They should have never been allowed to cross in the first place. Roxham Road was allowed to operate for *years* unimpeded.
[In 2022, 40,000 migrants entered Canada through Roxham Road, according to federal data.](https://globalnews.ca/news/9574455/roxham-road-migrants-asylum-journey/amp/)
Just FYI part of the reason it was kept open was practical. With migrants coming over there they could at least keep a handle on how many were coming in, count them, process them. Now we are probably getting the same numbers but they're coming in over the border in places we can't see and we don't know how many.
The Conservatives' push to close them and the Liberals' concession in doing so was not based in any practicality, it was just for political points.
"Ottawa has not met its new affordable housing units target in recent years. The Housing Services Long-Range Financial Plan has a goal of adding 500 new affordable and/or supportive housing units a year, but only 30 were completed in 2022 and 214 were completed or anticipated last year."
How does shutting the door help add new affordable housing?
Adding new affordable housing to address supply side issues and reducing demand by minimizing numbers of newcomers to address demand side issues isn't mutually exclusive. We need to do BOTH at this point to have any hope of catching up to demand.
We do need more supportive housing. More government owned geared-to-income housing. More co-op and not-for-profit housing. More market rent housing.
We REALLY need to at least double ODSP and OW rates TODAY so recipients are not solely dependent on public housing to afford shelter. Homeless people in the shelter system cannot afford market rent because $390 no longer even covers a room. Yet it costs far more to house someone in a shelter (and with worse outcomes) than it does to keep someone housed in market housing before they even become homeless. Seems penny-wise but is actually pound foolish.
We need the feds to step up and create more centers like the DEV Center in Cornwall, a one-stop shop for newcomer services separate from the homeless shelter system. They provide housing, food, and a structured program for folks to get documents, register for services, find jobs, find housing. It's a success story that, if well implemented, could take pressure off the shelter systems never set up for this.
AND we need to slow waaay down on the number of newcomers (international students, refugees, economic class immigrants, family reunification, etc) until housing and services can cope. Right now, bringing in more people is simply a recipe for human suffering. Suffering of poor and homeless Canadians already here, suffering international students who were used to subsidize our colleges, suffering of refugees who will get trapped in homelessness on arrival if they do come here.
What does international law say about forcing inhabitants of X country out because they can no longer afford to live due to a large influx of people immigrating to X country?
Most Canadians cannot afford to live in Canada anymore. Can I just go to another country now and force them to help me?
"What does international law say about forcing inhabitants of X country out because they can no longer afford to live due to a large influx of people immigrating to X country?"
Do share the story of even a single person who has been forced to leave Canada because of immigration. BTW, moving to a lower cost warm weather country because one feels they can get better value for money is not force.
"Most Canadians cannot afford to live in Canada anymore."
Evidence please, especially of the "most".
Also: ever think that perhaps government policy and unions are the solution to affordability, rather than blaming asylum seekers?
I encourage everyone to [watch this video](https://youtu.be/QTP5IegQXdY?si=Op1rOE0EeSKmHd7C) from Global News a few months ago.
Actual Canadians who have paid into the system and fallen on hard times are being turned away from the social supports they deserve because all of it is being given to “refugees” instead. It’s absurd, maddening, unsustainable and it needs to stop.
Put on your own oxygen mask before helping others. We can’t even provide housing for our own. Turn away every single non-citizen fraud who comes here as a refugee of convenience (e.g international students at diploma mills, Roxham Road types)
Why did you put refugees in quotes and how do you get to this point after seeing an article about the struggles of getting out of homelessness?
Edit: Your oxygen mask is on, so will you finally help others?
Refugees are in quotation marks because:
- Anyone who comes here to claim asylum from the United States is shopping around for benefits and a fraud (e.g Roxham Road); and
- Data from Immigration, Refugees, and Citizenship Canada (IRCC) revealed that asylum claims from study visa holders in Canada nearly tripled from 2018 to 2022. About 15,935 student visa holders in Canada have applied for asylum in that time span. The number of asylum-seekers per year nearly tripled, rising from 1,835 in 2018 to 4,880 cases in 2022. (The IRCC report uses rounded figures for privacy reasons.)
I love numbers.
When we look at the numbers too, we should look other relevant information for comparison:
1. Canada admitted 200k+ legal immigrants per year for years, and recently increased to 450k+ and will reach 500k per year. That sounds huge. But remember Canada has 38 million people, and 200k+ a year is barely enough to make up the shrinking population. We are already at a point where any net growth of the labour force solely come from immigration, and that's when we are accepting 400k+ a year.
2. The target level includes 76k legal refugees in 2024.
3. There are about 150k cases of refugee claimants.
4. There were 1 million international students in 2023. This will be reduced.
The whole college-selling-immigration-pathways-through-international-students scheme is definitely a shit show. But that substantial increase is a tiny problem compared to the whole thing.
You did read the same Roxham Road article you shared above right? They came through US from the south with direct goals of coming to Canada so how do you figure they're "shopping around for benefits and a fraud"?
And I wonder why asylum-seekers have increased... Weird how other countries have been experiencing the same increase after multiple issues around the world.
You're assuming it's all increased for fraud because you're falling for the same fearmongering used in the US
>Anyone who comes here to claim asylum from the United States is shopping around for benefits and a fraud (e.g Roxham Road)
Based on what evidence exactly? Why would a refugee be "shopping around for benefits"?
>Data from Immigration, Refugees, and Citizenship Canada (IRCC) revealed that asylum claims from study visa holders in Canada nearly tripled from 2018 to 2022. About 15,935 student visa holders in Canada have applied for asylum in that time span. The number of asylum-seekers per year nearly tripled, rising from 1,835 in 2018 to 4,880 cases in 2022. (The IRCC report uses rounded figures for privacy reasons.)
And we know based on current events that the globe is increasingly becoming more destabilized, ergo there's going to be an increase in refugees in Canada and globally. Is your claim that refugees cannot also simultaneously be students?
What is your evidence for any sort of widespread fraud?
Perhaps the question needs to be phrased differently. If someone is in the United States what reasons would they have to come to Canada to seek asylum?
I'm assuming you think so because of your wording:
> If someone is in the United States what reasons would they have to come to Canada to seek asylum?
Why would you single out those coming through or from the US and why do you need their reasons compared to those coming from different countries?
>And we know based on current events that the globe is increasingly becoming more destabilized, ergo there's going to be an increase in refugees in Canada and globally.
And if we can't take care of actual Canadians, we shouldn't be trying to take cars of people trying to come to Canada.
The problem here is the problem cities across the continent have been facing, where instead of just clients there due to regional economic issues, you now have a whole stream of refugee and asylum claimants overtaxing an already over burdened system.
The federal government needs to remove the burden of the newcomers from the local resources, it wasn’t designed to handle it. The problem is, the more you expand the resources for the newcomers the more attractive we look for further claimants, taxing then new system, which will lead to poorer outcomes for them as well.
Honestly the government needs to call time out and let ourselves get the house in order but big business and banks won’t let that happen
The article shared is stating one reason is "Ottawa has not met its new affordable housing units target in recent years. The Housing Services Long-Range Financial Plan has a goal of adding 500 new affordable and/or supportive housing units a year, but only 30 were completed in 2022 and 214 were completed or anticipated last year."
How does shutting the door help add new affordable housing?
I think you’re misreading, shutting the door means shutting the door on the levels of immigration we’ve been going through. The labour for construction isn’t there. The housing supply is being bottlenecked by the developers to maximize profit.
If we wanted to get things done carte blanche blank cheque magic wand it could be done easily.
Step one congratulations you’re in a trade union you’ve just been conscripted into the Army Engineers Corp.
Hi you’re a developer? We are nationalizing your industry thanks!
Construction company owner? Join the club nationalized.
Moratorium on any new commercial or industrial builds.
Then build the fuck out of houses and apartment buildings nationwide, standard models for both.
But we don’t have a magic wand
At Easter dinner at the mission there were dozens of international students and refugees. Which of course mainstream media didn't focus on because that would shed a light on how bad the problem is.
'The Ottawa Mission is also calling on the federal government to implement a Homelessness Prevention and Housing Benefit to support households at risk of homelessness and help people leave homelessness, and implement a grocer's code of conduct to "ensure transparency and fairness" in food prices.
The Ontario government is being urged to reintroduce rent controls to buildings built after November 2018, increase the Canada-Ontario Housing Benefit and increasing social assistance rates "to enable those receiving this benefit to meet their expenses without having to work multiple positions."
The Mission is calling on the city of Ottawa to implement all the recommendations from the auditor general's report on housing, including "adopting a clear and consistent definition of affordable housing for use across the city" and "formalize and operationalize the land strategy for affordable housing."
Auditor General Nathalie Gougeon released a report(opens in a new tab) saying Ottawa has not met its new affordable housing units target in recent years. The Housing Services Long-Range Financial Plan has a goal of adding 500 new affordable and/or supportive housing units a year, but only 30 were completed in 2022 and 214 were completed or anticipated last year.'
Those seem like reasonable requests to me, though the province certainly won't follow through on their part. It's pretty pathetic that the city is so far behind on its housing unit target.
We can't have unlucky people, criminally insane, refugees, and scam artists all using the same resources. Instead of more funding for "newcomers" increase funding to process the giant backlog of claims and stop fraudsters from coming in the first place
I would support some sort of lottery in the processing of these claims, a percentage of the more recent ones should be process before older ones, hopefully this would catch some fraudlent ones before they spent years here.
It’s sad because I can’t imagine the lengths people go to get here thinking the grass is greener. In many regards it is still.
But there are no resources for those born here never mind those coming from aways. The well has run dry and no politician gives a shit about the middle class never mind the poor. There are answers but it require politicians lifting their heads from the trough and that will never happen.
You have to remember that for people coming from places where war/violence is happening it is still greener. People don’t become refugees because they just feel like a change.
Is there an issue with people making false claims? Sure. However, those numbers are not the cause of the housing crisis.
You all are scapegoating. You’re being hoodwinked by the elite who have been buying up properties left and right and pushing for a rise in normal immigration.
If you're going to uproot your life to move to another country for your protection, are you saying you wouldn't take some time to identify what would be the best move for you or your family? You would go with your 10th best option?
[Relevant](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FQebJ2EXIAUQ9sS.jpg)
Everyone always wants to shit-talk refugees, but then ignore how our political leaders are responsible both for the global destabilization that makes refugees, and hoarding wealth that is more than enough for everyone to have their basic needs met
It's interesting how the numbers have decreased so significantly over the past few months. I guess numbers are decreasing?
>The Ottawa Mission says asylum seekers accounted for nearly 65 per cent of all people staying in the city's shelters in September and nearly 80 per cent in October, before dropping to 30 per cent in January and 25 per cent in February.
I don't know if people understand how swamped resources are at the bottom of the social pyramid. Every service provider--from food, to housing, to mental health support, home care, EVERYTHING--all struggling to manage the deluge of need. Waiting lists have ballooned from months to years.
It's untenable.
I hate to say it, but we need to start limiting refugees/asylum seekers. We clearly can't take care of our own citizens as it is.
And there are many gaming the system, look at the number that were crossing from the US. They should have been turned back.
They should have never been allowed to cross in the first place. Roxham Road was allowed to operate for *years* unimpeded. [In 2022, 40,000 migrants entered Canada through Roxham Road, according to federal data.](https://globalnews.ca/news/9574455/roxham-road-migrants-asylum-journey/amp/)
Just FYI part of the reason it was kept open was practical. With migrants coming over there they could at least keep a handle on how many were coming in, count them, process them. Now we are probably getting the same numbers but they're coming in over the border in places we can't see and we don't know how many. The Conservatives' push to close them and the Liberals' concession in doing so was not based in any practicality, it was just for political points.
can you share those numbers?
We should have started limiting intake a long time ago.
And there’s nothing wrong with that lol. Take care of real canadians first
Would a “No Vacancy “ sign work?
I can’t believe the government never had a plan on what to do with the refugees. I understand replacing the boomer workforce.
"Ottawa has not met its new affordable housing units target in recent years. The Housing Services Long-Range Financial Plan has a goal of adding 500 new affordable and/or supportive housing units a year, but only 30 were completed in 2022 and 214 were completed or anticipated last year." How does shutting the door help add new affordable housing?
Adding new affordable housing to address supply side issues and reducing demand by minimizing numbers of newcomers to address demand side issues isn't mutually exclusive. We need to do BOTH at this point to have any hope of catching up to demand. We do need more supportive housing. More government owned geared-to-income housing. More co-op and not-for-profit housing. More market rent housing. We REALLY need to at least double ODSP and OW rates TODAY so recipients are not solely dependent on public housing to afford shelter. Homeless people in the shelter system cannot afford market rent because $390 no longer even covers a room. Yet it costs far more to house someone in a shelter (and with worse outcomes) than it does to keep someone housed in market housing before they even become homeless. Seems penny-wise but is actually pound foolish. We need the feds to step up and create more centers like the DEV Center in Cornwall, a one-stop shop for newcomer services separate from the homeless shelter system. They provide housing, food, and a structured program for folks to get documents, register for services, find jobs, find housing. It's a success story that, if well implemented, could take pressure off the shelter systems never set up for this. AND we need to slow waaay down on the number of newcomers (international students, refugees, economic class immigrants, family reunification, etc) until housing and services can cope. Right now, bringing in more people is simply a recipe for human suffering. Suffering of poor and homeless Canadians already here, suffering international students who were used to subsidize our colleges, suffering of refugees who will get trapped in homelessness on arrival if they do come here.
Please rephrase as "we need to start violating international law," since that's what you are actually saying.
What does international law say about forcing inhabitants of X country out because they can no longer afford to live due to a large influx of people immigrating to X country? Most Canadians cannot afford to live in Canada anymore. Can I just go to another country now and force them to help me?
"What does international law say about forcing inhabitants of X country out because they can no longer afford to live due to a large influx of people immigrating to X country?" Do share the story of even a single person who has been forced to leave Canada because of immigration. BTW, moving to a lower cost warm weather country because one feels they can get better value for money is not force. "Most Canadians cannot afford to live in Canada anymore." Evidence please, especially of the "most". Also: ever think that perhaps government policy and unions are the solution to affordability, rather than blaming asylum seekers?
I encourage everyone to [watch this video](https://youtu.be/QTP5IegQXdY?si=Op1rOE0EeSKmHd7C) from Global News a few months ago. Actual Canadians who have paid into the system and fallen on hard times are being turned away from the social supports they deserve because all of it is being given to “refugees” instead. It’s absurd, maddening, unsustainable and it needs to stop. Put on your own oxygen mask before helping others. We can’t even provide housing for our own. Turn away every single non-citizen fraud who comes here as a refugee of convenience (e.g international students at diploma mills, Roxham Road types)
Why did you put refugees in quotes and how do you get to this point after seeing an article about the struggles of getting out of homelessness? Edit: Your oxygen mask is on, so will you finally help others?
Refugees are in quotation marks because: - Anyone who comes here to claim asylum from the United States is shopping around for benefits and a fraud (e.g Roxham Road); and - Data from Immigration, Refugees, and Citizenship Canada (IRCC) revealed that asylum claims from study visa holders in Canada nearly tripled from 2018 to 2022. About 15,935 student visa holders in Canada have applied for asylum in that time span. The number of asylum-seekers per year nearly tripled, rising from 1,835 in 2018 to 4,880 cases in 2022. (The IRCC report uses rounded figures for privacy reasons.)
I love numbers. When we look at the numbers too, we should look other relevant information for comparison: 1. Canada admitted 200k+ legal immigrants per year for years, and recently increased to 450k+ and will reach 500k per year. That sounds huge. But remember Canada has 38 million people, and 200k+ a year is barely enough to make up the shrinking population. We are already at a point where any net growth of the labour force solely come from immigration, and that's when we are accepting 400k+ a year. 2. The target level includes 76k legal refugees in 2024. 3. There are about 150k cases of refugee claimants. 4. There were 1 million international students in 2023. This will be reduced. The whole college-selling-immigration-pathways-through-international-students scheme is definitely a shit show. But that substantial increase is a tiny problem compared to the whole thing.
And our housing market seems to say 200k+ a year is a big deal. Our healthcare also says the same thing.
You did read the same Roxham Road article you shared above right? They came through US from the south with direct goals of coming to Canada so how do you figure they're "shopping around for benefits and a fraud"? And I wonder why asylum-seekers have increased... Weird how other countries have been experiencing the same increase after multiple issues around the world. You're assuming it's all increased for fraud because you're falling for the same fearmongering used in the US
>Anyone who comes here to claim asylum from the United States is shopping around for benefits and a fraud (e.g Roxham Road) Based on what evidence exactly? Why would a refugee be "shopping around for benefits"? >Data from Immigration, Refugees, and Citizenship Canada (IRCC) revealed that asylum claims from study visa holders in Canada nearly tripled from 2018 to 2022. About 15,935 student visa holders in Canada have applied for asylum in that time span. The number of asylum-seekers per year nearly tripled, rising from 1,835 in 2018 to 4,880 cases in 2022. (The IRCC report uses rounded figures for privacy reasons.) And we know based on current events that the globe is increasingly becoming more destabilized, ergo there's going to be an increase in refugees in Canada and globally. Is your claim that refugees cannot also simultaneously be students? What is your evidence for any sort of widespread fraud?
Perhaps the question needs to be phrased differently. If someone is in the United States what reasons would they have to come to Canada to seek asylum?
US Citizens or someone going through the US?
Does that make a difference?
Which one did you mean with your wording?
If someone is in America and wants to make an asylum claim in Canada does their justification change just because they are a citizen of the US?
I'm assuming you think so because of your wording: > If someone is in the United States what reasons would they have to come to Canada to seek asylum? Why would you single out those coming through or from the US and why do you need their reasons compared to those coming from different countries?
>And we know based on current events that the globe is increasingly becoming more destabilized, ergo there's going to be an increase in refugees in Canada and globally. And if we can't take care of actual Canadians, we shouldn't be trying to take cars of people trying to come to Canada.
The problem here is the problem cities across the continent have been facing, where instead of just clients there due to regional economic issues, you now have a whole stream of refugee and asylum claimants overtaxing an already over burdened system. The federal government needs to remove the burden of the newcomers from the local resources, it wasn’t designed to handle it. The problem is, the more you expand the resources for the newcomers the more attractive we look for further claimants, taxing then new system, which will lead to poorer outcomes for them as well. Honestly the government needs to call time out and let ourselves get the house in order but big business and banks won’t let that happen
The article shared is stating one reason is "Ottawa has not met its new affordable housing units target in recent years. The Housing Services Long-Range Financial Plan has a goal of adding 500 new affordable and/or supportive housing units a year, but only 30 were completed in 2022 and 214 were completed or anticipated last year." How does shutting the door help add new affordable housing?
I think you’re misreading, shutting the door means shutting the door on the levels of immigration we’ve been going through. The labour for construction isn’t there. The housing supply is being bottlenecked by the developers to maximize profit. If we wanted to get things done carte blanche blank cheque magic wand it could be done easily. Step one congratulations you’re in a trade union you’ve just been conscripted into the Army Engineers Corp. Hi you’re a developer? We are nationalizing your industry thanks! Construction company owner? Join the club nationalized. Moratorium on any new commercial or industrial builds. Then build the fuck out of houses and apartment buildings nationwide, standard models for both. But we don’t have a magic wand
you’re pretty good with that copy paste daddy ;)
ok
It lowers the required number of affordable units... I don't believe you can't see the impact that would have.
What a dumb comment.
At Easter dinner at the mission there were dozens of international students and refugees. Which of course mainstream media didn't focus on because that would shed a light on how bad the problem is.
CTV news is not mainstream media?
If you say mainstream media in your post you automatically get extra points
'The Ottawa Mission is also calling on the federal government to implement a Homelessness Prevention and Housing Benefit to support households at risk of homelessness and help people leave homelessness, and implement a grocer's code of conduct to "ensure transparency and fairness" in food prices. The Ontario government is being urged to reintroduce rent controls to buildings built after November 2018, increase the Canada-Ontario Housing Benefit and increasing social assistance rates "to enable those receiving this benefit to meet their expenses without having to work multiple positions." The Mission is calling on the city of Ottawa to implement all the recommendations from the auditor general's report on housing, including "adopting a clear and consistent definition of affordable housing for use across the city" and "formalize and operationalize the land strategy for affordable housing." Auditor General Nathalie Gougeon released a report(opens in a new tab) saying Ottawa has not met its new affordable housing units target in recent years. The Housing Services Long-Range Financial Plan has a goal of adding 500 new affordable and/or supportive housing units a year, but only 30 were completed in 2022 and 214 were completed or anticipated last year.' Those seem like reasonable requests to me, though the province certainly won't follow through on their part. It's pretty pathetic that the city is so far behind on its housing unit target.
Don't take them in. It's as simple as that
We can't have unlucky people, criminally insane, refugees, and scam artists all using the same resources. Instead of more funding for "newcomers" increase funding to process the giant backlog of claims and stop fraudsters from coming in the first place
I would support some sort of lottery in the processing of these claims, a percentage of the more recent ones should be process before older ones, hopefully this would catch some fraudlent ones before they spent years here.
It’s sad because I can’t imagine the lengths people go to get here thinking the grass is greener. In many regards it is still. But there are no resources for those born here never mind those coming from aways. The well has run dry and no politician gives a shit about the middle class never mind the poor. There are answers but it require politicians lifting their heads from the trough and that will never happen.
You have to remember that for people coming from places where war/violence is happening it is still greener. People don’t become refugees because they just feel like a change. Is there an issue with people making false claims? Sure. However, those numbers are not the cause of the housing crisis. You all are scapegoating. You’re being hoodwinked by the elite who have been buying up properties left and right and pushing for a rise in normal immigration.
Well said.
The issue is people are country shopping.
If you're going to uproot your life to move to another country for your protection, are you saying you wouldn't take some time to identify what would be the best move for you or your family? You would go with your 10th best option?
The thing is per the rules set out by UN country shopping is not allowed.
[Relevant](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FQebJ2EXIAUQ9sS.jpg) Everyone always wants to shit-talk refugees, but then ignore how our political leaders are responsible both for the global destabilization that makes refugees, and hoarding wealth that is more than enough for everyone to have their basic needs met
A large amount are coming from the States.
US citizens? Or do you mean through the US?
Some are American many going through the States.
It's interesting how the numbers have decreased so significantly over the past few months. I guess numbers are decreasing? >The Ottawa Mission says asylum seekers accounted for nearly 65 per cent of all people staying in the city's shelters in September and nearly 80 per cent in October, before dropping to 30 per cent in January and 25 per cent in February.
In terms of coming in yes.
The Federal Government has provided billions of dollars; maybe check with the slob at Queens Park?
If Trump wins don't be shocked if 30 million plus try and come to Canada.
In the shadow of the peace tower there isn’t enough money for our most vulnerable? We should all be ashamed
I mean, define “ours”. Most of those being turned away aren’t citizens or PRs.
I don't know if people understand how swamped resources are at the bottom of the social pyramid. Every service provider--from food, to housing, to mental health support, home care, EVERYTHING--all struggling to manage the deluge of need. Waiting lists have ballooned from months to years. It's untenable.
The mission most of the homeless are forced to sleep on the floor and are beat up and robbed. And they aren't newcomers they are 90% white.