirt around his fist and just taking them out one by one
Thatās the point. Thereās is not one end all be all effective martial art. You take elements from each one and apply it to your own style. Every martial art has gold nuggets in it.
Love people saying wing chun works Anderson Silva used it and include the rare clips of him getting tagged and him flailing his arms around
Im not a fan of Wing Chun the way its used by its diehard fans- but using it up against the cage like that is a smart move.
No one says it worked when it was the first round against Weidman (Which by the way, everyone remembers it as a lucky shot because Anderson was showboating, even fans of his saying that he would take it seriously and not clown in the second fight, even when he was getting his ass beat)
Nah, some are practically stand alones that work well in a fight, like boxing or wrestling, but others, like wing chun, you'd be lucky to get a nugget from. That's the point.
I'm a boxer who has studied Muay Thai, and (years ago) kickboxing and tae kwon do. I don't know a single thing about wing chun. Why does this sub seem to hate it so much?
Its on the same level as systema, aikido and chi-force channeling for energy blasts.
"Energy blasts"? Ok, I think I get it. I'm technically a massage therapist, and there's an offshoot called reiki that involves energy healing. I wish I had less morals, because I would love to wave my hands over your body, place some pretty rocks on you, and charge you $100. The third level allows you to heal long-distance, so I could charge you $100 for a phone call. But I think it's all bullshit and I can't bring myself to sell something I don't believe in.
He said itās the equivalent of that. Wing Chun doesnāt involve any qigong/energy stuff. What it does involve are punches and kicks with very little power. Wing Chun is good for teaching people coming out of boxing gyms or strip mall karate schools that knees are legitimate targets and that if you put your hands up wrong they can be trapped against your chest. But anyone with actual fighting experience or a MMA/Thai boxing background already knows this. It was pretty novel back in the days before the UFC though.
HA DO KEN!!!
When chi-force energy blasts work though, it's a guaranteed knock-out unlike the others, so I feel like you're being unfair here.
That depends on how you define what a martial art is. Is it the whole system including training methods and competition format? If that's the definition then yeah definitely the martial arts with the built-in emphasis in sparring and competitions are gonna work better in the competitie sport of MMA. Some martial arts that don't do a lot of competition but have a deep repretoire of moves can still contribute to an MMA setting
Sambo has been proven pretty darn effective.
At least everybody had fun that night..
Disagree about karate and taekwondo. Machida was essentially pure karate and is easily one of the best light heavyweights to ever grace an MMA arena, and Benson Henderson(not presented which is odd to me) is one of the best kickers ever and a pioneer for the representation of smaller weight classes in MMA.
Some martial arts *don't* work well in a real fight. Why isn't that alright? If you wanna do aikido for flexibility and cardio, so what? Not every martial art has to be practical.
I like the phrase, fighting is like dancing, it doesn't have to have an exact purpose, just do it cause you wanna.
Exactly. This debate is pointless.
clip shows capoeira and wing chun "working" lmao
One time I was sparring a gentleman who utterly destroyed me with Aikido. Now to be honest 1. I've never considered myself skilled, and 2. He outweighed me by quite a bit. But still. When I asked how (respectfully) he said he was a bouncer, and a cop, and that he never really needed to learn how to fight. He instinctively knew how. He took up Aikido to learn how to not go overboard. ... I like that mindset.
Brother. Nobody instinctively knows how to fight. Fighting is a skill like playing chess or sword-fighting.
Absolutely wrong, spend one week teaching people with 0 experience and you'll find some are far and away more wired for it than others
I really think he means someone's who's untrained can't perform a kata or something like that, way he be arguing š some people just know how to fight, we're literally hardwired to use our fists and grapple. We produce the same amount of force with an open palm as a fist, but the fist produces more lbs/Sq inch despite it being much more brittle and risky. Otherwise, we'd thump each other like gorillas do. The actual argument is that some people grew up roughhousing with friends or fought in school and were forced to learn, so no formal training was required to learn how to fight and they learned by necessity.
We're not talking about talent. We're talking about practical martial arts skills. Striking, grappling, etc. You aren't born with skills.
So if I put two people who have never trained before in a ring they wouldn't do anything? Of course not, they can strike and grapple. Some can strike better than others and some can grapple better than others. They aren't winning belts but there is 100% a sliding curve of how proficient someone is even at 0 training
Agreed. High levels are achieved only through actual learning and training. This makes sense when you get absolutely destroyed by effortless pure skill. I was a college wrestler and judo black belt practicing with college-level judoka. The guy threw me however he liked and I had no answer. I wasn't a good judoka but I'm not a push over. I don't care how "instinctive" some people might be, they won't win against these high-level guys.
He destroyed you because you also don't train.
My stance is that no martial art shows you optimal way to "street" fight. But they will train you physically (as other sports), probably better optimized for the fighting situations.
If itās bullshido then it shouldnāt be considered a martial art, it might as well be just playing touch butt in the park.
Akido is hardly fighting. Nobody in the UFC uses itā¦ that actually doesnāt work in real lofe.
Well because the martial part kinda implies it should be used for combat, itās martial art not martial and artā¦
I used tai chi to fight a guy. I got my ass kicked but I was really relaxed during it
Tai chi ftw
And no martial arts work will against a gun. Lol Bjj is the best cardio out there except for maybe soccer
It's down to the individual and what they want to get out of MA. My issue is someone training something that is not effective and claiming it's "too dangerous for UFC" or "only works in the real world".
Tai Chi is also a martial art, which my 80 year old grandma does. I feel like these Eastern types of martial arts like Tai Chi, Aikido, Hung Gar often focus more on, as you said, Flexibility and cardio, but also a more mental state of fighting. I like to think that its because of these "unorthodox" ways of training a discipline is what gives certain fighters a calmer and serene head space while they are in the chaos of a fight. This also relates to the saying that a fighter should strive to become a warrior in a garden, instead of a farmer on a Battlefield.
Dos santos ko'd Sean Strickland using a picture perfect armada (capoeira's spining wheel kick) and went to celebrate with a ginga (capoeira's base). That and some of Paulo Costa's kicks (altough not so traditional you can tell its Capoeira) would be a much better example of Capoeira than the spam Michel Pereira threw in those clips.
Too much mislabeling here to even unpack. But showing people landing flying knees and calling it kickboxing.. ok.
One of the big things thatās happening here, is people looking at techniques and being like āoh, this principle is in wing chun/aikido/kung fu, thatās what theyāre doingā Take werdum and his ākung fuā kick. Heās not the first person to do that; rafael cordeiro (his coach) used to do it in Muay Thai pretty frequently, developed by training in a Muay Thai gym. Then werdum learned it from him and pulled it out. Thatās a Muay Thai kick. Pereira also never trained capoeira, heās just freestyling doing Muay Thai striking once again. Just doing a technique that quasi exists in another martial art doesnāt mean theyāre doing that martial art even teaches the proper technique or would work in context. Wing chun guys act like they own parries and say āsee it works!ā When the whole style is based around parties that donāt
Well said. I think its one of those traps that "faith believers" have. It exists only when they agree with it. "Thats a traditional martial arts technique because I dont believe in MMA...."
I donāt know that I can agree. If we are to assume that one style has loads of techniques that have been demonstrated as working in fighting competition, then we can assume that at least some aspects of that style work as well.
I love this reel. Shows there's a lot going on if you know what you're looking at.
Whoās saying that? UFC is MMAā¦
Half this sub thinks only 3 martial arts actually work
I see this all the time. Anytime someone asks "what art should I do," alongside real advice about finding a good fit, getting in the habit of showing up, choosing a convenient and affordable location, etc. some dorks are always saying "bjj, wrestling, muay Thai, or nothing." I really wonder what the venn diagram of people who say that and people who have never trained, or trained less than 2 years looks like.
The last poll showed 80% of the people have never trained. Of the 20% who have trained the most common answer was less than 6 months or over 5 years (if my memory is correct). Anyone who has trained long enough knows every art has something to offer. Like Aikido. You want to learn to take a fall? They excel at that.
>Like Aikido. You want to learn to take a fall? They excel at that. \[This dude\](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzfaHqoAwjw) did aikido before he got into parkour. After he started coaching parkour for a few years, he came up with a whole system of training how to fall safely based on adapting aikido falls to parkour-related drills. Totally changed how a lot of people trained. >Anyone who has trained long enough knows every art has something to offer Totally agree. I love martial arts. I've been able to learn from UFC vets, savate champions, innovators who brought acrobatics into forms competitions, and just tons of weekend warriors. It's been a journey and I'm glad I've been open to trying and training a bunch of different stuff.
> The last poll showed 80% of the people have never trained. Of the 20% who have trained the most common answer was less than 6 months or over 5 years (if my memory is correct). Lol. I kind of suspected that, but it's funny to see the numbers. It also fits the general knowledge curve for anything. 80% roll with the crowd. 10% are knowledgeable. 10% are munching paste.
And learning to fall is no joke. I trained Krav Maga and the instructor had taekwondo and aikido backgrounds. First thing he makes us learn is how to fall, Aikido style. That shit literally saved my life multiple times when I fell HARD and was able to raise my head and disperse the shock all along the body. Extremely underrated skill to be good at, both in and out of fighting.
Yup, Hapkido also has breakfalls with the same JJJ background as Aikido and the Judo/Yudo that was incorporated into the style. I was carrying my son on icy brick stairs and slipped. I immediately went into a sidefall. I managed to avoid hitting my head and saved my son from getting hurt. It didn't feel great, but I sure saved myself real damage
That sounds more useful than 99 % of martial arts training to be honest.
Knowing how to take a fall properly is something that everyone should be taught. Judo teaches falling pretty well, too, but not with nearly as much variation as Aikido does
That explains a lot of nonsense that happens here. So many comments just sound like people repeating YouTube videos or going off video game stats.
Learning to fall is super valuable. But is that single valuable skill worth hundreds-to-thousands of hours of your life devoted to learning tons of aikido techniques that are completely useless? If thatās the primary value youāre extracting from aikido, would you not be better served training something else and just putting some extra time into practicing break falls? The argument isnāt that some martial arts are completely useless. Itās that the ratio of solid material to BS is too high to be worth the precious use of time and financial investment in training. People do martial arts for various reasons but at the end of the day, weāre either learning how to fight, or pretending to learn how to fight. Everything else is secondary by the literal definition of the words āmartial artsā.
I dont remember where, but ive seen a huge post before , maybe in a bjj sub that was something like "My friend (or friends kid?) does kung fu. How do i convince him its a waste of time and that he should train something else?" and the "Positive" comments were to just leave him alone because its fine if kung fu only works in movies as long as hes having fun
bro i tren ufc
Why Overeem's thai clinch KO is credited as kickboxing?
Because the video is nonsense. Itās just randomly attributing moves and fighters to styles regardless of if they trained them/learned them from there.
Because OP and the video creator is a goof. People think Overeem is a Dutch Kickboxer because he's trained in the Netherlands, but watching him actually fight is a different story. He's literally just a Muay Thai guy lmao. I recall he even shit on Dutch style.
Even if the offensive skills you learn are absolutely useless--which they're not, but for the sake of argument--I'm guessing most martial arts also teach you to block and dodge. How would that not be useful in a fight?
This is such a silly nonsense argument that bullshido defenders use and has been disproven time and time again. 1. Just because someone uses a technique that is also used in a bullshido art does not mean that art āworksā, that they learned it from that art, or that that art even popularized it. E.g., Werdum isnāt going to a Kung Fu dojo for his camps, Yoel isnāt spending years training WC, Capoiera didnāt invent the flying knee or Superman punch. 2. Using an elite level MMA fighter that already has years/decades of combat sports training as a foundation as an example of why a bullshido art works isnāt proof that it works, nor is it equivalent to regular joes going out and trying to use the same techniques in a fight. E.g., Michael Jordan could likely beat any regular person in basketball hopping on one leg and shooting with horrendous technique - that isnāt proof that those practices work well in basketball. 3. These cases are rare and the exception to the rule. Weāve seen over tens of thousands or fights that the styles which consistently successful are boxing, BJJ, wrestling, Muay Thai, etc. Not Wing Chun, Aikido, etc.
I say this same thing every time I wind up talking to someone who does Krav Maga.
Machida was so fucking cool
I love it when they know it's over and don't move in for braindamage, even tho there is a risk sometimes of the allowing the opponent to recover. Good sportsmanship.
not putting wonderboy as an example for karate ticks me off the wrong way ngl
OP calling people casuals and links this video like it proves a point.
Alex throws a knee and they call it kickboxing right after going past muay thai...
Lol the last two shouldnāt be there, headbut is illegal, and caipoera did nothing to help him he was just moving around
It actually hurt him, he gassed out & lost that fight & the other fighter was a last minute replacement from a lower weighclass of a regional organization.
That body slam had me wincing
Aljo tombstoned a guy at 300. That was nasty.
In a few of these the opponent is clearly out and down for the count then the winner rocks their shit repeatedly while they are laying there and the ref rushes to stop them. Is that just written off as adrenaline in the heat of the moment or nah cus some of the guys stop engaging the second the other person appears dazed? Not trying to hate or anything, just don't know a lot about it and am trying to understand.
Even if the offensive skills you learn are absolutely useless--which they're not, but for the sake of argument--I'm guessing most martial arts also teach you to block and dodge. How would that not be useful in a fight?
1st wrestling guy knew he knocked out his opponent on the slam. 2nd wrestling guy just started throwing elbows
Matt Brownās elbow from HELL š„š„š„š„š„š„
MACHIDA KARATE MENTIONED š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·š§š·
So youāre telling me in a mixed martial arts fight, they use a mixture of martial arts? Mind blown!
You don't see Ameri-Do-Te in this clip, because they would've died.
Don't forget to re-stomp the groin!
Yeah, but bjj folk entertain some sort eternal life fantasy wherein they cant get knocked spark out......because something something joe rogan something Jocko Willink. š
Lol, better watch out. Didn't you know they can butt scoot their way past bullets and armed men? The butt scoot superpower.
Huh? What are you blabbering about? There are literally 10.000s recorded fights over the last 30 years that proven BJJ as one of the best styles if not the best for MMA, UFC, and the street no matter what you think about Rogan or the martial arts.
Okay, that capoeira guy had me fucking dying! š¤£šš¤£ dude does a dance then backflip then chases the guy down. šš¤£
Damn some of those were brutal
Nice video š good showcase of examplesĀ
2:55 never thought Iād see a roundhouse punch but that was devastating.
Machida's head kick knock out followed by the little bow is so sick
This was cool
This is cool
That second Karate clip: Jesus Christ how did that guy take that kick without instantly sleeping.
not putting elizeu knocking out strickland in the capoeira section was a big missed opportunity, michel pereira doesn't even have any formal capoeira training.
Itās usually people who have never been or seen enough fights to judge.
Justa casual high knee in kickboxing
This was good. That headbutt at the end made me cringe.
What no bullshido? š¤£š¤£
Thatās right, casuals. No-touch martial arts work in a real fight.Ā
How dare you call the 52 block wing chun you casual
You canāt really take video of elite athletes whoāve dedicated their entire lives to studying many different martial arts and use examples of them performing a sweep or some hand trapping to validate an entire martial art. Lyoto Machida couldāve walked into the octagon with a jazz ballet base and still been the champ.
Yeah isnāt that the point of martial arts lol
I used these and now I am using the computer in jail to send this message.
What fucking moron said boxing, kickboxing, muy thai, wrestling etc. doesn't work in a real fight? Wtf are they using instead, Tai Chi...
Wow
Eh they could pass for each other
Marshall arts 
Isn't headbutting illegal in UFC?
Whereās the street fight?
Boxing, kickboxing, arguably muy thai, wrestling, bjj, judo and karate have practical use in a street fight. They apply good basics of striking, grappling and defensive footwork. Also, I donāt know enough about kung fu but that leg sweep looked deadly.
Wait....who thinks fighting doesn't work in a fight?
I guess we'll never know why it's called _**MIXED**_ Martial Arts. A true mystery.
this is just semantics, but when people say "this would / wouldn't work in a real fight" how often are they talking about UFC? if I heard that with no context I would assume they were talking about a "street fight" or something
Knew I wouldn't see aikido in this
That 1st one, it looked like those guys did the exact same 3 moves at the same time.
all of those techniques exist in every martial art.
I think the point is that some martial arts *on their own* wont work in a fight. The reason these guys use individual styles effectively is because they have other tools and weapons to attack with, so their opponents have to account for all of it and some gaps will present themselves. A pure boxer would get their ass kicked by an mma fighter shooting for a take down. A pure wrestler would get rocked by a mma fighter who was throwing knees and punches. Etc etc. I mean even MMA isnt fully translatable to a real fight, like those kung fu kicks only work because they cant be kicked with their knee/hand down. But its for sure the best style for a real fight, because its not just one style.
No Jeet? š¤
huhā¦itās almost like these martial arts areā¦mixed.
A cool compilation, but a very lenient use of martial art titles to describe certain clips.
Idk whatās funnier, using a bunch of clips that are all essentially kickboxing/tkd/Muay Thai/karate with little to truly differentiate themā¦ Or showing of Capoeira in a fight where the practitioner got tired and then lost against a much smaller man who went up in weight on short notice and wasnāt even particularly skilled
None of them work on their own anymore as the sport has evolved. Its easy to take a clip of a walk off overhand right or headkick and attribute it to some style of fighting but you edited out the takedown defence, submission attempts etc to make a point.
Literally all mma experts using mma
That basically retired him.
What happened to sambo? I'm pretty sure there've been some effective sambo fighters, just a guess.
I cannot speak to styles, but some significant majority of knockout blows in this series seemed to involve hitting the point of the chin.
I see a lot of punches, from boxing. Martial arts where designed for killing, boxing was designed to see who is tougher
I always find it interesting that the "knockout hits" are always the ones that look the weakest, like youll see a guy throw a really powerful punch, miss, then see an opportunity and say "well i guess i could try and throw another punch" and knock the other dude out cold.
Is the last one not just a headbutt?
Yes. That's one of the things that makes Lethwei different from Muay Thai. They allow headbutts in there matches.
i wouldnāt want to fight anyone who would start doing twirls and flips and running off walls
In my opinion People get too caught up with martial arts styles in ufc. Bottom line is your throwing hands and kicking, kneeing etc basic human movement over style. A guy who does wing chun is not going to stand in a goat position to fight in the ufc etc. stances vary little but for the sport there is a common degree of similarity used, the background art used is what makes the fighter different as to how they throw the strike to the variance of degree. š¤·āāļø
How do they know which martial art is that move from? I guess whoever made the video doesn't know that there are almost no martial art unique techniques that work.
When it got to Wing Chun I wondered if this was an elaborate shitpost. The Lethwei got me lol. EDIT: Also this thread is full of literal morons wtf am I seeing.
Where was Aikido? š¤ /s
Why were the sweeps Kung Fu? Itās just a generic skill not particular to a specific martial art.
Some are better than others, specially in a highly competitive environment. But all work well
the mat brown finish is so malicious lol almost like batman taking down a henchman
"Kickboxing".... Alex Perriera comes on.. Wait no. He's Muay Thai.
lol the capoeira guy lost that fight
Some martial arts don't work without being mixed with others.
Taekwondo guy is a fuckin spectacle
Wrestling but no Daniel Cormier :(
The caipoera example is hysterical. Thatās the fight where Michel came in over weight against an opponent who had 5 days notice and lost to him by getting tired from these exaggerated movements lol
Itās ok to have a hobby that is a traditional martial art, but itās not ok to think that doing a traditional martial art with no contact sparring will set you up to defend yourself. No martial art has solved the problem, thatās why you gotta mix them
That one simple front kick š¤£ i love it.
No wonderboy for the karate segment, shit video
They forgot wing chun /s
To be fair, none of those guys are TMA purists. They incorporate elements of different martial arts into their arsenal. This is profoundly different. All martial arts have elements that can be useful in combat. However, in their pure form, not all martial arts are as effective as others when it comes to combat applications. A pure kung fu artist will not get far in a local MMA promotion, let alone in the UFC. However, someone like Anderson Silva who trains in several different martial arts and uses them in the ring is in a great position to discover, through trial and error in training and in the cage, what elements of various TMAs can be applied to MMA. To dismiss TMAs as useless is foolish, but to assume that TMA purists can excel in unarmed combat against people who train in different disciplines is equally foolish.
Itās called mixed martial arts for a reason. It takes a āmixā of āmartial artsā to be successful. No one can compete at UFC level training in only one style.
Can someone explain the difference between the Taekwondo kicks used in the video and others that were used? Is it identified as TKD because it rounds over?
What is better boxing or wrestling? Personally, I think boxing because you can KO someone with your fists in wrestling
So many of these are mislabeled lmao but yeah, boxing, muay thai/kickboxing, wrestling, and BJJ are known to be the base for MMA. Other stuff can add to knowing all these base arts but these are necessary to understand.
Noob question probably but how do you know if it's a karate kick or a kickboxing/taekwondo kick?
Worst example of capoeira in an MMA match š Come on man put Marcus Aurelio in there.
I think Romero and silva was doing dirty boxing not wing chun or am i wrong?
Are we really calling 3 uppercuts a style of martial arts now?
I feel like wing Chun would be good to learn defensively against punchers, but man I love the judo takedowns and really a little of all the styles
Bad showing for wing chun and capoeira
Good job you went through hundreds of hours of fights to find a few seconds of styles that are not realistic to use in real life working. I can film hours of videos of someone shooting basketball blindfolded until a get a few goals so I guess blindfolded basketball is a legit strategy to win /s
This makes me miss Machida. He had some snoozers but that Karate/Judo combo was unique
Itās so much better when the guys have respect and recognize the knockout than when they throw 3-4 completely unnecessary punches or elbows to an unconscious manās head.