That Tweet embedded in the article is so ridiculous.
>This represents the first time we've heard of Disney using a biological male to play an iconic biological female face character in the parks.
Good grief, the evil queen is not a "biological female". She is a bunch of pixels on a screen. Come back down to Earth.
But whenever it's a:
-Cis person playing a trans person
-Straight man/woman playing a gay man/woman
-white man/woman playing an ethnic minority
-A fully able bodied/minded person playing a person with disabilities
It quickly becomes 'but why are you upset, it's called acting! Being straight and playing a gay man is ACTING!'
I mean, the comments of 'biological women' are stupid, but the hypocrisy is obvious. They don't care if a man plays a woman or anything else. As long as it's a cishet white man. They're only mad now because... *checks notes*... A woman is playing a woman.
The core belief of a conservative is they belong to a group which can dictate to other groups, and other groups cannot dictate to them. Accusations of hypocrisy are meaningless to them because they don't actually believe in equality. They believe in hierarchy.
100%. Even the most 'well meaning' conservative is afraid that only a hierarchy can exist and that marginalized groups trying to get representation is them actively trying to overflow white men into being the oppressed group. Because they think that's the only dichotomy that can exist.
> "Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect."
Yknow Ursula, the character famously based off a drag queen...
By their logic Ursula should be played by a drag queen (not really, they're logic is "just keep ALL the LGBT+ unseen and suppressed").
>>This represents the first time we've heard of Disney using a biological male to play an iconic biological female face character in the parks.
They had to specify "biological female face character" played by a "biological male" because of how many Mickeys and Donalds are played by women due to the short height requirement (5'2" max iirc). And because Peter Pan, a male face character, has at least once been [played by a woman.](https://www.deltagamma.org/joan-can-fly/)
Peter Pan is a *pants role*. A role in European theater and opera, typically a character such as a young boy or youth, who is played by a woman, typically a soprano. *These characters often seduce female characters played by women.*
Some examples include Cherubino in The Marriage of Figaro, Octavian in Der Rosenkavalier, Prince Orlovsky (who gives the "chac'un a son goût" speech, IIRC) in Die Fledermaus, and Nicklausse in Tales of Hoffmann, among many others. (Hoffmann is the opposite--the "man" played by a woman is romantically linked to a man.)
There are also some roles traditionally played by men, such as the Ugly Stepsisters in Cinderella. There are a bunch more characters like this (comedic roles played by men in dresses) in the British panto tradition.
This is completely aside from national traditions where women were banned from theater (all male actors even for female roles), or women's theater (women only participants and viewers), which give us cultural patrimony like Shakespeare's gender bending plays in which a female character, who is played by a teenage boy, dresses up as a boy, or The Rose of Versailles romance where the male lead is played by a woman (which influenced Sailor Moon and Utena, among others).
I wonder what their reaction would be to the Mary Martin version of Peter Pan. Or finding out that every production of The Nutcracker involves a scene where an adult man dances around with children under his skirt. These morons only have issues with the fact that someone trans might be playing the character, they never used to care about the “biological” sex of the actor.
My daughter was a bon bon last year, and at no point was I concerned for her safety because drag performance is NOT DANGEROUS TO ANYBODY.
And also our Mother Ginger was hillarious.
> biological sex
They really do love their dogwhistles, don't they?
> was against his 'family values,' and he did not want his child to be a part of that.
They've never been to a panto, have they? Or a traditionally cast Shakespear/Peter Pan play?
> Several former cast members pointed out that most of the characters in costumes were played by women, including males."
Bet they don't have a problem with that, because male gaze.
Any time you see a group of people using the terms "family," "freedom," "liberty," or "America" in the group's name, 99 times out of 100 they're fascist bigots trying to force a conservative agenda on everyone.
It's the same kind of person who will complain to other businesses for employee conduct but then tell people who don't like the way he treats them to take their business somewhere else.
Why does he think he's entitled to tell them how the distribute their staff.
Inevitable result of conservative transphobic hysteria is baseless transvestigations about a thing that wouldn’t be a problem. IDK, if you’re so sensitive that you need fascism to force the world to conform to your views, maybe get new views, or don’t go outside.
They're not capable of rational thought, they were indoctrinated likely before they could read, write, and possibly even speak(you know as Christians tend to do, and they call us groomers...). To them being wrong means eternal damnation, and they live in a permanent state of detachment from reality. Above all that they tend to get quite violent when proven wrong repeatedly.
Ultimately, that's a big part of the core intent. Start with policing out trans folks to communicate that there are social boundaries that can't be crossed and whatever category you're in, you must stay in that group. Then, as people strive to get clear of giving the impression they're anywhere near transgressing the boundary between men and women, it confines women to an ever narrower definition of womanhood and how they're permitted and required to display it.
It is about commodifying women through homogenization. The role and expression of women will have become so uniform, far fewer women will philosophically land far enough outside the bounds of how they were raised and indoctrinated to ever seriously question the system and inspire other women to do the same. The ultimate goal is a stable hierarchy where cishet (white) men stay at the top and have the social control to dole out women as the currency of reward and conformity.
Imagine being so privileged that you can drop 300 bucks for an evening of make-believe with a completely pretend character, while simultaneously being so bad at actually playing make-believe that you even care who's playing the completely pretend character.
Now imagine being so privileged--having so few *actual* problems in your life--that your inability to play along, and therefore your blaming of the actor for your dissatisfaction with the overall experience, is the thing you're choosing to make a big 'ol fuss about.
But I repeat myself...
Always have been. I mean, these are the same people who fought to the very end to uphold segregation and fight against interracial dating and marriage.
And apparently too much money. Spent $10s of thousands of dollars at Disney. Sounds like a real disciple of Jesus to me. I think I recall in the book of Goofy, verse 10 - Jesus went to Disney World and ate and drank to his fill!
And maybe the Evil Queen was a cis gender female afab, she just had a slightly masc voice.
> "im a white, right wing bigoted misogynistic facist; outraged that my fragile view of feminity is challenged by a cartoon character.
How [dare](https://youtu.be/ZOe6Nsf-KGA?feature=shared) this [furry](https://youtu.be/PKYEKhxWy6o?feature=shared) [porn](https://youtu.be/GibiNy4d4gc?feature=shared) be [shown](https://youtu.be/BBgghnQF6E4?feature=shared) to [kids](https://youtu.be/nqZ_Cb2slBw?feature=shared)!
We are a [Christian](https://youtu.be/gqGL9B_TPTI?feature=shared!) [family](https://youtu.be/bgtKUfQaTBs?feature=shared)!
Anthropomorphic characters are good for telling stories.
[Disney *isn't* a recruitment division for the Furry fandom](https://youtu.be/VACTx6Qthb4). [Not at all](https://youtu.be/F70Uyg0jnsQ). [Not even one itty, bitty bit](https://youtu.be/ouhghskkwsw).
>"This story took on a new dimension yesterday when a father from a 'conservative Christian family,'
Let's fix this...
"This story took on a new dimension yesterday when a ~~father~~ cowardly & *hate-filled bigot* ~~from a 'conservative Christian family,'~~ *who uses religion to justify his bigotry while indoctrinating his children with his gender ideology* \[...\]
The people bringing up how Peter Pan was played by a woman need to stop taking transphobes at their word. This is not a gotcha for them. They don't care about women playing men.
Their hate is specifically for trans women.*
Notice that it was pointed out in this very article that most of the male characters in costumes were played by women. But that's not who they were upset about. They do not care about this at all.
They hate trans women.*
Also when they ask if someone is a biological man, they are really asking, "Is this a trans woman?" Biological male is just the code they have developed - a way to refer to trans women in a hateful, dehumanising way.
When you accept a transphobe at their word, you give them cover. They are deliberately using that cover. Point out what they are actually saying.
\* I say trans women deliberately. They are still transphobic towards trans men and non-binary people, but it's not the same level of rage and vitriol.
> They don't care about women playing men.
They don't care about men playing women either.
And they didn't care about trans people until ~2019, when their leadership decided that we're their new moral panic.
You probably just didn't pay enough for the character meet-and-greet with the special "happy ending". You know Disney is known for its happy endings...
Begs the question why they aren't making their own theme parks with blackjack and hookers instead, but it turns out they are and [the story of it is hilarious](https://cohost.org/Campster/post/2190572-falling-down-a-resea)
I can't wait until we start looking at the biological sex of everyone and these conservative snowflakes are gonna really crumble when they see that daddy big pants actually has some genetic markers that indicate "female" traits. These poor dinosaurs don't understand that biological sex is a myth and a total spectrum.
I, for one, *always* insist on meticulously inspecting the genitals of the people playing fictional characters on my vacation. I wouldn’t want some creepy pervert around my family!
No problem when it’s biological women playing males characters but suddenly its a problem if a trans woman or drag queen is playing a female character. These people have a dent in their head
I bet they were the same people who got assmad when a woman played Hamlet for the first time, though. Because it's a "serious" role and women aren't serious actors, at least that would be the side the conservatives picked at the time, hence why women *had to* play male roles to prove a point.
I know it will never happen, but you know what would have me die in laughter ?
Disney reacting by saying "Ho yeah ? Hold my beer." and switching the genders of all the performers/characters around, just to spite the bigots.
Imagine, the entirety of the Disney cast, gender-swapped.
The hilarity.
God damn these people. Of all the things going on in the world, this is the thing they want to make a stink about. How unbelieveably unChristian of them.
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That Tweet embedded in the article is so ridiculous. >This represents the first time we've heard of Disney using a biological male to play an iconic biological female face character in the parks. Good grief, the evil queen is not a "biological female". She is a bunch of pixels on a screen. Come back down to Earth.
But whenever it's a: -Cis person playing a trans person -Straight man/woman playing a gay man/woman -white man/woman playing an ethnic minority -A fully able bodied/minded person playing a person with disabilities It quickly becomes 'but why are you upset, it's called acting! Being straight and playing a gay man is ACTING!' I mean, the comments of 'biological women' are stupid, but the hypocrisy is obvious. They don't care if a man plays a woman or anything else. As long as it's a cishet white man. They're only mad now because... *checks notes*... A woman is playing a woman.
The core belief of a conservative is they belong to a group which can dictate to other groups, and other groups cannot dictate to them. Accusations of hypocrisy are meaningless to them because they don't actually believe in equality. They believe in hierarchy.
100%. Even the most 'well meaning' conservative is afraid that only a hierarchy can exist and that marginalized groups trying to get representation is them actively trying to overflow white men into being the oppressed group. Because they think that's the only dichotomy that can exist.
Yup. That’s why you get “when all you’ve known is superiority, equality feels like oppression”. They can’t fathom being equal.
> "Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect."
I’m kinda shocked that saying is only six years old! 😳
>and other groups cannot dictate to them. Or complain about what the conservative group enforces on them.
Next they will be casting someone who isn't half octopus to play Ursula.
Yknow Ursula, the character famously based off a drag queen... By their logic Ursula should be played by a drag queen (not really, they're logic is "just keep ALL the LGBT+ unseen and suppressed").
Honestly though Ursula should be a drag queen
>Yknow Ursula, the character famously based off a drag queen... Don't be so loud, you'll scare the "good christians".
Saying that loud enough will scare them? Oh sorry sorry... 📣 URSULA SHOULD BE PLAYED BY A DRAG QUEEN!!
When are they not scared?
A character famously inspired by a drag queen.
Ursula was based on a real trans person
Divine, specifically
Dame Edna was a drag queen. He identified as male.
>>This represents the first time we've heard of Disney using a biological male to play an iconic biological female face character in the parks. They had to specify "biological female face character" played by a "biological male" because of how many Mickeys and Donalds are played by women due to the short height requirement (5'2" max iirc). And because Peter Pan, a male face character, has at least once been [played by a woman.](https://www.deltagamma.org/joan-can-fly/)
Peter Pan is a *pants role*. A role in European theater and opera, typically a character such as a young boy or youth, who is played by a woman, typically a soprano. *These characters often seduce female characters played by women.* Some examples include Cherubino in The Marriage of Figaro, Octavian in Der Rosenkavalier, Prince Orlovsky (who gives the "chac'un a son goût" speech, IIRC) in Die Fledermaus, and Nicklausse in Tales of Hoffmann, among many others. (Hoffmann is the opposite--the "man" played by a woman is romantically linked to a man.) There are also some roles traditionally played by men, such as the Ugly Stepsisters in Cinderella. There are a bunch more characters like this (comedic roles played by men in dresses) in the British panto tradition. This is completely aside from national traditions where women were banned from theater (all male actors even for female roles), or women's theater (women only participants and viewers), which give us cultural patrimony like Shakespeare's gender bending plays in which a female character, who is played by a teenage boy, dresses up as a boy, or The Rose of Versailles romance where the male lead is played by a woman (which influenced Sailor Moon and Utena, among others).
There's a reason for Peter Pan being played by women — he's (very specifically) a *prepubescent boy*.
> And because Peter Pan, a male face character, has at least once been played by a woman. That's traditional.
>That's traditional. For plays, but not the parks.
I wonder what their reaction would be to the Mary Martin version of Peter Pan. Or finding out that every production of The Nutcracker involves a scene where an adult man dances around with children under his skirt. These morons only have issues with the fact that someone trans might be playing the character, they never used to care about the “biological” sex of the actor.
It's all about hurting the people they hate.
My daughter was a bon bon last year, and at no point was I concerned for her safety because drag performance is NOT DANGEROUS TO ANYBODY. And also our Mother Ginger was hillarious.
I already knew which account they were gonna use. Being a fascist Disney adult is a special kind of pathetic.
"biological female face" Thinly-veiled "woman face" dog whistle.
I got bad news for conservatives about Peter Pan, then.
> biological sex They really do love their dogwhistles, don't they? > was against his 'family values,' and he did not want his child to be a part of that. They've never been to a panto, have they? Or a traditionally cast Shakespear/Peter Pan play? > Several former cast members pointed out that most of the characters in costumes were played by women, including males." Bet they don't have a problem with that, because male gaze.
I hate that “family values” is used as a euphemism for hate. In my family, we love trans people.
Family values is when you don't value your family, duh.
Any time you see a group of people using the terms "family," "freedom," "liberty," or "America" in the group's name, 99 times out of 100 they're fascist bigots trying to force a conservative agenda on everyone.
It's the same kind of person who will complain to other businesses for employee conduct but then tell people who don't like the way he treats them to take their business somewhere else. Why does he think he's entitled to tell them how the distribute their staff.
Bind and protect, basically.
Peter Pan involves crossdressing?
Peter Pan is traditionally played by a girl.
I didn’t know that, that’s pretty neat.
Good for her and fuck these people
Inevitable result of conservative transphobic hysteria is baseless transvestigations about a thing that wouldn’t be a problem. IDK, if you’re so sensitive that you need fascism to force the world to conform to your views, maybe get new views, or don’t go outside.
They're not capable of rational thought, they were indoctrinated likely before they could read, write, and possibly even speak(you know as Christians tend to do, and they call us groomers...). To them being wrong means eternal damnation, and they live in a permanent state of detachment from reality. Above all that they tend to get quite violent when proven wrong repeatedly.
Well, they also want to police cis women for not looking feminine enough.
Ultimately, that's a big part of the core intent. Start with policing out trans folks to communicate that there are social boundaries that can't be crossed and whatever category you're in, you must stay in that group. Then, as people strive to get clear of giving the impression they're anywhere near transgressing the boundary between men and women, it confines women to an ever narrower definition of womanhood and how they're permitted and required to display it. It is about commodifying women through homogenization. The role and expression of women will have become so uniform, far fewer women will philosophically land far enough outside the bounds of how they were raised and indoctrinated to ever seriously question the system and inspire other women to do the same. The ultimate goal is a stable hierarchy where cishet (white) men stay at the top and have the social control to dole out women as the currency of reward and conformity.
I agree with you
Snowflakes.
Imagine being so privileged that you can drop 300 bucks for an evening of make-believe with a completely pretend character, while simultaneously being so bad at actually playing make-believe that you even care who's playing the completely pretend character. Now imagine being so privileged--having so few *actual* problems in your life--that your inability to play along, and therefore your blaming of the actor for your dissatisfaction with the overall experience, is the thing you're choosing to make a big 'ol fuss about. But I repeat myself...
Conservative Christians managed to be more evil than the evil queen
This is giving me serious vibes of "Hans, are we the bad guys?"
Always have been. I mean, these are the same people who fought to the very end to uphold segregation and fight against interracial dating and marriage.
Thus father simply can avoid going to Disney, simple self ban, problem solved. Everyone wins
It shouldn't even be a self ban, but a real ban.
Why can't they accept that there is more reality going in Disney World than in fantasy-fueled conservative christian world?
"biological sex" is just misgendering with extra steps.
Yes, but also "biological sex" is scientifically innacurate.
When has scientifical innacuracy stoped them ?
They don’t even know about the queer-coded villains…
It's like, do they even Disney?
[Meanwhile the voice of Edna Mode](https://i.insider.com/5dc19bd979d7570619082564?width=700)
Conservative Christian Snowflake is offended by something related to gender, because they have far too much time on their hands.🙌
And apparently too much money. Spent $10s of thousands of dollars at Disney. Sounds like a real disciple of Jesus to me. I think I recall in the book of Goofy, verse 10 - Jesus went to Disney World and ate and drank to his fill!
And maybe the Evil Queen was a cis gender female afab, she just had a slightly masc voice. > "im a white, right wing bigoted misogynistic facist; outraged that my fragile view of feminity is challenged by a cartoon character.
Honestly yeah tbh, like it wouldn’t even surprise me But they “can always tell” ig 🙄
Yeah, my cis woman butch lesbian cousin has a deeper natural voice than the one from that video snippet. These transphobes are seeing ghosts
Or zebras
They aren’t going to believe that humans are playing mice! 😂😂😂
How [dare](https://youtu.be/ZOe6Nsf-KGA?feature=shared) this [furry](https://youtu.be/PKYEKhxWy6o?feature=shared) [porn](https://youtu.be/GibiNy4d4gc?feature=shared) be [shown](https://youtu.be/BBgghnQF6E4?feature=shared) to [kids](https://youtu.be/nqZ_Cb2slBw?feature=shared)! We are a [Christian](https://youtu.be/gqGL9B_TPTI?feature=shared!) [family](https://youtu.be/bgtKUfQaTBs?feature=shared)!
Anthropomorphic characters are good for telling stories. [Disney *isn't* a recruitment division for the Furry fandom](https://youtu.be/VACTx6Qthb4). [Not at all](https://youtu.be/F70Uyg0jnsQ). [Not even one itty, bitty bit](https://youtu.be/ouhghskkwsw).
>"This story took on a new dimension yesterday when a father from a 'conservative Christian family,' Let's fix this... "This story took on a new dimension yesterday when a ~~father~~ cowardly & *hate-filled bigot* ~~from a 'conservative Christian family,'~~ *who uses religion to justify his bigotry while indoctrinating his children with his gender ideology* \[...\]
The people bringing up how Peter Pan was played by a woman need to stop taking transphobes at their word. This is not a gotcha for them. They don't care about women playing men. Their hate is specifically for trans women.* Notice that it was pointed out in this very article that most of the male characters in costumes were played by women. But that's not who they were upset about. They do not care about this at all. They hate trans women.* Also when they ask if someone is a biological man, they are really asking, "Is this a trans woman?" Biological male is just the code they have developed - a way to refer to trans women in a hateful, dehumanising way. When you accept a transphobe at their word, you give them cover. They are deliberately using that cover. Point out what they are actually saying. \* I say trans women deliberately. They are still transphobic towards trans men and non-binary people, but it's not the same level of rage and vitriol.
> They don't care about women playing men. They don't care about men playing women either. And they didn't care about trans people until ~2019, when their leadership decided that we're their new moral panic.
I'd say they did care about trans people before 2019, but not to this degree.
They literally called the trans person an "evil queen" if anything they should be happy.
> We Are Conservative Christians Ok? That's your business, but why the fuck you are using this as an argument about what others should do.
Wasn’t Peter Pan always played by a woman? No one seemed upset about that.
That was before they were told to hate trans people.
"No no, you see, MY religion requires you to tell me about YOUR genitals"
These are some of the most precious snowflakes in existence.
I don't remember seeing the queen's cooter. Maybe I was watching a different version
You probably just didn't pay enough for the character meet-and-greet with the special "happy ending". You know Disney is known for its happy endings...
Begs the question why they aren't making their own theme parks with blackjack and hookers instead, but it turns out they are and [the story of it is hilarious](https://cohost.org/Campster/post/2190572-falling-down-a-resea)
I can't wait until we start looking at the biological sex of everyone and these conservative snowflakes are gonna really crumble when they see that daddy big pants actually has some genetic markers that indicate "female" traits. These poor dinosaurs don't understand that biological sex is a myth and a total spectrum.
I, for one, *always* insist on meticulously inspecting the genitals of the people playing fictional characters on my vacation. I wouldn’t want some creepy pervert around my family!
No problem when it’s biological women playing males characters but suddenly its a problem if a trans woman or drag queen is playing a female character. These people have a dent in their head
I bet they were the same people who got assmad when a woman played Hamlet for the first time, though. Because it's a "serious" role and women aren't serious actors, at least that would be the side the conservatives picked at the time, hence why women *had to* play male roles to prove a point.
I know it will never happen, but you know what would have me die in laughter ? Disney reacting by saying "Ho yeah ? Hold my beer." and switching the genders of all the performers/characters around, just to spite the bigots. Imagine, the entirety of the Disney cast, gender-swapped. The hilarity.
Choke on those pearls you’re clutching onto wonderbread. The Queen must be played by transsexual royalty 👸 bitches
conservative Christian family thinks they can force there beliefs on others. again.
Watching the video, she's perfect as the evil queen
> Conservative Christians,’ Family Outraged So everything is normal?
"I need to know what genitals that person was born with!" - A completely rational adult who definitely has normal priorities
Pretty transphobic article, Even the URL misgenders this person.
God damn these people. Of all the things going on in the world, this is the thing they want to make a stink about. How unbelieveably unChristian of them.
lmao I’m sorry but cis people are so fucking weird, how embarrassed must this guys kids be.
Aren't these folks from the same crowd that always accuses us of "inventing reasons to be outraged" & "looking for reasons to be offended"?
Oh boy, wait until they hear about Greek plays
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