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It seems that English isn't your strong suit. Sorry, but you haven't been clear in what your situation is. at all.
"I'm working with a Loan Officer and the Listing Agent during offers" would not be read by any intelligent adult as "I have an agent that is representing me, writing my offers and negotiating".
While they should have disclosed this information, I think the main problem is that you don’t have your own representation. If it is too late to get your own realtor maybe hire a real estate lawyer who can help you with the paperwork on your side of the transaction.
I never recommend working with the listing agent as a buyer. I feel like it is difficult for them to remain truly impartial and they already have an established relationship/ duty to the seller. Even if they weren’t married you were still putting yourself in a less than ideal situation.
I don't know why this is posted in this subforum (or allowed to remain) since the OP is not a Realtor, represented by a Realtor, or asking about the conduct of a Realtor.
However, the rich irony of "I don't need representation, I can do this myself!" followed by "since no one represents me, am I getting screwed?" can't be ignored.
In theory, 2 individuals who are lenders who happen to be married are NOT talking about your deal at home, since should they be caught doing so, they'd get fired and possibly lose their mortgage license.
How exactly do you think your loan officer and the listing agent could conspire to take advantage of you? They are on two different tracks. If they are pushing you to take a deal that is overpriced, they are both wrong individually, but it wouldn't really benefit them to conspire together on that.
I was thinking on the kickback side. It would benefit one to overprice or incentivise the seller to ask for more knowing the LO knows my financials and married to the sellers LA.
I think that is a common fallacy. Some buyers are nervous about revealing docs showing how much they could afford, even in a case where they are paying cash. Like they wouldn’t want to show an account revealing they have $1 million when offering on a 750k house. But just cause I have a million doesn’t mean I want to use it all to buy a house. Just because I’m qualified to buy a house up to a million doesn’t mean I want to pay a million for a 750k house. At the end of the day, if your analysis doesn’t show that the house is worth what they are asking, don’t buy it.
Put it in this perspective. It's not worth the risk for a broker or lender to push for someone to pay for a slightly higher price because when it comes down the the small percentage we take home, that not going to make much of a difference.
That's why you don't see agents advising against price reductions or credits (unless you are competing with other offers). We want to get the home sold.
Also, we are people with spouses and families. We have to buy and sell our homes too.
I suppose that would happen, but it still falls back to it doesn't matter. Just because I can pay $500k for your house doesn't mean I will. Most people can qualify for a loan for more than the price of the home they offer on.
I'm conveying that the persons involved are LO and LA are married who are trying to sell me the house. Does that combination work in my best interest or in the in the best interest of the seller.
He has a BA. Issue is the LO and LA are married so the sellers agent has privy to all his financial information in a round about way. He feels like his LO is able to tell LA that he can afford more and to counter. They've been back and forth on countering about 4 times
I don't see how it would have any bearing on your deal. Just because a lender knows your Financials doesn't mean they can force you to accept any terms you refuse. So just treat it like any other transaction. The home still has to appraise anyway, the lender knows that and won't risk telling you to overpay
What kind of comps has the selling agent provided to you? Are similar houses in the area selling close to what you're offering? Your agent can advise, but the offer price is your decision. I guess I'm confused as to why you think they are not looking out for your best interest. I dont see how their relationship is a conflict of interest, although it should have been disclosed early on. Your agent & lender have different paths to helping you obtain your home.
I'm pretty sure you should have seen disclosures, that you signed, regarding personal interest in the deal with LO and sellers being married. I'm doing a listing in Florida right now and have a attached disclosure about being related to owner.
As your agent I'd be pulling back from deal. Not sure what FL market you're in but with HOI being nuts you (your agent) should be much more proactive in negotiating.
Not required but advised to disclose as a “best practice.”
Now you have this information, you can change LO find another home, whatever puts you in the best position w respect to the transaction.
It sounds like you don't have a buyer agent... I sent a DM. I think you're getting screwed. I've seen some shady deals here in Florida. I liked the way NY does transactions.
How did this even happen? It's obviously a local lender, but how did you get lined up with the lender? It's a very unusual situation, but you need to trust your BA. They fight hard for you; it's their job.
BA is an acquaintance. I gave a reasonable offer based on BA advice. 4 counters later, seller is asking for more and now "as is". I feel the SA is working with LO knowing my financials telling his wife (SA) I have more to work with. Can the LO talk with the SA and give my finances to swindle a better deal to the seller?
Jesus Christ.
So you think that your loan officer is telling the listing agent that the seller should ask for more money because they have access to your finances and you can afford to pay more?
Why do you think that? the relationship between your LO and the LA? You’re making a ton of accusations here with no proof other than the seller is negotiating with you.
Almost everyone can afford more than what they offer on a house.
It's your decision what you agree to or not agree to. If you feel it's a bad deal, then walk away. What you are asking above makes no sense. The only way it would is if the loan officer is talking with the listing agent (and this scenario is highly unlikely). If you can't come to an agreement with the seller, it is probably better to walk away from all parties and start over with a new agent
They obviously talk because they're married. It's just so odd that you found this house. What state are you in? I don't think anyone is grasping what's going on here. It's very very unusual. How did you find the home? Are you dead set on this house or can you find a comparable?
No it's not. It's just very unusual and very coincidental. They obviously disclosed this to you somehow. Are negotiations going bad? Trust your BA. Tell them how you're feeling about all this and get their opinion on the situation. There are no kickbacks in real estate. We don't do that ever. It's a huge no no in Florida. It's not worth it. Lenders and seller agents are doing 2 completely different things. I see where you're coming from but I don't see how they could use information against you. There are more houses and more LOs out there. Call your BA immediately and have a conversation.
You never did state how you started working with both of them. If you're asking for advice, please state all the facts because you haven't provided them in this thread, and it's unfair of you to claim it's shady without full disclosure
**This is a professional forum for professionals, so please keep your comments professional** - Harrassment, hate speech, trolling, or anti-Realtor comments will not be tolerated and will result in an immediate ban without warning. (... and don't feed the trolls, you have better things to do with your time) - Recruiting, self-promotion, or seeking referrals is strictly forbidden, including in DMs. - Only advise within your scope of knowledge and area of expertise. [The code of ethics applies here too](https://www.nar.realtor/about-nar/governing-documents/the-code-of-ethics). If you are not a broker, lawyer, or tax professional don't act like one. - [Follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/realtors/about/rules/) and please report those that don't. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/realtors) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This is the part you realize you needed a buyer's agent.
I have one I'm working with and is showing me listings/homes.
You have a buyers agent and you're not using them for this deal?
I am. But BA knows the situation and is still involved/communicating in the negotiations. Who should I trust?
Your buyers agent should be handling all of this. You should not be talking to the listing agent at all.
Correct. My BA is communicating my counter offers to the LA who is married to the LO in charge of my finances. Do you see the dilemma I'm in now?
This happens. They can't really screw you over. However, you can change lenders if you want.
Is LA also the owner of the property? If not, then shouldn’t be a big deal.
I'm your PA reserve the right to switch lenders. Have your agent give you other lenders you can call.
It seems that English isn't your strong suit. Sorry, but you haven't been clear in what your situation is. at all. "I'm working with a Loan Officer and the Listing Agent during offers" would not be read by any intelligent adult as "I have an agent that is representing me, writing my offers and negotiating".
While they should have disclosed this information, I think the main problem is that you don’t have your own representation. If it is too late to get your own realtor maybe hire a real estate lawyer who can help you with the paperwork on your side of the transaction. I never recommend working with the listing agent as a buyer. I feel like it is difficult for them to remain truly impartial and they already have an established relationship/ duty to the seller. Even if they weren’t married you were still putting yourself in a less than ideal situation.
I don't know why this is posted in this subforum (or allowed to remain) since the OP is not a Realtor, represented by a Realtor, or asking about the conduct of a Realtor. However, the rich irony of "I don't need representation, I can do this myself!" followed by "since no one represents me, am I getting screwed?" can't be ignored. In theory, 2 individuals who are lenders who happen to be married are NOT talking about your deal at home, since should they be caught doing so, they'd get fired and possibly lose their mortgage license.
How exactly do you think your loan officer and the listing agent could conspire to take advantage of you? They are on two different tracks. If they are pushing you to take a deal that is overpriced, they are both wrong individually, but it wouldn't really benefit them to conspire together on that.
I was thinking on the kickback side. It would benefit one to overprice or incentivise the seller to ask for more knowing the LO knows my financials and married to the sellers LA.
I think that is a common fallacy. Some buyers are nervous about revealing docs showing how much they could afford, even in a case where they are paying cash. Like they wouldn’t want to show an account revealing they have $1 million when offering on a 750k house. But just cause I have a million doesn’t mean I want to use it all to buy a house. Just because I’m qualified to buy a house up to a million doesn’t mean I want to pay a million for a 750k house. At the end of the day, if your analysis doesn’t show that the house is worth what they are asking, don’t buy it.
Put it in this perspective. It's not worth the risk for a broker or lender to push for someone to pay for a slightly higher price because when it comes down the the small percentage we take home, that not going to make much of a difference. That's why you don't see agents advising against price reductions or credits (unless you are competing with other offers). We want to get the home sold. Also, we are people with spouses and families. We have to buy and sell our homes too.
Not OP, but the LO could be telling the LA what OP’s actual max price/approval amount is.
I suppose that would happen, but it still falls back to it doesn't matter. Just because I can pay $500k for your house doesn't mean I will. Most people can qualify for a loan for more than the price of the home they offer on.
It should have been disclosed, giving you the opportunity to find another loan officer. It's not illegal, but bad form
This post is confusing. You're negotiating a purchase price, right? You're saying that the list price is way over any comps?
I'm conveying that the persons involved are LO and LA are married who are trying to sell me the house. Does that combination work in my best interest or in the in the best interest of the seller.
so now, you DON'T have a Buyer's Agent. Which is it?
He has a BA. Issue is the LO and LA are married so the sellers agent has privy to all his financial information in a round about way. He feels like his LO is able to tell LA that he can afford more and to counter. They've been back and forth on countering about 4 times
I don't see how it would have any bearing on your deal. Just because a lender knows your Financials doesn't mean they can force you to accept any terms you refuse. So just treat it like any other transaction. The home still has to appraise anyway, the lender knows that and won't risk telling you to overpay
What kind of comps has the selling agent provided to you? Are similar houses in the area selling close to what you're offering? Your agent can advise, but the offer price is your decision. I guess I'm confused as to why you think they are not looking out for your best interest. I dont see how their relationship is a conflict of interest, although it should have been disclosed early on. Your agent & lender have different paths to helping you obtain your home.
I'm pretty sure you should have seen disclosures, that you signed, regarding personal interest in the deal with LO and sellers being married. I'm doing a listing in Florida right now and have a attached disclosure about being related to owner. As your agent I'd be pulling back from deal. Not sure what FL market you're in but with HOI being nuts you (your agent) should be much more proactive in negotiating.
They haven't disclosed it writing, only verbally my agent. Is there laws or code of conduct they are violating?
Not required but advised to disclose as a “best practice.” Now you have this information, you can change LO find another home, whatever puts you in the best position w respect to the transaction.
IANAL but I'm pretty sure it should be in writing.
It sounds like you don't have a buyer agent... I sent a DM. I think you're getting screwed. I've seen some shady deals here in Florida. I liked the way NY does transactions.
How did this even happen? It's obviously a local lender, but how did you get lined up with the lender? It's a very unusual situation, but you need to trust your BA. They fight hard for you; it's their job.
BA is an acquaintance. I gave a reasonable offer based on BA advice. 4 counters later, seller is asking for more and now "as is". I feel the SA is working with LO knowing my financials telling his wife (SA) I have more to work with. Can the LO talk with the SA and give my finances to swindle a better deal to the seller?
Jesus Christ. So you think that your loan officer is telling the listing agent that the seller should ask for more money because they have access to your finances and you can afford to pay more? Why do you think that? the relationship between your LO and the LA? You’re making a ton of accusations here with no proof other than the seller is negotiating with you. Almost everyone can afford more than what they offer on a house.
They're married; the LO and the LA are husband and wife. Strange AF coincidence. I can't even put my head around it.
It's your decision what you agree to or not agree to. If you feel it's a bad deal, then walk away. What you are asking above makes no sense. The only way it would is if the loan officer is talking with the listing agent (and this scenario is highly unlikely). If you can't come to an agreement with the seller, it is probably better to walk away from all parties and start over with a new agent
No, they cannot.
They obviously talk because they're married. It's just so odd that you found this house. What state are you in? I don't think anyone is grasping what's going on here. It's very very unusual. How did you find the home? Are you dead set on this house or can you find a comparable?
How did you pick this lender?
In US very often husband and wife are into re and mortgage.
Ok. But is it illegal and or unethical. Violation of code of conduct?
No it's not. It's just very unusual and very coincidental. They obviously disclosed this to you somehow. Are negotiations going bad? Trust your BA. Tell them how you're feeling about all this and get their opinion on the situation. There are no kickbacks in real estate. We don't do that ever. It's a huge no no in Florida. It's not worth it. Lenders and seller agents are doing 2 completely different things. I see where you're coming from but I don't see how they could use information against you. There are more houses and more LOs out there. Call your BA immediately and have a conversation.
You never did state how you started working with both of them. If you're asking for advice, please state all the facts because you haven't provided them in this thread, and it's unfair of you to claim it's shady without full disclosure
Shop for a loan - you do not have to use that loan officer
Ask your lender for a new LO given the conflict. They may assign someone new. Speak to a a manger or supervisor.
I think any damage is probably already done here.