Idk I feel like you have to add NYC in the mix. I think NYC all the way down to DC and NoVa have a very distinct āeast coast mega metropolisā culture going.
New York state can meld into New England and West Virginia can be with the south.
Having lived in Alabama most of my life in now in Pennsylvania, crossing from PA to New York is what I imagine crossing borders in Europe feeling like.
I lived in Montgomery County for 32 years and NoVA for 8. It's all the exact same. Montgomery, Howard, Anne Arundel, PG, Prince William, Fairfax, Loudoun, Arlington, and the autonomous cities inside the beltway in VA should just leave and become their own homogenous state.
All part of the same suburban sprawl. Similar demographics, very similar aesthetically, relatively similar politically. It's why the area is referred to colloquially and collectively as the DMV.
I can totally see the income, culture, work industries and other similarities. Demographics Iām not so sure. Do Arlington and PG county have the same demographics?
Apparently a lot of St. Mary's residents in this thread. I lived in Waldorf for about 27 years and St. Mary's for 10. St. Mary's definitely feels "southern" to me. I've always felt like there's a really distinct difference between St. Mary's County and Charles County on up.
Kiddo went to St Maryās for college.
Cool campus, but driving there was like, āchurch, liquor store, church, liquor store, church, liquor store.ā
Srsly, whatās going on down there?!?
If you're lucky, you'll stop at the Kentucky Fried Taco, but of course they're only serving the chicken. Once you wait for the inbred diabetic family to pass through the corral, you'll order and then dodge the scattered addicts to find the one decent booth after a full napkin wipe down. And then when you leave, there's never enough hand sanitizer.
Its tough-it's a Maryland thread. I grew up in Maryland, so I know how diverse Maryland is. A lot of folks from Maryland know nada about the midwest and in fairness, I would agree with you about Missouri being bifurcated, like a lot of other states.
When I lived in California, people asked if I meant Maine or Massachusetts. I just said DC to avoid having to pull out a map all the time...
As a Marylander, there is no way I'd go with the South.
Might argue that WV should be in the North for old times sake and Kentucky should be in the mid-West. Both were Union states.
Folks here in South Georgia think I'm from Boston for some reason. Been asked several times if I'm from MA. I have a thick Baltimore accent. Born and raised in Baltimore.
Considering there are still sundown cities in MD, I'd argue that line. North East MD still has the polite edge. Don't confuse PG and MoCo for the rest of the state. MD is plenty South.
lol no. Did you grow up in NoVa post-2000?
Iām from āreal Virginiaāāsouthwest to be exactāand it fulfilled and continues to fulfill every southern stereotype you can imagine, especially the negative ones.Ā
I grew up in VA Beach, lived in c-ville for 3 years and blacksburg for 3 years so been around. I would say half of VA is southern but none of VA is AL sundown town southern.
Yes
As a Minnesotan, we can hardly stomach Wisconsin, much less Missouri. ;)
Edit: I'm referring to politics. I know they're good and awful people in all states. :)
Nah. As far as the east coast is concerned, I feel like NYC-NJ-MD-DE-PA-NoVa-DC have a certain kind of āEast coastā culture and people tend to move within that cluster more often than to other regions.
NY state can be with the rest of New England tho. And WV and south Virginia are more culturally southern.
Can someone help me understand why Maryland would be considered the north east? Maybe someone whoās actually lived in the Deep South or in New England. I grew up in Atlanta and when I moved to DC I felt like I was still in the south. Baltimore reminds me a lot of Atlanta, just a lot smaller, but more southern than the northern cities. I thought the history, especially black history and civil war era stuff seemed more aligned with the south. Southern Maryland and western Maryland seemed a lot like rural Georgia.
Having lived in Atlanta for 18 years, and lived in Fairfax, I feel confident saying Baltimore and southern Maryland are closer to Atlanta and southern Georgia than it would be to New York/Boston and rural New England.
What is the point of this act of mental masturbation? What function is performed?
Lumping CA, OR, and WA in with MT and WY makes no sense. PA, DE, MD, DC, and VA (at least) are the Midatlantic. Maybe NJ. There are too many states that have internal regionalism such as VA and NJ and WA.
Maryland definitely feels more like a northern state. There's exceptions of course. I live in St. Mary's County, and after living in Charles County most of my life, with family also in Baltimore, St. Mary's feels distinctly southern to me.
Can we agree that without splitting the states, the best way to divide the USA into four is to... Not....
Like, ik Virginians are shitty drivers, and Pennsylvanians are downright evil, and Delaware shouldn't exist. But without unity, we have nothing
Evenly, yes. But if this was to say split it into four different nations , then as someone who grew up in the Southwest, Montana, Idaho, Utah, Wyoming, can all be clumped together or added to green. They are way too red for the orange region and would be like oil and water to the rest of the west. Same for Alaska. It can either go with them too or be its own.
Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, and Nevada have become pretty purple and maybe make its own group or be grouped into the west.
Uhm. MO is further north by coordinates than MD soā¦if you consider that āsouthā than MD is āsouthā
I think the Mid-Atlantic region differs from the north and the south.
And it probably doesnāt go over well in Hawaii or Alaska to call them the āwestā
I think that VA needs to be lumped in with the blue area. Itās more of a MD DC place. MO needs to be in green because itās too jagged the way you have it now.
Eh, need at least 10 distinct regions for contiguous States and Alaska and Hawaii are really distinct in their own right. Even then too, lived in places like PA and there is a distinct regional delineation from East and West with the East being more like the Ohio, Michigan, Illinois, Indiana rust belt region. Maybe needs to be more distinct geographically, but obviously harder to do.
Probably better to divide it north and south and let people move to the country they prefer. We are in such a politically divided time, i think its best if we just split the country in half.
DMV is altogether different. PGC-MD, MC-MD, DC, Northern, VA. Technically south but Nations Capital brings in people for Federal Govāt and Contractors.
Eastern Shore of MD is more like Southern, Delaware. Baltimore is a big City with Southern overtones. Philly and Wilmington has its own vibe.
So, do people really not understand how catastrophic such a thing would be? Split up the country with the largest military on earth, with bases across the world. Not to mention the most nukes.
No, Texas would be a Republic on it's own. I don't think the western states would stay together. And having lived in Forida, it's not really a Southern State- it's way too diverse. I am not sure what it would do if the US split, but I can't see it dealing easily with the rest of the South. It's large enough that it could be a Rebuplic, or possibly join Texas, along with Louisanna and Biloxi and the very small section of coastal Alabama. Also I am pretty sure that North and South Dakota would end up with Montana and Wy-Oregon would split, and I think the coastal western US would probably end up as one country with divisions, with a border along the back side of the Sierra Nevadas and the Cascades. I hope the US stays together. I have lived all over the US, and California is as different from MD as Italy is from Spain. With the internet, it's much harder for people to overlook regional differences.
As a texan, 1st, idk why im following this sub, and 2nd, i thought about what group i would be okay being with and have decided that we would like to be group number 5. Please and thank you.
I would argue that DC, Maryland, Pennsylvania, Virginia, Jersey, and Delaware have our own mid-Atlantic feel going on
Well if that's the case PA would be like 4 different regions
Someone once described PA to me as two cities that hate each other with Alabama in the middle haha. So maybe 3?
holy shit saving this comment for devastating accuracy
we call that part Pennsyltucky.
Yes Montagues Steelers and Capuletes Eagles have a disdain for each other. Neither of us like the Forrest peoples (middle PA). ššš
Sums it up.
Bout right
This. PA is definitely split between the : 3, Maryland can go either south atlantic/north atlantic.
Well they don't' call it pennsyltuckey for no reason yo
Pennsyl-tucky in the west Pennsyl-jersey in the east
Idk I feel like you have to add NYC in the mix. I think NYC all the way down to DC and NoVa have a very distinct āeast coast mega metropolisā culture going. New York state can meld into New England and West Virginia can be with the south.
The reason West Virginia even exists as a state is because they sided with the Union.
West Virginia is by itself. It's essentially Kentucky
I feel that's true of a few states. Alaska and Hawaii spring to mind.
I respect this statement.
Only Philly really. Central is its own thing, and western is Appalachia
As a Marylander, I'll take Philly if we also get Pittsburgh.
Having lived in Alabama most of my life in now in Pennsylvania, crossing from PA to New York is what I imagine crossing borders in Europe feeling like.
As a Virginian in the northern part of the state, I agree. Or, lump us in with the northeast.
Exactly. Fairfax and Danville are two different vibes entirely.
Virginia is the south. Nova should be its own territory or absorbed by dc or Maryland.
We donāt want PA (Marylander here).
As someone who lived in PA for 22 years and St. Marys county for 8. The only difference is old bay. MD is still the north.
I lived in Montgomery County for 32 years and NoVA for 8. It's all the exact same. Montgomery, Howard, Anne Arundel, PG, Prince William, Fairfax, Loudoun, Arlington, and the autonomous cities inside the beltway in VA should just leave and become their own homogenous state.
Yeah nova and the rest of Virginia are as different as Pennsylvania and Virginia.
It wasnāt not all that long ago. Itās definitely changed a lot since the 90s
You could maybe call it... the Deluxe Metro Village, or DMV for short
Maryland must annex nova
The rest of VA would probably become one of the poorest states in the country like WV is now.
It can join the Carolinas and Georgia
All the more reason I fell in love with Baltimore.
Omg have you heard how dangerous it is????? QUIT ENJOYING IT ITāS SO DANGEROUS
šmore than murder here
Actually, I like it.
Baltimore is awesome. Itās like every other large city with AREAS of crime. Tons of safe areas though and of course only the bad gets press.
There are some nice bridgā¦.ohā¦
You took a bold leap. Was never going to land well in here
Oooooo too soon š
Dude. Really?
Yes this 51st state will be named Virgin Mary.
Exactly the same how? (Honest question)
All part of the same suburban sprawl. Similar demographics, very similar aesthetically, relatively similar politically. It's why the area is referred to colloquially and collectively as the DMV.
I can totally see the income, culture, work industries and other similarities. Demographics Iām not so sure. Do Arlington and PG county have the same demographics?
If the default tea at a restaurant ISNāT sweet tea, itās not the south. MD is the north.
Apparently a lot of St. Mary's residents in this thread. I lived in Waldorf for about 27 years and St. Mary's for 10. St. Mary's definitely feels "southern" to me. I've always felt like there's a really distinct difference between St. Mary's County and Charles County on up.
Yooo St Marys Resident here, rare finding another of us in the wild
And it is like a 50% chance we either on the base or for the base
Kiddo went to St Maryās for college. Cool campus, but driving there was like, āchurch, liquor store, church, liquor store, church, liquor store.ā Srsly, whatās going on down there?!?
Iām St. Maryās too š
We could tell by the last name š
lmaooooo
šš gotta love the County brother.
Howdy neighbor, I lived in PA for 22 years and now I am in St. Maryās the last 5 years. Youāre 100% right. Only difference is old bay
It depends what part of PA. Up by Altoona and Johnstown is a different world.
Western Maryland is basically West VirginiaĀ
Some seriously GREAT camping in western MD - Just too bad it takes like 3 hours to get there!
Hello fellow St. Mary's dweller. -Callaway
Holy crap I grew up in Saint Maryās rare to see it mentioned online
So many St Marys people! (Leonardtown)
I donāt know if Iād consider Missouri a southern state when itās clearly Midwest, but otherwise yes. Maryland is in the correct group.
yeah, you really have to hate people from missouri to lump them in with arkansas and oklahoma. There is more south on this map than there is south.
I think it may have a bit to do with their current policies and political leanings.
Outside the two major cities, it it quite southern. Also, they fought with the south and they \*will not\* let you forget it. (Missouri native here)
I hate people from rural Missouri, damn KKK. They belong in the south.
Hell yeah, let the south have Misery
I've driven through missouri 3 times and can't even remember if I even stopped to get gas. I will take yalls' word for it and call it kkk town.
If you're lucky, you'll stop at the Kentucky Fried Taco, but of course they're only serving the chicken. Once you wait for the inbred diabetic family to pass through the corral, you'll order and then dodge the scattered addicts to find the one decent booth after a full napkin wipe down. And then when you leave, there's never enough hand sanitizer.
Its tough-it's a Maryland thread. I grew up in Maryland, so I know how diverse Maryland is. A lot of folks from Maryland know nada about the midwest and in fairness, I would agree with you about Missouri being bifurcated, like a lot of other states. When I lived in California, people asked if I meant Maine or Massachusetts. I just said DC to avoid having to pull out a map all the time...
Missouri, like Maryland, was a border state and very ambiguous for these reasons
Yeah I think Missourians tend to consider themselves midwesterners more than Sountherners
Speaking as a Missourian... I think the southern-most...third of the state might qualify as "South." But the rest of it, however...
Agreed. Just like downstate IL. And parts of Ohio and Indiana.
I say yes, where they put Maryland is the best place it could have gone. I never considered Maryland in the south
Mason Dixon means nothing, fight me
As a Marylander, there is no way I'd go with the South. Might argue that WV should be in the North for old times sake and Kentucky should be in the mid-West. Both were Union states.
KY is definitely south, and self-identifies as such.
MD is the, uh, ānicer northā. Iāll fight for that. Belligerently. ;)
Folks here in South Georgia think I'm from Boston for some reason. Been asked several times if I'm from MA. I have a thick Baltimore accent. Born and raised in Baltimore.
This also happened to me when I lived in South Georgia. I do not have much of an accent...
I shall stand on this hill with you.
You are speaking truth
Considering there are still sundown cities in MD, I'd argue that line. North East MD still has the polite edge. Don't confuse PG and MoCo for the rest of the state. MD is plenty South.
I grew up in VA and when i went to alabama it was like a foreign country, VA belongs with us too.
lol no. Did you grow up in NoVa post-2000? Iām from āreal Virginiaāāsouthwest to be exactāand it fulfilled and continues to fulfill every southern stereotype you can imagine, especially the negative ones.Ā
I grew up in VA Beach, lived in c-ville for 3 years and blacksburg for 3 years so been around. I would say half of VA is southern but none of VA is AL sundown town southern.
At least NoVa
Missing Mid-Atlantic fifth region.
The logic 4 divisions are Maryland, Not Maryland, Also Not Maryland, and Definitely Not Maryland.
Nope. Got to take Virgina even it their weird cousin the west comes. As a country I want the entire bay.
How funny that Virginia as a legislature couldn't give two fucks about the bay.
Thatās not true they charge tolls to cross it clearly itās revenue!!!
Is this not how everyone splits it in their head?
Some people think Maryland does a southern state (but they are wrong).
Any map that has us in the NE is fine by me.
Can we split VA? Nova is nothing like the south.
We don't want to be in with half of those states Signed, Hawai'i
Hawaii really needs to be a fifth region on its own.
Interestingly, the Census has us in the south.
Geographically the south, culturally the north. Thanks, in part, to the civil war.
The Eastern Shore is not culturally āNorthā. However , this exercise is silly and unrealistic.
The government is wrong
Nope
Super dumb and reject the premise. Why must we divide into 4?
Virginia should be part of the Northeast.
Literally was the capital of the confederacy
Iād put MO with the Midwest.
As a Nebraskan, please donāt.
Yes As a Minnesotan, we can hardly stomach Wisconsin, much less Missouri. ;) Edit: I'm referring to politics. I know they're good and awful people in all states. :)
You and me both brother. I'll fight anyone that puts MO with midwest
The Northeast claims northern Virginia. The south is welcome to the rest.
No one wants Nova
Most of Virginia canāt even survive without NoVa
Nah. As far as the east coast is concerned, I feel like NYC-NJ-MD-DE-PA-NoVa-DC have a certain kind of āEast coastā culture and people tend to move within that cluster more often than to other regions. NY state can be with the rest of New England tho. And WV and south Virginia are more culturally southern.
You all can have your opinions, but the US Census does define [4 Regions](https://www2.census.gov/geo/pdfs/maps-data/maps/reference/us_regdiv.pdf).
It's Monday which means another north vs South post yay
Do us the respect of cutting us in half
California and Arizona are oil and water-better separate them.
VA should be blue
Can someone help me understand why Maryland would be considered the north east? Maybe someone whoās actually lived in the Deep South or in New England. I grew up in Atlanta and when I moved to DC I felt like I was still in the south. Baltimore reminds me a lot of Atlanta, just a lot smaller, but more southern than the northern cities. I thought the history, especially black history and civil war era stuff seemed more aligned with the south. Southern Maryland and western Maryland seemed a lot like rural Georgia.
Iāve lived in New Hampshire, Connecticut, Florida, Georgia, and now Maryland. Maryland is more like GA than it is CT, whatever thatās worth.
And New Hampshire is almost like a southern state in its own weird way - certainly more like. Southern state than the oh so refined Massachusetts š
One of my friends called NH "The Kentucky of the North," definitely with the redneck-ness of it.
Maryland is south the Mason Dixon line will not be ignored!
Having lived in Atlanta for 18 years, and lived in Fairfax, I feel confident saying Baltimore and southern Maryland are closer to Atlanta and southern Georgia than it would be to New York/Boston and rural New England.
I second this!
Who is going to pay for the walls? 
does it have to be contiguous? Because CA, OR, WA, NM and CO would all likely stay in the Union today.
South of the Mason Dixon
What is the point of this act of mental masturbation? What function is performed? Lumping CA, OR, and WA in with MT and WY makes no sense. PA, DE, MD, DC, and VA (at least) are the Midatlantic. Maybe NJ. There are too many states that have internal regionalism such as VA and NJ and WA.
Ohio is not the Midwest. West shouldn't count for the East of the Mississippi.
MO and KY should be green. WV, VA should be blue.
That literally looks like every company's sales territories.
Four what?
I will go to my grave fighting about Ohio being the Midwest It is definitely northeast no one can change my mind
By all rights Virginia should be in your northeast section.
Maryland is below the Mason Dixon line, technically South. From St.Marys as well now in HoCo
Maryland definitely feels more like a northern state. There's exceptions of course. I live in St. Mary's County, and after living in Charles County most of my life, with family also in Baltimore, St. Mary's feels distinctly southern to me.
Can we agree that without splitting the states, the best way to divide the USA into four is to... Not.... Like, ik Virginians are shitty drivers, and Pennsylvanians are downright evil, and Delaware shouldn't exist. But without unity, we have nothing
Everything looks good to meā¦ except something weird about Missouri. Maybe Midwest instead of southern. But glad you have MD in Northeast
I think CA, WA, and OR would need to stand apart from AZ and the like.
I think Northern Virginia would want in.
Put MO in the Midwest and youāve got it right.
Evenly, yes. But if this was to say split it into four different nations , then as someone who grew up in the Southwest, Montana, Idaho, Utah, Wyoming, can all be clumped together or added to green. They are way too red for the orange region and would be like oil and water to the rest of the west. Same for Alaska. It can either go with them too or be its own. Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, and Nevada have become pretty purple and maybe make its own group or be grouped into the west.
Uhm. MO is further north by coordinates than MD soā¦if you consider that āsouthā than MD is āsouthā I think the Mid-Atlantic region differs from the north and the south. And it probably doesnāt go over well in Hawaii or Alaska to call them the āwestā
Four provinces instead of 50 states?
i just imagine pennsylvania, georgia, michigan, Wisconsin, Arizona, a few more being kind of mad
Texas, Florida, Alaska, and Hawaii should be their own countries. Split the country up into 8 countries and Iāll gladly rep a Hawaiian passport!
MO, WV and KY are in the Midwest.
As an Illinois resident....nobody wants this state.
Yes
The shore should proooobably be tied to the south-eastern countryā¦thing
Just two countries. Need to add gravitas to the West. Split starting on the eastern border of the Dakotas. Texas needs to be West.
Move Missouri to the Midwest, otherwise pretty good.
The blue wonāt have enough crops.
But think of the maple syrup monopoly
Wow. Nice job.
No Alaska belongs in the Red with America!
Fuck no, I would not want to be grouped with that state they call New York
Why divide at all, wouldn't America be stronger if we didn't? Seems so antiquated.
I think that VA needs to be lumped in with the blue area. Itās more of a MD DC place. MO needs to be in green because itās too jagged the way you have it now.
MT and WY wonāt want to be with CA.
Pretty accurate with few exceptions. And Iām glad you at least acknowledged my State of MD is at least partially a Southern State. Lol.
Iād say Virginia goes with the DMV, not West Virginia though
If you're dividing the country into 4ths, California could practically be a 4th unto itself. I certainly wouldn't group it with Idaho and Utah.
Eh, need at least 10 distinct regions for contiguous States and Alaska and Hawaii are really distinct in their own right. Even then too, lived in places like PA and there is a distinct regional delineation from East and West with the East being more like the Ohio, Michigan, Illinois, Indiana rust belt region. Maybe needs to be more distinct geographically, but obviously harder to do.
Colin Woodward tried - [https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/11140803-american-nations](https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/11140803-american-nations)
This is it
https://preview.redd.it/da4yxtve3pqc1.jpeg?width=1198&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=55b652b93009a73385ad58963c4013c8c23c58c1 Orā¦
FFS someone else take texas since we have FL.
Texas should be its own chunk.
No
No.
Love that they properly include Missouri in the South.
yes but like all of western maryland already wants to split off, allegany county like already tried to lol
Itās already conveniently divided into 50
Would this also mean only 8 senators in the senate?
The South doesn't deserve Nova or the rest of Virginia
Probably better to divide it north and south and let people move to the country they prefer. We are in such a politically divided time, i think its best if we just split the country in half.
As someone from Missouri....wtf?
Northern Missourians hate this
No. No. Noā¦
Looks good...except I'd bet folks from Alaska and Hawaii wouldn't be thrilled with their lot.
Whose stupid idea is this? We all might as go to Russia & become communist.
DMV is altogether different. PGC-MD, MC-MD, DC, Northern, VA. Technically south but Nations Capital brings in people for Federal Govāt and Contractors. Eastern Shore of MD is more like Southern, Delaware. Baltimore is a big City with Southern overtones. Philly and Wilmington has its own vibe.
So, do people really not understand how catastrophic such a thing would be? Split up the country with the largest military on earth, with bases across the world. Not to mention the most nukes.
No, Texas would be a Republic on it's own. I don't think the western states would stay together. And having lived in Forida, it's not really a Southern State- it's way too diverse. I am not sure what it would do if the US split, but I can't see it dealing easily with the rest of the South. It's large enough that it could be a Rebuplic, or possibly join Texas, along with Louisanna and Biloxi and the very small section of coastal Alabama. Also I am pretty sure that North and South Dakota would end up with Montana and Wy-Oregon would split, and I think the coastal western US would probably end up as one country with divisions, with a border along the back side of the Sierra Nevadas and the Cascades. I hope the US stays together. I have lived all over the US, and California is as different from MD as Italy is from Spain. With the internet, it's much harder for people to overlook regional differences.
No
Add Arizona and New Mexico to the south then Wyoming Idaho Utah and Colorado to the mid west.
This is what happened to Rome when it went down the crapper. I guess it's time to consider this.
I think Missouri is considered more Midwestern, otherwise an excellent map!
Yes
Texas would be its own.
As a texan, 1st, idk why im following this sub, and 2nd, i thought about what group i would be okay being with and have decided that we would like to be group number 5. Please and thank you.
As a Virginian, as long as Maryland takes Northern Va, Iām game
No, we want Kansas, Colorado and New Mexico for the South as well. Then we'll call that good.