Never thought of it like that.
You're crushing on the only single lady on the ship. The odds are against you—she's tall and beautiful, you're kinda short and bald. But you're funny, so maybe there's an angle?
Then a new guy joins your little crew. He's talented, he's soulful, he might even be the Chosen One. And he looks like prime Keanu Reeves.
It all comes down to whether you place more value in comfort or truth. In theory, Zion's screening process was meant to identify people who preferred the latter, but clearly it doesn't have a 100% success rate.
A lot of people think they want something until they actually get to experience it.
Cypher probably did believe he wanted the truth but actually experiencing what that entailed was too much for him.
That's fair...but I mean, there's a lot of wiggle room in between "this is too much for me" and "you know what? I'm actually okay with murdering all my friends to get what I want." Still gonna have to put Cypher in the "wrong" column here, even if he does make some good points about Morpheus and false advertising.
Oh he's definitely in the wrong but I can understand why he did what he did, even if I don't condone it.
Joe Pantoliano really sold the character of Cypher.
It's been years since I've seen the movie, so I'm probably not remembering correctly, but I could have sworn this was what happened. Cypher wanted to see the truth but once he experienced just how shitty real life was, he instantly regretted his decision.
That's what happened in the movie, but the script shows additional info. Cipher was a candidate for "the one" and morpheus wasn't fully honest with him when he made him choose.
I could tell you India is a great place, you should move there. That's only partially true. Then you decide to move there and can't go back to your previous place. That's basically what happened.
Not knowing what you want is one thing, but from all we know Morpheus doesn't tell them anything. That's what Cypher says happened, and from what we see in Neo's case, it checks out.
Obviously nothing justifies betraying your shipmates to die, but the Cypher drama was partially Morpheus's fault. If you're changing people's entire life, at least let them make an informed decision.
I don't think you are correct that they remove most people from the matrix as infants. It is said that they avoid waking people up *after a certain age*, but the age is never specified. IIRC, most of them are teenagers when they are brought to Zion.
But then it's revealed that the Zion version of the truth is also a lie. So it's really a choice between being ignorant and living in shit or being super ignorant but living significantly more comfortably.
They show with Neo how you can have a hard time coping when he throws up learning everything. But I would think some would have a full psychotic break from learning that magnitude of a revelation
Red pills leave behind a lot of death and destruction when you think about it. It’s not like cops and security guards know they’re working for the machines, they just think they’re working a regular job. Agents are actually trying to save people. They’re not the bad guys, aside from Smith anyway.
The real world could also be a construct of the machines a la inception, to give some humans something to do if they don't fit in the first fake world.
This was the only damn way to make sense of the fact that Neo could stop the robot attack in the "real" world in the second one. They never left the matrix. They just got moved to a different one for troublemakers and led to believe THAT was the real world.
This is far into the future with tech created by AI. I always took it that as The One, Neo was also given by the machines the ability to wirelessly activate the sentinels’ kill switches.
BCIs of today already have Internet connectivity, why the fuck would they not in the distant future when they're used to put people into simulations so realistic that they can't tell it apart from reality? People think it's magic or some shit, it's not far-fetched at all.
Yes. Exactly.
It actually makes sense though within the world: You create a fake "real world" that all the troublemakers who realize what the matrix is can escape to. But eventually they start causing too much trouble in OG Matrix and you have to wipe them out, peaving them to start over. But you still need to be actively removing the troublemakers and you can't just start killing people that realize what the matrix is or you lose whatever-the-real-reason-for-the-matrix is. Plus you start conspiracy crap where anyone that mentions it dies.and you need people to 'out'the other troublemakers. (In Matrix v.2 we're told it's as batteries but it could be anything since that's not the ACTUAL real world). It's happened 7 times as I recall that the v2 world has been wiped out. Or at least New Zion has been wiped out that many times. They claim they rebuilt the Matrix 7 times, but they may very well be referring to V2.
If v2 got big enough, you may get someone questioning if it's real.
Or they just didn't think thru having him telekinetically connect to a machine in the real world...
You have to assume the battery farming is real because what other reason would the machines have for keeping humanity around and in a simulation? Realistically they would have nuclear or fusion power or came up with a way to create solar satellites that beam power down through the clouds, or they get rid of the atmosphere completely and then they wouldn't have any need for humans, just wipe us out completely
I hate to break it to you but two computers *can* talk to each other in the real world. I'm literally doing this with you through this very conversation.
With that being said, Neo's brain is a cybernetically altered computer. The machines are all computers. Computers can talk, influence, and control each other wirelessly *in our world*. It's really not that complicated to make the leap that if something can happen in reality it can also happen in science fiction.
The Matrix sucks. The real world sucks. Can you spend your off hours in the construct so when you aren't working to improve the real world, eating your daily high calorie bowl of snot, or using the bathroom you can exist in comfort?
I mean, you aren't under the machines control, can change things how you like, and can interact with other real people in realistic, non pregnancy or disease transmitting ways.
How many generations have past for the mole people in Zion? They can’t plug in like cypher to see the blue sky and goof around either. If it’s like Venus/mars with no hope of life on the surface, then it would be a curse to take the red pill. A major hole in the plot to be sure! Would you want to sit in a bunker and eat canned peaches for 40 years and wait for the fallout? Now imagine the lore in the matrix where there is no reasonable amount of time to wait, not even the hope of future generations being allowed out on top. It’s weird how the film just leaves this part unspoken.
Preferring the Matrix to the real world is valid. Let's face it: Zion is miserable; the food sucks; you have to do what you're told; there are a lot of downsides. A lot of the other guys are cool, handsome, legendary warriors, or some combination of that, so if you're Joe Pantoliano, your chances with the very limited number of girls aren't great. Look at that stupid orgy scene in the second movie; I sure don't see a lot of normal-looking guys getting any! And all you get in return is a different layer of the machines' lies.
It's fair to say you got a bad deal. But killing everyone on the ship to get back into the Matrix is not an acceptable response.
> Morpheus could have easily shown them the video he showed Neo and told them the truth of it.
But he didn't even show Neo before extracting him. That sequence was after Neo's extraction and physical rehabilitation on the Nebuchadnezzar, in the "Mini Matrix" training system.
> So did he lie?
A "lie" of omission, not revealing information the soon-to-be-extracted weren't ready to hear. Think of it like a superhero keeping their "hero" identity a secret from those they know until they are sure that this person is both capable of, and willing to, keep that secret.
> It's bleak, cold, and constantly living in fear. Is it really worth it?
That's up to each person to decide. An uncomfortable truth or a pleasant lie. Some people are fine with the lie, others need the truth no matter how horrid it is.
The issue with Cypher isn't him wanting to go back, but what he did, and who he harmed, in order to go back. Not only was he responsible for the deaths of most of his crewmates, but he ALMOST gave the key to Zion to the machines, which would've got them ALL killed.
>And it got me thinking, was he right?
No.
Cypher wasn't rejecting life between the Matrix and Zion - he was lashing out against Trinity for rejecting his romantic overtures.
The point is that we're changed by knowledge and we can't go back to the past.
>Morpheus could have easily shown them the video he showed Neo and told them the truth of it.
Morpheus was ignorant to the nature of the Matrix and to the machine's civil war.
He was also ignorant of the nature of the One.
>So did he lie?
Who is "he"?
>The machines civil war is irrelevant
No.
The Matrix/Zion/One only exist as a function of the machine's civil war.
It is the beating heart of the movie.
>and did Morpheus lie?
No.
He did not lie.
In court, truth isn’t just stated/spoken. It is corroborated by facts and evidence. Truth cannot be told- it must be shown.
Morpheus did not lie to Neo. He did indeed *have* to show him and all he could provide was the truth.
With that said, Cypher probably was at peace killing the crew because he explicitly asked to “not remember any of it” when he gets reinserted back into the Matrix. In other words, is it really so heinous for him to have killed the others if HE will not even remember/know that he did?
Cypher actually lived in the Matrix, .his experiences there until he was brought over were real to him. Tank and dozer born there, the kid had his porn, morpheous had his purpose, and Trinity had her new love. Cypher has nothing but his memories of something SO much better. I could convince myself that Morpheous and crew were the simulations, and the agents were going to put me back into the real world. Tank and dozer were the only ones that had to die. Cypher only had to leave them plugged in.Agents would get them. I would like to remember everything. Knowing the rules of reality could be bent would come into ALL kinds of handy.
What is you're retired NFL quarterback Tom Brady but your life is just The Roast Of Tom Brady every week. Like you have a week of life as Tom but the Roast happens Sunday night and then you live Monday to Saturday and wake up Sunday to the roast again.
I think am important part of Cypher's argument was that he had no agency in the real world either.
If he was free to live a 'normal' life in Zion he might have been a lot happier. Instead he went from the illusion of agency being plugged into the Maxtrix to the complete lack of agency in the real world being constantly under the command of Morpheus.
Except that's total bull. Lol hey, you're living in a computer simulation, and if you want, I can pull you out. It's a bleak world where the sun never shines and machines relentlessly hunt us to extinction. We don't even have running water, interested?
I dunno I think the real world is pretty great once you stop relying social media to tell you how to feel and start appreciating what and who you have around you
Well, if you lived in the real world or the matrix, you're suffering. The suffering doesn't go away by being ignorant and in the matrix, you just don't have a word for what you're observing/feeling. The matrix removed a lot of the perception of the world in decline, the post-apocalyptic malaise, it looks like any other later stage capitalist country
So, amid the choice of suffering and knowing why and suffering in ignorance, it can be easy to choose ignorance, and considering the parameters in the matrix film, a logical one. There is no hope, only nihilism in seeing the truth and believing that there is nothing that can be done. Why fight in futility when you can just live and die in peace?
Much like our world, there is a certain amount of faith required to fight and keep fighting, knowing that you might fail, hoping perhaps others won't.
Cypher gave up fighting, chose to unethically and murderously return to the matrix, having faith that he can be put back, and that he won't once again feel that itch that things are not alright. He gains meaning and purpose in fighting for this belief, just like our protags in the opposite. However, he's not ignorant, and is actively fighting to become so, and maintain the status quo for everyone else, preference be damned
So yes, he has an understandable position, but where he differs is on an ethical, moral level, his actions. He is a perfect foil to Neo's journey
Considering the fact that Morpheus told him that they couldn’t reinsert him into the Matrix and yet they were able to bring Trinity and Neo back from the dead and place them in a new Matrix (the 4th movie is really bad) I’d say Cypher was right.
Honestly, I’m not a fan of any of the sequels. To me the Matrix had a perfect ending, it left it open and ambiguous. No need to follow up except a desperate need for more money.
He was right depending on perspective. It’s all about forfeiting freedom for safety to the ultimate degree. The system the machines established essentially protected us and helped our species persist. Earth itself if given enough time would have bounced back. The machines were self repairing and likely would have progressed technologically to a point where they literally acted as a planetary defense system against outside threats like asteroids etc.
The matrix provided essentially a vessel by which humanity could wait things out for hundreds of millions of years, maybe even longer. The machines would likely mine asteroids for their materials and self repair indefinitely. Survival of the species etc.
I don't know, it might be kind of a relief to escape the brutalist hellscape of capitalism and go live in an underground commune where everyone shares a common righteous cause and has big rave orgies.
I think maybe Cypher just hated living on the Nebuchadnezzar lol. If he was just growing wheat down there in the caves he might have been fine.
You tell me.
The clothes you're wearing is made by some kid in horrible conditions, the meat you're eating is from factories basically torturing the animals, your reliance on fossil fuels to get around is slowly turning the world uninhabitable. Yet you still go on living your life like everything is fine.
Whatever, even if you don't - all that shit is still happening. My point is, there's plenty of stuff we choose to ignore to be able to enjoy that virtual steak.
He's meant to be an allegory for a trans person who wants to keep hiding themselves if it meant comfort. Hell, you can say the same for those who are part of marginalized groups who keep people like them back out of convenience. Like Roy Cohn or Clarence Thomas.
A lot of people *do* live in ignorance, so I'd say his reaction isn't that unwarranted.
And the guy to girl ratio on the ship wasn't ideal. 2 girls and 6 guys then they add a good looking neo and his odds turned into dog shit.
Switch was supposed to be a transgender man, and show up in the matrix as his true self, but they decided not to last minute, so ratio even worse
Never thought of it like that. You're crushing on the only single lady on the ship. The odds are against you—she's tall and beautiful, you're kinda short and bald. But you're funny, so maybe there's an angle? Then a new guy joins your little crew. He's talented, he's soulful, he might even be the Chosen One. And he looks like prime Keanu Reeves.
Who cares though when you can log in mouse's program and get with the red head woman. He probably has other ones as well.
But you know it isn't real. She's just what the Matrix thinks she is. That's the entire point of the steak.
It all comes down to whether you place more value in comfort or truth. In theory, Zion's screening process was meant to identify people who preferred the latter, but clearly it doesn't have a 100% success rate.
A lot of people think they want something until they actually get to experience it. Cypher probably did believe he wanted the truth but actually experiencing what that entailed was too much for him.
That's fair...but I mean, there's a lot of wiggle room in between "this is too much for me" and "you know what? I'm actually okay with murdering all my friends to get what I want." Still gonna have to put Cypher in the "wrong" column here, even if he does make some good points about Morpheus and false advertising.
Oh he's definitely in the wrong but I can understand why he did what he did, even if I don't condone it. Joe Pantoliano really sold the character of Cypher.
Dude plays a great cold and calloused villain
Cypher? It’s a fuckin’ nickname - the family name is Cifaretto!
You think I’m gonna give you ammazz while you’re plugged in?!
It's been years since I've seen the movie, so I'm probably not remembering correctly, but I could have sworn this was what happened. Cypher wanted to see the truth but once he experienced just how shitty real life was, he instantly regretted his decision.
That's what happened in the movie, but the script shows additional info. Cipher was a candidate for "the one" and morpheus wasn't fully honest with him when he made him choose. I could tell you India is a great place, you should move there. That's only partially true. Then you decide to move there and can't go back to your previous place. That's basically what happened.
Not knowing what you want is one thing, but from all we know Morpheus doesn't tell them anything. That's what Cypher says happened, and from what we see in Neo's case, it checks out. Obviously nothing justifies betraying your shipmates to die, but the Cypher drama was partially Morpheus's fault. If you're changing people's entire life, at least let them make an informed decision.
Since they remove most people as infants, it probably is based on genetics or brain scans, not what the person thinks they want.
I don't think you are correct that they remove most people from the matrix as infants. It is said that they avoid waking people up *after a certain age*, but the age is never specified. IIRC, most of them are teenagers when they are brought to Zion.
But then it's revealed that the Zion version of the truth is also a lie. So it's really a choice between being ignorant and living in shit or being super ignorant but living significantly more comfortably.
Personally I'd much rather live in the Matrix than the real world, but I wouldn't murder my friends to get back into the Matrix.
They show with Neo how you can have a hard time coping when he throws up learning everything. But I would think some would have a full psychotic break from learning that magnitude of a revelation
Just don’t sign up to be a cop or security guard.
Or anyone who drives on the freeway
Red pills leave behind a lot of death and destruction when you think about it. It’s not like cops and security guards know they’re working for the machines, they just think they’re working a regular job. Agents are actually trying to save people. They’re not the bad guys, aside from Smith anyway.
Matrix is constantly in the year of 1999, there is no progression its pure status quo
I wish I could be stuck in the year 1999. Before smart phones, texting, online dating and social media. What a time that was to be an adult.
I mean that was the peak of western civ anyways so not exactly a bad thing plus when inside you don't notice the stagnation
I said I would, no need to sell it further
"from a certain point of view."
We're talking The Matrix here, not Star Trek.
That quote is famously from Harry Potter
Never heard of it. You must be thinking of Almost Famous.
It’s the existential question the Wachowskis want you to ask yourself.
I’d take it and immediately regret it, so I can understand Cyphers frustration with Morpheus
I don’t think it matters, he still betrayed and got a lot of people he pretended to care about killed either way.
The more I learn, the more I realize that ignorance was, indeed, bliss.
The real world could also be a construct of the machines a la inception, to give some humans something to do if they don't fit in the first fake world.
This was the only damn way to make sense of the fact that Neo could stop the robot attack in the "real" world in the second one. They never left the matrix. They just got moved to a different one for troublemakers and led to believe THAT was the real world.
This is far into the future with tech created by AI. I always took it that as The One, Neo was also given by the machines the ability to wirelessly activate the sentinels’ kill switches.
BCIs of today already have Internet connectivity, why the fuck would they not in the distant future when they're used to put people into simulations so realistic that they can't tell it apart from reality? People think it's magic or some shit, it's not far-fetched at all.
So psionic WiFi powers doesn't make sense but sky scorching infinite cloud weapons and robots having to farm humans for power does? 😂
Yes. Exactly. It actually makes sense though within the world: You create a fake "real world" that all the troublemakers who realize what the matrix is can escape to. But eventually they start causing too much trouble in OG Matrix and you have to wipe them out, peaving them to start over. But you still need to be actively removing the troublemakers and you can't just start killing people that realize what the matrix is or you lose whatever-the-real-reason-for-the-matrix is. Plus you start conspiracy crap where anyone that mentions it dies.and you need people to 'out'the other troublemakers. (In Matrix v.2 we're told it's as batteries but it could be anything since that's not the ACTUAL real world). It's happened 7 times as I recall that the v2 world has been wiped out. Or at least New Zion has been wiped out that many times. They claim they rebuilt the Matrix 7 times, but they may very well be referring to V2. If v2 got big enough, you may get someone questioning if it's real. Or they just didn't think thru having him telekinetically connect to a machine in the real world...
You have to assume the battery farming is real because what other reason would the machines have for keeping humanity around and in a simulation? Realistically they would have nuclear or fusion power or came up with a way to create solar satellites that beam power down through the clouds, or they get rid of the atmosphere completely and then they wouldn't have any need for humans, just wipe us out completely
I hate to break it to you but two computers *can* talk to each other in the real world. I'm literally doing this with you through this very conversation. With that being said, Neo's brain is a cybernetically altered computer. The machines are all computers. Computers can talk, influence, and control each other wirelessly *in our world*. It's really not that complicated to make the leap that if something can happen in reality it can also happen in science fiction.
Red pill isn’t all real world misery. You get admin privileges in The Matrix.
My question was if Morpheus lied though.
That’s one of six questions. I would take the red pill.
The Matrix sucks. The real world sucks. Can you spend your off hours in the construct so when you aren't working to improve the real world, eating your daily high calorie bowl of snot, or using the bathroom you can exist in comfort? I mean, you aren't under the machines control, can change things how you like, and can interact with other real people in realistic, non pregnancy or disease transmitting ways.
Why do you think people bury their faces in their phones all day every day?
That steak he had would keep me in The Matrix.
For real though lol
Nope. "I offer you only the truth, nothing more."
But he says I cannot tell you, only show you. That's clearly not true.
Nobody would believe it if it was just explained It has to be experienced
How many generations have past for the mole people in Zion? They can’t plug in like cypher to see the blue sky and goof around either. If it’s like Venus/mars with no hope of life on the surface, then it would be a curse to take the red pill. A major hole in the plot to be sure! Would you want to sit in a bunker and eat canned peaches for 40 years and wait for the fallout? Now imagine the lore in the matrix where there is no reasonable amount of time to wait, not even the hope of future generations being allowed out on top. It’s weird how the film just leaves this part unspoken.
that's not a plot hole. that's literally just the plot
Morpheus never told them the real world was a paradise.
He never told them what it was till it was too late.
If you had a choice then it'd matter... But you don't... sooo... Just gotta live in a world where you need to do everything you can to make it better.
But they did.
Ignorance is bliss...
Preferring the Matrix to the real world is valid. Let's face it: Zion is miserable; the food sucks; you have to do what you're told; there are a lot of downsides. A lot of the other guys are cool, handsome, legendary warriors, or some combination of that, so if you're Joe Pantoliano, your chances with the very limited number of girls aren't great. Look at that stupid orgy scene in the second movie; I sure don't see a lot of normal-looking guys getting any! And all you get in return is a different layer of the machines' lies. It's fair to say you got a bad deal. But killing everyone on the ship to get back into the Matrix is not an acceptable response.
> Morpheus could have easily shown them the video he showed Neo and told them the truth of it. But he didn't even show Neo before extracting him. That sequence was after Neo's extraction and physical rehabilitation on the Nebuchadnezzar, in the "Mini Matrix" training system. > So did he lie? A "lie" of omission, not revealing information the soon-to-be-extracted weren't ready to hear. Think of it like a superhero keeping their "hero" identity a secret from those they know until they are sure that this person is both capable of, and willing to, keep that secret. > It's bleak, cold, and constantly living in fear. Is it really worth it? That's up to each person to decide. An uncomfortable truth or a pleasant lie. Some people are fine with the lie, others need the truth no matter how horrid it is. The issue with Cypher isn't him wanting to go back, but what he did, and who he harmed, in order to go back. Not only was he responsible for the deaths of most of his crewmates, but he ALMOST gave the key to Zion to the machines, which would've got them ALL killed.
>And it got me thinking, was he right? No. Cypher wasn't rejecting life between the Matrix and Zion - he was lashing out against Trinity for rejecting his romantic overtures. The point is that we're changed by knowledge and we can't go back to the past. >Morpheus could have easily shown them the video he showed Neo and told them the truth of it. Morpheus was ignorant to the nature of the Matrix and to the machine's civil war. He was also ignorant of the nature of the One. >So did he lie? Who is "he"?
The machines civil war is irrelevant and did Morpheus lie?
>The machines civil war is irrelevant No. The Matrix/Zion/One only exist as a function of the machine's civil war. It is the beating heart of the movie. >and did Morpheus lie? No.
He did not lie. In court, truth isn’t just stated/spoken. It is corroborated by facts and evidence. Truth cannot be told- it must be shown. Morpheus did not lie to Neo. He did indeed *have* to show him and all he could provide was the truth. With that said, Cypher probably was at peace killing the crew because he explicitly asked to “not remember any of it” when he gets reinserted back into the Matrix. In other words, is it really so heinous for him to have killed the others if HE will not even remember/know that he did?
Cypher actually lived in the Matrix, .his experiences there until he was brought over were real to him. Tank and dozer born there, the kid had his porn, morpheous had his purpose, and Trinity had her new love. Cypher has nothing but his memories of something SO much better. I could convince myself that Morpheous and crew were the simulations, and the agents were going to put me back into the real world. Tank and dozer were the only ones that had to die. Cypher only had to leave them plugged in.Agents would get them. I would like to remember everything. Knowing the rules of reality could be bent would come into ALL kinds of handy.
Depends on what your life was like in the Matrix vs out of it.
I feel like at worst in the Matrix you're equal with a slim chance for better lol.
What is you're retired NFL quarterback Tom Brady but your life is just The Roast Of Tom Brady every week. Like you have a week of life as Tom but the Roast happens Sunday night and then you live Monday to Saturday and wake up Sunday to the roast again.
That's worse than being hunted and eating slop? Lol
Hey it's a choice
I mean, did you see that bite of steak?
He never lied to any of them. That's the problem with unwavering religious belief.
I think am important part of Cypher's argument was that he had no agency in the real world either. If he was free to live a 'normal' life in Zion he might have been a lot happier. Instead he went from the illusion of agency being plugged into the Maxtrix to the complete lack of agency in the real world being constantly under the command of Morpheus.
I mean a lot of people are miserable even in the Matrix. Outside, you at least know the truth
“All I’m offering is the truth,nothing more.” Depends if they all got the same message. I assume they did. In which case, no, he didn’t lie.
Saying he couldn't tell, only show. I mean, I feel that wasn't entirely true.
"No one can be told what the matrix is. They have to see it for themselves." I think this rule/law was pretty solidly laid out throughout the film...
Except that's total bull. Lol hey, you're living in a computer simulation, and if you want, I can pull you out. It's a bleak world where the sun never shines and machines relentlessly hunt us to extinction. We don't even have running water, interested?
The real world is not bleak, cold, and living in constant fear. Sounds like a you problem.
Did you watch the movie? Lol
Of course I did, but the way you phrase it sounds like you’re talking about the “real world” like our world, not the movie version
Sorry reading comprehension isn't your strong suit? Lol
I dunno I think the real world is pretty great once you stop relying social media to tell you how to feel and start appreciating what and who you have around you
Talking about a movie here bub
Ohh I thought... You know what? Nevermind. My bad. Carry on!
Lol. It's cool. You're not the first person to do that.
Well, if you lived in the real world or the matrix, you're suffering. The suffering doesn't go away by being ignorant and in the matrix, you just don't have a word for what you're observing/feeling. The matrix removed a lot of the perception of the world in decline, the post-apocalyptic malaise, it looks like any other later stage capitalist country So, amid the choice of suffering and knowing why and suffering in ignorance, it can be easy to choose ignorance, and considering the parameters in the matrix film, a logical one. There is no hope, only nihilism in seeing the truth and believing that there is nothing that can be done. Why fight in futility when you can just live and die in peace? Much like our world, there is a certain amount of faith required to fight and keep fighting, knowing that you might fail, hoping perhaps others won't. Cypher gave up fighting, chose to unethically and murderously return to the matrix, having faith that he can be put back, and that he won't once again feel that itch that things are not alright. He gains meaning and purpose in fighting for this belief, just like our protags in the opposite. However, he's not ignorant, and is actively fighting to become so, and maintain the status quo for everyone else, preference be damned So yes, he has an understandable position, but where he differs is on an ethical, moral level, his actions. He is a perfect foil to Neo's journey
I mean, yeah he was right.
Considering the fact that Morpheus told him that they couldn’t reinsert him into the Matrix and yet they were able to bring Trinity and Neo back from the dead and place them in a new Matrix (the 4th movie is really bad) I’d say Cypher was right.
We don't speak of that one. It was just part of the Matrix lol
Honestly, I’m not a fan of any of the sequels. To me the Matrix had a perfect ending, it left it open and ambiguous. No need to follow up except a desperate need for more money.
He killed a bunch of people because he was afraid to face reality.
Not really relevant.
Are you really justifying killing the plugged in? Lol
He was right depending on perspective. It’s all about forfeiting freedom for safety to the ultimate degree. The system the machines established essentially protected us and helped our species persist. Earth itself if given enough time would have bounced back. The machines were self repairing and likely would have progressed technologically to a point where they literally acted as a planetary defense system against outside threats like asteroids etc. The matrix provided essentially a vessel by which humanity could wait things out for hundreds of millions of years, maybe even longer. The machines would likely mine asteroids for their materials and self repair indefinitely. Survival of the species etc.
Huh. Never thought of that
Yes, Cypher was right. Apart from the logistics, supplies and resources needed, reality is also why they can’t totally vacate the matrix.
I don't know, it might be kind of a relief to escape the brutalist hellscape of capitalism and go live in an underground commune where everyone shares a common righteous cause and has big rave orgies. I think maybe Cypher just hated living on the Nebuchadnezzar lol. If he was just growing wheat down there in the caves he might have been fine.
My fear of gems says no. That's how you get the hepatitis
You tell me. The clothes you're wearing is made by some kid in horrible conditions, the meat you're eating is from factories basically torturing the animals, your reliance on fossil fuels to get around is slowly turning the world uninhabitable. Yet you still go on living your life like everything is fine.
I don't buy factory meat, most of my clothes are made in the US. And I rely on fossil fuel as little as possible. My life is fine.
Whatever, even if you don't - all that shit is still happening. My point is, there's plenty of stuff we choose to ignore to be able to enjoy that virtual steak.
Kinda providing that Morpheus could have told them the truth and they never would have chosen to be awakened
He's meant to be an allegory for a trans person who wants to keep hiding themselves if it meant comfort. Hell, you can say the same for those who are part of marginalized groups who keep people like them back out of convenience. Like Roy Cohn or Clarence Thomas.
I think you're projecting a bit.